Toyota-Mods Postings Jan 1994

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^ ^^^ ^^^ _______ ^^^ ^^^ ,' - _ ^^^ ^^^ ________,'__________>>> - _ ^ ^^^ ^^^ , ' | ^^^ ^^^ ~I~ I~I \ / I~I ~I~ .~. _ I\/I I~I I~\ <~ ^^^ ^^^ I I_I | I_I I I~I I I I_I I_/ _> ^^^ ^^^ `---\__/----------------\__/----' ^^^ ^^^ ^^^ ^^^ P O S T I N G S Jan 1994 ^^^ ^^^ --------------------------- ^^^ ^^^ ^^^ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Sat, 1 Jan 94 12:25:30 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: New Member! Here we are in a new year, with a new member, Allan Chen! Welcome aboard, Allan. >>>>>Allan Chen<<<<< Name : Allan C.W. Chen Location : Mountain View, CA Model : 1987 Corolla GT-S (last of the rear-wheel drive Corollas) Engine : I think it's a 4A-G 1.6 liter twin-cam Mods : HKS stainless steel exhaust system, Eibach progressive rate springs with Tokico Iluminas on all four corners (had TRD race [blue] springs and shocks). K&N air filter, TRD spark plug wires. email : allanc@sgi.com >>>>><<<<< xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com Date: Sat, 1 Jan 94 11:30:31 EST To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: PCV Valve Gary asked (last week) when to change the PCV valve. Well, to check the PCV valve, blow through it, first one way then the other. It should free-flow in one direction, and stop in the other. What happens is that as PCV valves age, carbon and crud build up in them and they don't close properly. As far as when to change them, if you just take it out and clean it with a little carb cleaner every time you change the oil, it will likely last the life of the car. If you are super performance conscious, change it whenever it doesn't check out quite right. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com Date: Sat, 1 Jan 94 11:38:49 EST To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: mosaic server > Hi all, > I have internet access through OSU which I access with a modem. As I > understand it I'm supposed to install it on the University machine and go from > there. Unfortunately this is a 2.5meg file, compressed. My account has a 2.5 > meg total limit. The server sounds like a wonderful idea, but space > constraints could be a problem for some of us. If I have any of this > instalation stuff wrong or anybody knows a way for me to get around this > please let me know. Joe: Actually, this mosaic server idea is _precisely_ for folks in your situation. What needs to happen is OSU needs to install Mosaic on the system for _everyone_ to use, as opposed to you having to put it on your file space. Actually, I would be sorta surprised if the SysAdmin-types there at OSU hadn't already either put Mosaic on the system or considered it. Are you in a situation where you can call them and ask? (BTW, the Mosaic Binary takes up 2.5 MB, and is compiled so that it doesn't require your machine to have the Motif Libraries.) The reason Mosaic would work so well is that you wouldn't have to archive the various information that you get off the toyota-mods list. Instead, you can just look it up on the Mosaic Server whenever you need it. Good Luck, Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 09:44:47 EST From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Rebuild of Master Cylinder > Ummm, how much does a rebuild kit cost compared to a new master > cylinder? New MC's are a fairly high-volume item for the rebuilders, > and are usually not _that_ much more than the rebuild kit. Just a > thought. > Chris A rebuilt master cylinder is about $100 from the dealer, versus the $38 I spent for an O/H kit mail-order from Russel Toyota. Mail order places generally don't sell rebuilt parts, I suppose because of the hassle of mailing the core back, so the price for a *new* master cylinder from Russel would be quite high. But, in my mind, rebuilding the master cylinder is the fun part, at least compared to the drudgery of RE&REing the master cylinder and bleeding the brakes at all four wheels. Jon xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 14:31:50 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Rambling... Well, I thought I'd say happy New Year and let folks know what is up here at Toyota-Mods land. I just got the Master Catalog from TRD (Retail only.) As you may know, TRD no longer charges for their catalog. Instead, they send only a 3-page sheet with all of the parts available for your particular chassis. If you call them with your chassis type, they will send you the catalog "sheet" for your car. Gone is the extensive info and how-to we used to get from them. If you have and old TRD catalog with this info, keep it. It will become valuable to those of us who need that type of info. Another quick plug for the Toyota-Mods server: I hope to enter all of the info from the TRD catalogs into the computer and provide it as a service of the TM Mosaic Server. (We can email it to anyone who doesn't have 'net access and wants the info.) Racing ====== I have been lax on keeping the group up to date on my racing efforts, but I have not been lazy on that subject. I raced about two months ago and did pathetically, despite a 2nd place start. Bottom line: I simply didn't have the suspension ready on this new ('81) car. I thought I could be competitive with a stock setup, but I was mistaken. I had the car weighed and did some minor modifications. After moving the battery behind the drivers seat, pulling the spacer out of the RR spring, and removing the spacer and cranking down on the RF sway bar connection, I have 54% left side weight, 43% rear weight, and 51% diagonal (or "wedge.") Note that "wedge" is a circle track concept, which I was able to induce by the modifications to the RR spring and RF sway bar. In road racing you want 50/53/50 or so, but in circle track you want about 55/53/53 (depending on the car and driving conditions.) Obviously, I am still too nose heavy, but this is better than the sub-50% wedge I had before. My next race proved it: 5th place without really trying too hard. 3 weeks later we raced again...in a fairly hard rain. I was doing quite well, until the car died. They do that when they run out of gas and the battery is dead. (*STUPID*) Anyway, I now know to check the gas, even when I think it is OK. Evidently, the 3 gallons that I put in 2 weeks earlier had either evaporated or been removed. I made a dipstick and will _always_ check my gas prior to racing, even if I _just_ put gas in. (Keeps ME from looking like a dipstick!) The battery problem? Well, if you don't have a fuse in the "engine" fuse slot, the alternator won't charge the battery. Since I didn't have _any_ fuses in the fuse box, the battery finally (after about 6 races) went dead. I really expect the car to perform better with a good, strong spark. (DUH!) Current efforts? First, I built adjustable camber lower control arms. Pay attention here, Celica and Corolla owners! I wanted about 3.5 degrees of negative camber in my RF, and about 1.5 degree of positive camber in my RF wheel. TRD sells a longer LCA, for a cool $178 each, and these are fixed length. I could always take my stock LCA's, cut 'em and weld in some square steel tubing and make them whatever length I wanted. But get this concept: I took two 7/8" coupler nuts (about 3" long) and a piece of threaded, hardened 7/8" rod. I did a little engineering, welded the nuts into the LCA, did a little hacksaw work and voila, _adjustable_ lower control arms! For about $15 in parts! I made the left so that I could shorten it by up to 1.5" (about 3.5 degrees of positive camber) and the right so that I could add up to about 4.5" (6 degrees of negative camber). Put them back on the car, aligned the left wheel straight, right wheel 3/16" toe out, and the car now even _looks_ fast. If you race and are cons My other major effort was to pull the head (not really that major--takes about 15 minutes when you don't have all of that crap all around the engine) and put stronger valve springs on. Some racing guru friends of mine said that I had all of the classic symptoms of valve float...drastic horsepower loss at high (>5000) rpm. We pulled the springs and, sure enough, they were worn out. I didn't have any other springs handy, so I put a set of Nissan 240Z engine dual springs on. They seem to fit...we'll soon see. I called Koji over the holidays and he mentioned that he's seen them use valve springs from a chevy on the 2xR engine. I'd be real interested in finding out what engine they came from. It would be beautiful to find out that I can use the same springs as a small block chevy. Those things are cheap and easy to get. Anyway, when I get the head back (got a valve job done and had it surfaced a bit while I had it off anyway) I will put it back together, and plan on racing on the 14th of this month (I have National Guard this weekend.) Sorry to ramble so long, but I guess I was having 'net withdrawal symptoms! -- _ ____| \__ '82 4x4 Christopher P. Myer {_^____^_} (cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com) @ @ (407) 725-8742 ___ Melbourne, Florida ____/ ||:. '81 Celica GT <_^___81_^__) @ @ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 12:22:13 PST From: edwang@lsil.com (Ed Wang - 7837) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: M58 engine overheating problem Hi Everyone, Happy New Year! I have the following problem and hope to get some answer/help here. I have an 84 Cressida that has been over heating. I changed thermostat twice, rod radiator twice, checked timing, and checked just about everything else. The engine is still overheating (not seriously), and I am lossing coolant and engine oil slowly also, not obvious leaks. After overheating couple times, all the oil seals began to leak and had been replaced. Now there is a slight oil leak aroung #6 cylinder head gasket area. If any one had any experiency with this I-6 engine overheating problem please advise me to the right direction. Thanks. Edward Wang (408) GEE-STEP Fax: (408) 954-4874 edwang@up171.lsil.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 16:01:25 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem > I have an 84 Cressida that has been over heating. I changed thermostat > twice, rod radiator twice, checked timing, and checked just about everything > else. > Edward Wang (408) GEE-STEP Fax: (408) 954-4874 Ed: About the only thing you haven't mentioned checking is your fuel mixture. An overly lean mixture will overheat an engine quickly. Check your spark plugs. Are they very light brown or even white? This means your fuel mixture is too lean. The best time to check this is when your car is actually running hot. Without changing speed, and while simultaneously pushing in the clutch, turn off the engine and stop safely off the road. Pull the plug. Sometimes an engine that has the proper idle mixture will be off at speed, and vice versa. If fuel mixture is your problem, come back here for possible causes. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 14:15:19 PST From: edwang@lsil.com (Ed Wang - 7837) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem >> I have an 84 Cressida that has been over heating. I changed thermostat >> twice, rod radiator twice, checked timing, and checked just about everything >> else. >> Edward Wang (408) GEE-STEP Fax: (408) 954-4874 > >Ed: > >About the only thing you haven't mentioned checking is your fuel >mixture. An overly lean mixture will overheat an engine quickly. Check >your spark plugs. Are they very light brown or even white? This means >your fuel mixture is too lean. The best time to check this is when your >car is actually running hot. Without changing speed, and while >simultaneously pushing in the clutch, turn off the engine and stop >safely off the road. Pull the plug. Sometimes an engine that has the >proper idle mixture will be off at speed, and vice versa. > >If fuel mixture is your problem, come back here for possible causes. > >Chris > Hi Chris and Jon, It is very likely the cause since last time (two years ago) I did smog check the machanic told me my fuel mixture was too rich to pass idle test. So he charged me $50 to adjust air-flow meter ( a small sealed screw on air filter bow ). I don't think the head was cracked because there is no oil in coolant and non vice versa. The exhaust looked very clear, mostly steam and no oil burnning sign. The radiator air pathway is clean, no blockage. AC is dead due to leakage and is OFF. My questions are: How do I check the fuel-mixture accurately? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ How do I determine the fan clutch is not engaging properly? It's still working but seems not engaging as hard as when it's new. My V6 fan would run faster/stronger when thermostat opens. Also there is another possiblity that the radiator has some kind slow leakage. And possible water pump is slowly leaking, there is track of leaking marks under water pump's axle drain hole. Should the pump be replaced? If there is a way to adjust mixture accurately with just regular tools, like a voltmeter, timing light and such, I would do it and live with slow pump leak. Thanks in advance. Edward Wang (408) GEE-STEP Fax: (408) 954-4874 edwang@up171.lsil.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 17:49:07 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem If a mechanic monkey'd with your air flow meter, that is likely your over-lean problem. I know nothing about how to adjust these, except that the old TRD manual talks about how it is done. Can one of you air-flow meter gurus jump in here and offer some guidance? As far as the water pump...a slow leak is the manufacturers way of telling you to replace that thing _now_. (BTW, same thing is true of a mechanical fuel pump.) If you don't replace it, it will finally fail, presumably at the worst possible time. Fix it immediately. As far as a radiator leak...see if the leaking stops when the water pump is replaced. If you had the radiator cored recently, they should have pressure tested it as well. When your radiator leaks, it is usually easy to spot on a clean radiator because of the rust stains that show up. About your radiator cap...have you replaced this? A weak radiator cap will allow your coolant to boil prematurely. They're fairly cheap, so replace this if it isn't pretty new. Manufacturers recommend replacing it every year. Fan...Probably works or doesn't, but at any rate I wouldn't suspect it to be problematic at this point. Get your air-flow meter fixed, replace the water pump and radiator cap, and I bet your problems will go away. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: GRAHAM@cc1.unt.edu To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Date: Mon, 3 Jan 1994 18:18:40 CST6CDT Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem Ed writes: >And possible water pump is slowly leaking, there is track of leaking >marks under water pump's axle drain hole. Should the pump be >replaced? If I'm understanding you correctly, then the hole you are referring to is what I know as a "weep hole". If you have coolant leaking out the weep hole, even the slightest amount, you should definitely replace the water pump as soon as possible. A seal has worn out, thus the pump bearing is being exposed to the coolant which will eventually cause it to seize. A seized pump could theoretically cause the fan shaft to snap, and in turn send your fan through your radiator. Not fun! I nursed my 76 Corolla along for about 2 months years ago with a failing water pump. I was short on bread, and couldn't afford the replacement, but I felt like I was tempting fate. Who knows how long you could go, but I would go ahead and replace it right away. At the very least, you may avoid getting stranded in rush-hour traffic! Good luck! mike p.s. Isn't this a topic that would be more suited to the Toyota list as opposed to the Toyota-mods list? Just curious... xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 16:36:32 PST From: edwang@lsil.com (Ed Wang - 7837) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem Hi Chris, Thanks for the tip. What might happen when water pump goes. Will it seize? Water pump is even simpler, works or works with leak, than a cap. I have the toyota workshop manual but it didn't say how to adjust air flow meter and stuff. Any gurus please help. Edward Wang (408) GEE-STEP Fax: (408) 954-4874 edwang@up171.lsil.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 3 Jan 94 16:57:48 PST From: wg%pinegv@Riem.Com (Wayne R. Graves) Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Hey Ed, I have had that happen, you find your self someplace too far to tow back home with water pouring out as fast as the pump can pump it, lots of fun, left at the mercy of the local repair shop(Booo!). Fix it NOW! They tell me one should replace the water pump on a celica when they do the timing belt, but I didn't believe them until it happened... Wayne xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (Toyota Modifications List) Subject: Second battery Date: Mon, 03 Jan 94 16:54:02 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com I'm interested in installing a second battery in my 1986 Supra. I'm looking for a location out of the passenger compartment which would be suitable for a motorcycle-sized or bigger battery. I can't find suitable room in the engine compartment. It is so crammed with junk, that there is hardly room for extra relays or shunts. I include all areas that aren't separated from the passengers by a metal bulkhead to be 'passenger compartment.' Ideas? Anyone? Buehler? Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (Toyota Modifications List) Subject: What's a 'Modification?' Date: Mon, 03 Jan 94 16:51:15 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com Recently, I've seen some postings on this list which seem to be more concernced with maintenance than modifications. I'll grant, right away, that the line is somewhat fuzzy between the two. My impression of what this list was originally intended to be was a list for persons to discuss modifying their Toyotas in ways beyond the stock configuration. Repairing a vehicle to get it back to stock wasn't part of the original charter. (I dropped reading the Toyota list because there were too many postings about how to fix the fetzer valve in the 1984 Corolla. If you don't know what a fetzer valve is, don't worry.) So, without trying to censor or censure, I'm wondering if anybody is feeling the same way about this as I am. To be honest, this came about when I realized my postings regarding duct-taping socket extensions together was a little off the charter for the list. The line between maintenance and modification becomes fuzzy in the following question: "The shocks on my 1986 Supra are worn out. I need to get new ones. What brands do you recommend for improving the handling of the car for aggressive street driving?" Although maintenance is mentioned (replacing a worn part), the important part is the question about aftermarket shocks. A clearly mainenance question would be: "The shocks on my 1986 Supra are worn out. Where do I get the best price on replacement stock shocks and who should I have do the work?" Clearly, the second question is very important, but may be better addressed in rec.autos.tech, rec.autos or toyotas@quack... So, I'd like to hear if anybody disagrees (or agrees) with this assessment of the list charter, esp. our esteemed list administrator, please let me know. Dan. (P.S. I recommend Tokico adjustable Illuminas.) xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan" Subject: ADV timing => faster pickup?! To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Date: Tue, 4 Jan 1994 17:57:06 +0800 (WST) Engine in question: 4K-C Coil: 60KV Firepower Plugs: Splitfire No Electronic Ignition Its the first day of the week back on the net after the Christmas/New Year revelries and I find myself having to confirm more info that came from the lips of half drunk car experts Ok, what Ive got goes like this: ADVANCE your timing beyond the book specs (slightly) and you get better pick-up but suffer at the high- end. Rationale: ADVANCING (within certain limits on book specs gives more kick. RETARDING gives better performance at the high end. The book specs give you something around 50-50. On an island 52Km across with few straights you dont really care about top end, pick up is more important. Therefore ADVANCE timing. Any comments? Can someone confirm this? Is this drunken rambling? bentan xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan" Subject: Summary & Results: Plug Gapping with Larger Coil To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Date: Tue, 4 Jan 1994 17:53:51 +0800 (WST) Hi and a Happy New Year to all. Not too long back, I asked about setting gapping in consideration of a larger coil. Heres the technical data of the stuff in question: Car: 79 Corolla KE30 Engine: 4K-C Coil: 60KV Megapower Firepower Plugs: Splitfire Cables: Top Gun Gold Summary of replies: 1. Yes, its right that on upgrading from the stock 12KV coil to a 60KV race coil, the gap of the plugs can be opened wider than the manual specs. 2. Opening the gap wider will give better fuel efficiency and more torque. 3. The exact amount of increase to the gap is rather a black art than a science. ie try and see... Results: Gap increased from 1mm to 1.35mm Fuel economy before: 10.2km/lit Fuel economy after: 11.6km/lit (note: I drive hard, by local norms, so the absolute numbers may not mean much.) Have yet to do timings but 0-100km/h feels faster Psychological? Conclusion: It works. Go for a larger coil if you havent already done so, and then up your gapping to see the effects. Further Questions: Wonder if I should try 1.5mm? 2mm? Hmm... bentan (apologies to those who havent gone metric.) xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 09:14:17 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: What's a 'Modification?' Dan asks if all of the stuff we've been talking about in the TM list is valid for our "charter". Good question. There are two things I try to do as moderator of this list. First is to encourage everyone to get involved and participate in the discussions, whether that be through questions or answers. Secondly, I try to keep the focus on "Toyota Modifications". Admittedly, I have been doing a rather marginal job on the second point. This is because of a few things. First, I myself have put a fair amount of noise in the bandwidth with the discussion of the TM Mosaic server, and all of the spawned discussions from that (alternatives, public dial-up internet, etc.) Secondly, I haven't wanted anyone to feel flamed or chastised for asking a question. Yes, questions about leaking water pumps and OEM replacement of parts do belong on the regular Toyota list. However, as anyone who subscribes to both lists will admit, the regular Toyota list has been fairly dead, and technical questions there are usually answered by someone who is also a member of our list. Most of the discussion over there has been limited to the type of ToyoTrivia that Toyota Mods users don't really care about. (That's why so many of our group have unsubscribed from that one.) Bottom line is that maintenance discussions should be limited to the regular Toyota group, where a member of the TM group can answer your query. This is important, because it allows folks who are interested in maintaining their Toyota (only) to learn about these subject without watering down our membership. Thanks for bringing this up, Dan. -- Christopher P. Myer cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com ================================================================ = ________ ________ ___ ___ ________ ________ ___ = = /__ __// / ___ // \ \\ / // / ___ // /__ __// / \\ = = / // / // / // \ \/ // / // / // / // / /\ \\ = = / // / // / // \ // / // / // / // / //_\ \\ = = / // / //_/ // / // / //_/ // / // / _____\ \\ = =/ // / // / // / // / // / // \ \\ = ================================================================ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 09:23:04 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Summary & Results: Plug Gapping with Larger Coil > Results: > Gap increased from 1mm to 1.35mm > > Fuel economy before: 10.2km/lit > Fuel economy after: 11.6km/lit > > (note: I drive hard, by local norms, so the absolute numbers may not > mean much.) > > Further Questions: > Wonder if I should try 1.5mm? 2mm? Hmm... > > bentan This is the second post this morning on electronics, so I thought I'd through in a couple of things. Saw an ad for an 18vdc battery yesterday. Said that it _must_ be kept separate from the rest of the system, but for ignition it will allow you to go up to .075" gap! (almost 2mm.) Same magazine regularly advertises racing batterys (regular 12 vdc kind.) These start at 10 lbs (about 4.5 KG). Not sure why two bettery's are desireable, but this thing will provide more amperage than the motorcycle battery being considered at a lower weight (and more $$.) Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 09:47:21 EST From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second battery > I'm interested in installing a second battery in my 1986 Supra. I'm > looking for a location out of the passenger compartment which would be > suitable for a motorcycle-sized or bigger battery. I can't find > suitable room in the engine compartment. It is so crammed with junk, > that there is hardly room for extra relays or shunts. > > I include all areas that aren't separated from the passengers by a > metal bulkhead to be 'passenger compartment.' Several places come to mind, although none are very satisfactory. 1) Behind the front grill there is a fairly large gap in front of the radiator/condenser where things like the a/c fan and receiver/dryer are stuffed. You could mount a small battery there. I mounted my car alarm in there and it is fairly well protected from the elements if you put it behind the large cross beam. 2) There is space behind the plastic fender liners in the front fenders. This is really miserable to get at though. 3) There are odd spaces around the gas tank under the car. Probably too small for a battery though. 4) Passenger side rear fender underneath the storage box (ie where the rear washer reservoir is located). This probably violates your 'not in the passenger compartment' requirement although there is a lot of metal around there. 5) Inside the air intake plenum where the wiper mechanism is located. Miserable access and may be too small for a battery. Jon xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 10:02:56 EST From: fergusos@jeff-lab.QueensU.CA (Ferguson Stephen) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: charter (+ a mod. question) Hi, I agree that the discussion should be centred on Toyota mods. The reason I signed up to this list was to get answers on a specific area. Rec.autos.tech is full of maintenance questions and the answers are almost always prompt, so I don't think there would be any lack of Toyota maintenance info available there. Thanks to everyone who answered my query about putting the MR-2 engine in a RWD Corolla GT-S (especially the guy with the 4A-G motor in a Starlet... interesting concept). For anyone interested, I'll summarize the advice: I was sitting at a traffic light one day admiring the Supercharged MR-2 next to me when that little light went on in my head (the one that usually indicates large amounts of money are about to be spent!). I figured grabbing a blower from a junkyard and installing it on the 4AG engine in my car would be fairly effortless so I asked the group about it. Well, it would be more trouble than it is worth, short of exchanging the whole engine. As I knew, I would have to lower the CR of my engine, but by a margin of about 3 to 1, people also felt that the bottom end of the block had been strengthened for used in the MR-2 (and Formula Atlantic). Then there would be the associated wiring harness and ECU, plus possible intake and exhaust modifications. So, I'm back to where I was. So far all I've done is open up the exhaust with 2" pipe from the cat. back to a low restriction muffler (no brand name... fabricated by a guy up here who preps. rally cars). I'd like to free up the intake side, but can`t find a K&N filter at any performance shops here. Does K&N make one for the RWD Corolla GT-S (4AG-E engine)? Where could I order it from? Any other brands (besides something extremely $$$ like HKS's intake). Stephen xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 07:58:29 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: charter (+ a mod. question) Stephen wrote: > > I'd like to free up the intake side, but can`t find a K&N filter > at any performance shops here. Does K&N make one for the RWD Corolla > GT-S (4AG-E engine)? Where could I order it from? Any other brands > (besides something extremely $$$ like HKS's intake). > If K&N does not list a filter for your car, try this: Take your stock filter to a speed shop, ask them to measure the height, diameter etc.... They sometimes can match a replacement that way. Good luck Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 1994 11:36:37 -0500 From: John Red-Horse To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem Ed, It sounds as though you've got a handle on this, but here's one more possibility: a leaking head gasket. Of course there is more than one way for it to fail, but one of them is a strip of gasket between a water port and a combustion chamber. I'm pretty sure that you can detect this with either a pressure test, or by checking for the presence of hydrocarbons in your coolant. cheers, john xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 08:33:45 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com, btptan@solomon.technet.sg Subject: Re: Summary & Results: Plug Gapping with Larger Coil Benjamin T.P. Tan wrote : > > Hi and a Happy New Year to all. > > Not too long back, I asked about setting gapping in consideration of > a larger coil. Heres the technical data of the stuff in question: > > Car: 79 Corolla KE30 > Engine: 4K-C > Coil: 60KV Megapower Firepower > Plugs: Splitfire > Cables: Top Gun Gold > > Summary of replies: > 1. Yes, its right that on upgrading from the stock 12KV coil to a > 60KV race coil, the gap of the plugs can be opened wider than the > manual specs. > > 2. Opening the gap wider will give better fuel efficiency and more > torque. > > 3. The exact amount of increase to the gap is rather a black art than > a science. ie try and see... > > Results: > Gap increased from 1mm to 1.35mm > > Fuel economy before: 10.2km/lit > Fuel economy after: 11.6km/lit > > (note: I drive hard, by local norms, so the absolute numbers may not > mean much.) > > Have yet to do timings but 0-100km/h feels faster Psychological? > > Conclusion: > It works. Go for a larger coil if you havent already done so, and > then up your gapping to see the effects. One point to note about ignition coils is that it's the intensity of the spark (i.e. Amps) that counts. The more Amps the better. For most application, 20KV is all it takes to jump the spark plug gap but w/ a high curent coil the spark will be hotter. Don't be fooled by the voltage advertisement, ask to see the current rating. As for spark plug gaps, this is really a trail and error exercise if you don't have access to a dyno machine. You can increase spark plug gap size 1/10th of an inch at a time and test drive the car. From what I've read with gaps wider than .050"" you will actually lose power because the spark won't be as hot. In my case, I use an Accel Super coil, 8mm wires, regular autolite plugs gap to .045""(stock is .035""). I can feel a bit more power, truck is more responsive and my plugs are cleaner. On cold starts, I used to have to keep my foot on the gas pedal to keep the rpm higher than normal so it won't die ( I have a manual choke carb). I don't have to do that no more. As for fuel economy, I gave up checking a long time ago cause my Scout averages around 11mpg wether going uphill fully loaded or going downhill w/ a tail wind. Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 08:36:42 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: ADV timing => faster pickup?! > > Its the first day of the week back on the net after the > Christmas/New Year revelries and I find myself having to confirm more > info that came from the lips of half drunk car experts > > Ok, what Ive got goes like this: ADVANCE your timing beyond the book > specs (slightly) and you get better pick-up but suffer at the high- > end. > > Rationale: ADVANCING (within certain limits on book specs gives > more kick. RETARDING gives better performance at the high end. The > book specs give you something around 50-50. On an island 52Km across > with few straights you dont really care about top end, pick up is > more important. Therefore ADVANCE timing. > > > > Any comments? Can someone confirm this? Is this drunken rambling? > > bentan > Yes, yes advance the timing! This is real cheap power gain. But make absolute sure you are not pinging. Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 09:09:11 PST From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: ADV timing => faster pickup?! Bentan sez: }> Rationale: ADVANCING (within certain limits on book specs gives }> more kick. RETARDING gives better performance at the high end. The }> book specs give you something around 50-50. On an island 52Km across }> with few straights you dont really care about top end, pick up is }> more important. Therefore ADVANCE timing. }> }> Any comments? Can someone confirm this? Is this drunken rambling? Louis sez: }Yes, yes advance the timing! This is real cheap power gain. But make absolute }sure you are not pinging. I sez: According to the sparkplug section in the Chilton manuals (for whatever *that* is worth), advancing timing results in negligible power gain but a higher plug temperature and basically advises against advancing timing beyond mfr specs. Well, in my own experience on two of my cars, advancing timing by as little as 1-2degrees makes a BIG difference in pickup, esp. on my carb'ed beater Dodge Colt. The plugs look fine otherwise. How far advanced can one reasonably take it? Do you just advance it until it just starts to ping? aaron xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 10:21:48 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: ADV timing => faster pickup?! > From lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com Tue Jan 4 09:33:11 1994 > Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 09:09:11 PST > From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) > To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com > Subject: Re: ADV timing => faster pickup?! > Content-Length: 1082 > > Bentan sez: > > }> Rationale: ADVANCING (within certain limits on book specs gives > }> more kick. RETARDING gives better performance at the high end. The > }> book specs give you something around 50-50. On an island 52Km across > }> with few straights you dont really care about top end, pick up is > }> more important. Therefore ADVANCE timing. > }> > }> Any comments? Can someone confirm this? Is this drunken rambling? > > Louis sez: > > }Yes, yes advance the timing! This is real cheap power gain. But make absolute > }sure you are not pinging. > > I sez: > > According to the sparkplug section in the Chilton manuals (for > whatever *that* is worth), advancing timing results in negligible > power gain but a higher plug temperature and basically advises against > advancing timing beyond mfr specs. > > Well, in my own experience on two of my cars, advancing timing by as > little as 1-2degrees makes a BIG difference in pickup, esp. on my > carb'ed beater Dodge Colt. The plugs look fine otherwise. > > How far advanced can one reasonably take it? Do you just advance it > until it just starts to ping? > > aaron > Well in my case, all of my vehicles are timed advanced beyond mfgr specs. My Corolla and Impulse are 2-degrees advanced beyond specs, the Camry is at spec. Any further than this they will ping. I can time them more advanced but I don't wanna use Super unleaded gas (yes I am cheap!). In my truck, I am at 15 BTDC (spec sez 5 BTDC). I get no ping cause the CR is only 7.5:1. It will loose power if I go beyond 15 BTDC. So you see it's a trial and error exercise again. BTW, I don't experience any overheating problems. And remember, cheat when you go for the smog test by retarding the timing a bit. Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Summary & Results: Plug Gapping with Larger Coil Date: Tue, 04 Jan 94 10:57:48 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) writes: > Same magazine regularly advertises racing batterys (regular 12 vdc > kind.) These start at 10 lbs (about 4.5 KG). Not sure why two > bettery's are desireable, but this thing will provide more amperage than > the motorcycle battery being considered at a lower weight (and more $$.) I want a second battery so that I can run my main battery down completely, then still start the car. The main battery is a 72amp*hr marine deep cycle, so fully depleting doesn't cause damage. I may run it down using a winch, running the lights, or just listening to the radio, all with the engine off. Personally, I'm not interested in the ignition advantages of the 18vdc battery, but it is an neat idea. I wonder how you would charge that battery, though, for regular street use? DC-DC converter? For a racing system, I'm sure it could power your ignition for an hour. 10 lbs does sound like a nice weight. I'll look into batteries from racing shops. I must have a catalog somewhere... Thanks. > Chris Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 11:10:17 PST From: edwang@lsil.com (Ed Wang - 7837) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: What's a 'Modification?' Oops, My apology for bring up those questions. And my thanks to those answers. Edward Wang (408) GEE-STEP Fax: (408) 954-4874 edwang@up171.lsil.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second battery Date: Tue, 04 Jan 94 11:05:35 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) writes: (Jon, I still haven't found what kind of tranny is in a non-turbo Series III.) > Several places come to mind, although none are very satisfactory. > 1) Behind the front grill there is a fairly large gap in front of the > radiator/condenser where things like the a/c fan and receiver/dryer > are stuffed. You could mount a small battery there. I mounted my car > alarm in there and it is fairly well protected from the elements if you > put it behind the large cross beam. This sounds like the best idea. You've found that the car alarm hasn't been damaged by water, rocks and such? That location's good, too, since it could be close to the main battery, and the battery isolator could be nearby, too. > 2) There is space behind the plastic fender liners in the front > fenders. This is really miserable to get at though. Yeah, that does sound like bad news. > 3) There are odd spaces around the gas tank under the car. Probably > too small for a battery though. I've had my car wheel deep in snow many times. I'm not sure an underside mounting is such a good idea. Otherwise, there's probably space under the rear seats. > 4) Passenger side rear fender underneath the storage box (ie where the > rear washer reservoir is located). This probably violates your 'not in > the passenger compartment' requirement although there is a lot of metal > around there. That would be a great place, except that I do consider that inside the passenger compartment. Basically, I'm trying to keep hydrogen from building up anywhere inside. In that storage compartment, I've mounted a fuse block, and some relays to control extra rear lighting , so sparks are a problem. Not to mention the antenna motor! > 5) Inside the air intake plenum where the wiper mechanism is located. > Miserable access and may be too small for a battery. Damn, I've never even taken that apart. Probably should to take all the pine needles out! I think your 'between the bumber and radiator' location is best. I'll look for solid mount points tonight. And a plastic shield in front of the battery would keep water from hitting too hard. Sometimes I wish I had a real trunk. > Jon Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 12:01:59 PST From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second battery How about one of those Sears 'Switcher' batteries? It's basically 2 batteries in one package with a manual switch between them. You can run down one side, and then turn the switch to use the other side to start the car. aaron xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second battery Date: Tue, 04 Jan 94 13:07:52 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) writes: > How about one of those Sears 'Switcher' batteries? It's basically 2 > batteries in one package with a manual switch between them. You can > run down one side, and then turn the switch to use the other side to > start the car. My hesitation with one of those is that it's not necessarily designed to be discharged without damage. I think it's just two normal automotive batteries. Also, neither side has the capacity of a full battery. I think those are perfect for somebody who'll accidently leave the lights on (as I do), and will need to start in an emergency. I'm looking for a setup more applicable to deliberately using (and needing) the capacity of a full battery. The switcher batteries have a simpler installation, lighter weight, and easy operation. I'm planning on using jumper cables to switch to the second battery, no simple switch, unless I can find one rated for 600 amps. > aaron Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 16:45:15 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second battery > The switcher batteries have a simpler installation, lighter weight, > and easy operation. I'm planning on using jumper cables to switch to > the second battery, no simple switch, unless I can find one rated for > 600 amps. > > Dan. > Race cars require a switch like this, although they are not cheap. The latest Summit catalog has them. The "Big Switch" (made by Flaming River) costs $45 US, is rated at 200 amps continuous or 1500 for 10 seconds. Another one, distributed by Summit itself, it a battery terminal with a built in disconnect switch. This one is $14 US, and is rated at 100 amps FWIW Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 12:38:28 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Second Battery >I'm interested in installing a second battery in my 1986 Supra. I'm >looking for a location out of the passenger compartment which would be >suitable for a motorcycle-sized or bigger battery. I can't find >suitable room in the engine compartment. It is so crammed with junk, >that there is hardly room for extra relays or shunts. I'm not sure what you want a Motor cycle battery for or what this purpose is but with my experience with those years Supra. I did 3 installs of secondary batteries. 2 "Racing" type batteries and 1 Phoenix Gold Battery. The First install was a "piggy back" design on the current location of the stock battery. The Racing batteries are VERY slim and compact so this is possible. The Second and Third were in the passenger compartment. We pulled the panel on the Rear left (and one right) and installed it where the "tools" go. That tool box thinger. Both installations worked cleanly. The reason they wanted a second battery was for mostly stereo reasons. Other then that you jus can run a racing battery on the street. I did for a long time and ran into no problems with that. >I include all areas that aren't separated from the passengers by a >metal bulkhead to be 'passenger compartment.' If you would need to install it in the engine compartment. I would choose near the firewall or such cause almost every other place is packed along the compartment. Either that or mount it sideaways. I wouldn't suggest mounting it near the grill incase of accident or you wantint to put in an intercooler (if ya have a turbo or if not then an oil cooler etc etc) later on. >Ideas? Anyone? Buehler? Depends on how serious ya wanna get and what ya need the second battery for. >Dan. Oh Welps..thats my $.02 Luck...Hoppy New year... -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 12:44:48 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: GTS Air Filter >So, I'm back to where I was. So far all I've done is open up the >exhaust with 2" pipe from the cat. back to a low restriction muffler >(no brand name... fabricated by a guy up here who preps. rally cars). >I'd like to free up the intake side, but can`t find a K&N filter >at any performance shops here. Does K&N make one for the RWD Corolla >GT-S (4AG-E engine)? Where could I order it from? Any other brands >(besides something extremely $$$ like HKS's intake). There is no K&N filter for the GTS. I'm not sure if the HKS Power Flow is out for the car but off the record. The Mazda 323 is the "universal filter" for the car. (DON'T repeat this to a dealer) You can fit it on your AirFlow meter with a few big clamps. It works..I've done it several times. A Performance dealer that sell's HKS or K&N will say that is not what the application is for so they won't sell it to you. Incidently if you want the K&N funnel for your car I belive the Supra one fits but you will lose more mid to high end cause it flows too much or too little. I forget. Of course I used bigger injectors with the Supra K&N so this could be why. Plus I only ran it a day or so then I had to give it back. >Stephen Luck 2 Ya... -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 4 Jan 94 12:55:39 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Which List & Shocks >Clearly, the second question is very important, but may be better >addressed in rec.autos.tech, rec.autos or toyotas@quack... Personally. I do not read the rec.auto's anymore. My friend down here still keeps me current about what goes on but I found WAY WAY too much prejudice on that list. Maybe cause i bash American V-8's too much cause thats all I was exposed to as a kid so i know the in's and outs. There is no respect and only know they had a good discussion about Turbo's. Some of the Turbo list guys got on there. If you have a turbo check out the Eclipse/Talon Mailing list. Those guys are REALLY into it and are VERY helpful, they don't cut you down or brag about much cause they run it and run it well. >So, I'd like to hear if anybody disagrees (or agrees) with this >assessment of the list charter, esp. our esteemed list administrator, >please let me know. Nah...I think not matter what...ya go where the posters are friendly and nice and even though peeples like me bubble to much about nonsense and take about 5 mins to comprehend what i've been trying to type, Ya learn something. I HOPE. >Dan. >(P.S. I recommend Tokico adjustable Illuminas.) Personally, I've run the Illumina's. I was not impressed. I belive any adjustable shock is good enough. The Tokico's were good, but the TRD 6 Way Adjustables I had worked just as well. The Price wasn't worth what I paid and got little from it. Maybe it was just my set up on the GTS, I'm not sure. Scotty from KMA worked for TRD and still won't admit which are better. Personally, I belive there is no difference and I belive he does too. As long as you get an adjustable shock that is either the low pressure or high pressure then its okay. Depends on application. How ever...since we are talking about suspension etc. Like on the Supra the TEMS...If you are anywhere near serious then you gonna leave it on Sport ALL THE TIME so there is no sense in getting the adjustable ones. One of my friends down here got the TEMS controlled shocks but leaves it on Sport all the time. Waste of money yes...but I guess mentalitity has to play a factor here too. -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: "Allen T " Koji " Kam" Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Which List & Shocks Date: Tue, 04 Jan 94 16:52:42 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > Allen T "Koji" Kam writes: > >(P.S. I recommend Tokico adjustable Illuminas.) > Personally, I've run the Illumina's. I was not impressed. I belive any > adjustable shock is good enough. The Tokico's were good, but the TRD 6 Way > Adjustables I had worked just as well. The Price wasn't worth what I paid > and got little from it. Maybe it was just my set up on the GTS, I'm > not sure. I hadn't realized the TRD units were less money. Also, the catalog I had didn't indicate that they had adjustables. Next time, I'll pursue that. I just now looked in my 3 year old TRD price list, and the TRD units were less than the Tokico's I got. Oh well, live and learn. I guess I should have said that I recommend the Tokicos over KYBs, which I didn't really like. Anybody have a good experience with KYBs? The back ones were way to stiff, and they wore out quickly. Was that just me? > How ever...since we are talking about suspension etc. Like on the Supra the > TEMS...If you are anywhere near serious then you gonna leave it on Sport > ALL THE TIME so there is no sense in getting the adjustable ones. How does the Sport setting do on washboard gravel roads? Does it know how to deal? I've never driven (or been in) a car with TEMS, so I have no idea how it performs. The only time I adjust my shocks is on really bad surfaces. Normally, I leave them on 5 (hardest) in front, and 3 (halfway) in back. Seems to provide the best handling. Doesn't the front/back ratio of stiffness and damping have more of an effect than overall stiffness and damping (Sport vs. Station Wagon)? > -Allen T "Koji" Kam Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 04 Jan 1994 22:19:07 CST From: toymod@sysfjo.uucp@majikthise@wpg.paramax.com (Fred Oberbuchner) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (toyota-mods mailing list) Subject: Highest-flow K&N Airfilter Stephen wrote: > So, I'm back to where I was. So far all I've done is open up the > exhaust with 2" pipe from the cat. back to a low restriction muffler > (no brand name... fabricated by a guy up here who preps. rally cars). > I'd like to free up the intake side, but can`t find a K&N filter > at any performance shops here. Does K&N make one for the RWD Corolla > GT-S (4AG-E engine)? Where could I order it from? Any other brands > (besides something extremely $$$ like HKS's intake). Here comes fredo's $0.02 (burp): What I did (had done, actually) on my 88 'rolla GTS (FWD) is as follows: - delete the entire convoluted nasty airbox - make or have made an adaptor which bolts onto the airflow meter (AFM) and converts this square hole to a round pipe about 2" in diameter - get a K&N airfilter which is essentially a cylinder with one end plugged and held onto a ~2" pipe (haha!) by a large hose clamp The adaptor is really easy to make with a hacksaw, vice for squeezing the round pipe square at one end and a welder. Presto! An HKS power-flow filter! As I said, I had this done AND LOVED THE RESULTS! The best free-flow you'll ever find (with a filter in place). (you will of course also need some 1" wide strip of metal to bolt the AFM to to hold the whole works up so the filter doesn't rub on anything.) My total bill cam to about $100 CAN ($50 for the filter and 1 hour labour) which I feel was quite reasonable considering I have no patience for metalworking! Hope this helps! fredo xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 04 Jan 1994 22:34:54 CST From: toymod@sysfjo.uucp@majikthise@wpg.paramax.com (Fred Oberbuchner) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (toyota-mods mailing list) Subject: Re: Second battery Chris wrote: > Race cars require a switch like this, although they are not cheap. The > latest Summit catalog has them. The "Big Switch" (made by Flaming > River) costs $45 US, is rated at 200 amps continuous or 1500 for 10 > seconds. Another one, distributed by Summit itself, it a battery > terminal with a built in disconnect switch. This one is $14 US, and is > rated at 100 amps Gee.....good thing I don't read all my messages at once so I can make stupid replies which have already been made more clearly in later messages... please ignore my last post about switches! the infinitely stupid, fredo xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 04 Jan 1994 22:29:15 CST From: toymod@sysfjo.uucp@majikthise@wpg.paramax.com (Fred Oberbuchner) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (toyota-mods mailing list) Subject: Re: switch for second battery with respect to switch for second battery: I believe all road-race type cars have to have a switch which dosconnects the battery so such a thing should be available from a performance shop......I seem to recall seeing an ad in Turbo Magazine for one from "Jacobs Electrical" or somebody like that..... regards, fredo xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 04 Jan 1994 22:26:34 CST From: toymod@sysfjo.uucp@majikthise@wpg.paramax.com (Fred Oberbuchner) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (toyota-mods mailing list) Subject: Re: ADV timing With respect to ignition timing: I advanced mine (4AGE) well beyond the manufacturer's specs and noticed 2 things: 1) way better seat of the pants acceleration off-the-line 2) couldn't get the darn thing to ping even when ADV was maxed out! Now, (1) seems reasonable, however (2) seemed really strange. Apparently, since I also have performance cams in my car, this sometimes causes less likelihood for pinging. I suspect that this combined with my non-stock rich fuel mixture setup may be the reason. After 5-10 degrees extra there didn't seem to be any gains however so we just left it at that. This is where my MSD multi-spark unit with in-car adjustable timing control would have been useful (if it knocked) for adjusting the timing for various conditions. (MSD will probably be for sale come spring.....plugplug) Once again, just my $0.02. (where did this saying come from anyway????) regards, fredo xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan" Subject: Re: ADV timing => faster pickup?! To: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) Date: Wed, 5 Jan 1994 16:20:12 +0800 (WST) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com > Yes, yes advance the timing! This is real cheap power gain. But make absolute > sure you are not pinging. What's the best way (easiest way?) to be sure it's not pinging? bentan xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 09:04:04 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Looking for MR-2 Fiberglass panels Thought I would forward this request to the Toyota-Mods group. It came from the Wheel-to-wheel racing group. If anyone has any ideas, let me know. Chris ----- Begin Included Message ----- I'm posting this for a friend who does not have net access. I know the answer to this for Porsches, just not MR-2s... Anyway, looking for race-grade fiberglass replacement panels for MR-2s. We have an old SSC race car that got mashed horribly over Xmas and are looking to bring it back from the dead as an EP car; given that the EP 914 and GT-1 911 I help campaign are mostly 'glass, seems reasonable to do the same here (especially considering the extent ofthe damage...) TRD has been contacted, but no response as yet (it's not in their catalog so we're really hoping for a referal not a part number...) Please mail responses to me directly as I only read two of these lists. Guessing which two is left as an exercise for the readers... 8{P Thanks very much! Stan ----- End Included Message ----- xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 09:35:41 EST From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Shocks > > Personally, I've run the Illumina's. I was not impressed. I belive any > > adjustable shock is good enough. The Tokico's were good, but the TRD 6 Way > > Adjustables I had worked just as well. The Price wasn't worth what I paid > > and got little from it. Maybe it was just my set up on the GTS, I'm > > not sure. > > I hadn't realized the TRD units were less money. Also, the catalog I > had didn't indicate that they had adjustables. Next time, I'll pursue > that. I just now looked in my 3 year old TRD price list, and the TRD > units were less than the Tokico's I got. Oh well, live and learn. I > guess I should have said that I recommend the Tokicos over KYBs, which > I didn't really like. Anybody have a good experience with KYBs? The > back ones were way to stiff, and they wore out quickly. Was that just > me? I looked in my March price list from Lou Fusz and the TRD's rear shocks for the ma61 Supra were going for about $52 for the rears (unless I miss read the part numbers-- quite possible). That seems to be about the same price as KYB. I would assume that the TRD part is better, no? By the way, for those of you lamenting the demise of the TRD colour catalog, Lou Fusz puts out a colour catalog that has a good deal of the TRD info pasted into it. I found this catalog stuffed into a parts order last March, with a separate price list, and have found it to be good reading. It includes some basic Toyota OEM high volume parts, TRD, and HKS stuff, plus a sobering price list. Jon xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 10:00:33 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Setting Timing (Look out, he's rambling again!) Okay, there's been quite a bit of discussion on Ben's original post about advancing timing, so I'll throw in the bit I know. First, for those who might not know, your timing isn't a static thing. "By the book", you set it at a certain idle speed and that's it. On my 20R Celica, I think it is supposed to be 8 degrees BTDC at around 850 rpm. Combustion time is pretty much a constant and has very little relation to your engine speed. That is why I am supposed to set mine at 8@850. This means that based on the time it takes to create an explosion with the spark, I have to provide that spark 8 degrees before the explosion is needed when the car is running at 850 rpm. (This makes the assumption that TDC is the proper place for the explosion of the fuel-air mixture.) Now, as the engine speed increases, that spark must happen sooner in order for the most powerful part of the explosion to happen at the best time. How does your engine do this? Depends...there are different ways. On the '78 20R it uses vacuum retard and centrifugal advance. Some use vacuum retard and advance. Some use only centrifugal advance. At any rate, on mine, the high vacuum present at idle conditions serves to retard the timing a bit by physically turning the internal components of the distributor such that the spark arrives a bit later. If you have vacuum retard, you can pull the vacuum line to that diaphragm and watch (with the timing light) the timing jump up. Also the idle speed will increase, indicating (to me) that the more advanced (less retarded?) timing provides more power on the same amount of fuel. I think retarding the timing at idle is some sort of emmisions thing, so that your car doesn't become a smog machine while idling at intersections. It was already mentioned that retardi Now, while the built-in retarding feature of your distributor isn't too important to performance, your advance is _critical_. Actually, I removed the vacuum line to the retard diaphragm on my race car...I don't want it on there. As implied earlier, as your engine speed increases, your spark must happen earlier in order to put the explosion at the best place for top performance. What advance at what speed? This is called your distributor curve (good buzz word to throw around at garages.) Some engineer in Japan sat down in front of a dyno, and incrementally sped the engine up. At each speed, s/he played with the timing to see what provided the best horsepower. Voila, the perfect distributor curve! Then they send that curve to some other engineer who trys to build an inexpensive way of recreating the curve. Along with inexpensive comes inaccurate! On the '78 20R, a specific size/shape/weight of metal works against a specific tension/placement spring to produce an advance curve which resembles the orig Note that you can send your distributor out and have it "recurved". AEM in California is one such provider of this service. It is fairly expensive (around $100, I think) and is only as good as the service provider. Furthermore, unless you have a dyno in your garage, you'll never know if they helped, hurt, or did nothing to the thing! Hence my hesitancy to have it done. Now, the subject line indicated that I would give a hint on how to set your timing. Your advance curve goes flat at some point, usually around 4000 rpm. This is to say, after 4000 rpm, you don't get any additional advance. Since _most_ performance-oriented folks are more concerned with how much power their engine produces at 4000 rpm than at 850, they should set their timing at 4000 rpm instead of at 850. What speed? Okay, remember in the early days of this group when we used to quote Pat Braden, chapter and verse? The TPHandbook tells you what you should set your timing at for 4000 rpm. If its not in there for your Toyota engine (or if you are not satisfied with this) then call RJ at TRD. What about all of the speeds below 4000 rpm? You'll have to hope that the engineer who designed your advance did a good job. -- Christopher P. Myer cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com ================================================================ = ________ ________ ___ ___ ________ ________ ___ = = /__ __// / ___ // \ \\ / // / ___ // /__ __// / \\ = = / // / // / // \ \/ // / // / // / // / /\ \\ = = / // / // / // \ // / // / // / // / //_\ \\ = = / // / //_/ // / // / //_/ // / // / _____\ \\ = =/ // / // / // / // / // / // \ \\ = ================================================================ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: Gary H To: Riem.Com!pinegv!wg@sco.COM, toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: M58 engine overheating problem Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 12:43:44 PST From: wg%pinegv@Riem.Com (Wayne R. Graves) > > Hey Ed, > I have had that happen, you find your self someplace too far to tow back home >with water pouring out as fast as the pump can pump it, lots of fun, left at >the mercy of the local repair shop(Booo!). Fix it NOW! They tell me one should >replace the water pump on a celica when they do the timing belt, but I didn't >believe them until it happened... > Wayne My water pump gave out on my way back to Oakland from San Diego just when I made it to the top of the Altamount Pass (whatever the name of that mountain by livermore that resembles a mini verson of the grapvines in LA). Anyways, when I made it to the top, I heard something blow, the next thing I new I thought my car caught on fire because there was white smoke everwhere. It was actually just steam coming from the engine compartment. I had to wait almost an hour at 5am to get it towed to a local repair shop. I was charged over $200 for the job. Gary xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 11:18:51 HST From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: TEMS Shocks KYB's >Don Wrote... >I hadn't realized the TRD units were less money. Also, the catalog I >had didn't indicate that they had adjustables. Next time, I'll pursue >that. I just now looked in my 3 year old TRD price list, and the TRD >units were less than the Tokico's I got. Oh well, live and learn. I >guess I should have said that I recommend the Tokicos over KYBs, which >I didn't really like. Anybody have a good experience with KYBs? The >back ones were way to stiff, and they wore out quickly. Was that just >me? If I'm not mistaken..which >I< proably am...KYB makes the TRD shocks just to TRD spec's or they used to. The "stiffer" the better. Maybe ya got the high pressure rears ? For everything the Tokico's said they were supposed to do, they didn't improve ANYTHING on my car then just giving me more body roll how ever easier to adjust the setting via the top adjustor. Worth it for everyday driving applications but not really since i left them on hard almost always infact changed it once when i picked up a girl on a date but later i cranked them back up cause we went driving =) >How does the Sport setting do on washboard gravel roads? Does it know >how to deal? I've never driven (or been in) a car with TEMS, so I >have no idea how it performs. The only time I adjust my shocks is on >really bad surfaces. Normally, I leave them on 5 (hardest) in front, >and 3 (halfway) in back. Seems to provide the best handling. Doesn't >the front/back ratio of stiffness and damping have more of an effect than >overall stiffness and damping (Sport vs. Station Wagon)? I'm not sure what a "washboard gravel" road is. However I think thats more of a tire and rim combination or ya talking about pot holes etc ? In that case my car hits dang hard and I advoid any pot holes cause I don't like checking my alignment too often. My car clears them anyway. Maybe one of the great Supra owners can answer ya =) >Dan. For a drag application you want the softer in the front and the rear the hardest how ever for a more street I guess the less body roll the better. Its a tuning problem and a driver expectation problem =) luck -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 11:27:32 HST From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Fiberglass Bodies >Chris >I'm posting this for a friend who does not have net access. I know the >answer to this for Porsches, just not MR-2s... >Anyway, looking for race-grade fiberglass replacement panels for MR-2s. >We have an old SSC race car that got mashed horribly over Xmas and are >looking to bring it back from the dead as an EP car; given that the EP >914 and GT-1 911 I help campaign are mostly 'glass, seems reasonable to >do the same here (especially considering the extent ofthe damage...) He can contact or look in the yellow pages for who makes fiber glass bodies up there the drag ones. I can't remeber his name but he makes all the glass bodies for the Japan dragsters plus a lot of American ones. They are in Cali. and also designed the body for HKS 1 I belive and the Lexus dragster body soon to come out. I'm not sure but down here I can goto any fiberglass shop and get one done. This might be easier cause I last got my fiberglass hood at a dang surf shop or the guy shaped boards also. If not make ya own. Just the molds are hard to make. >TRD has been contacted, but no response as yet (it's not in their catalog >so we're really hoping for a referal not a part number...) Maybe ya gotta ask RJ nicely..they have a full Fiberglass kit for the car just not street legal I belive and thats to the "Racers" only. >Please mail responses to me directly as I only read two of these lists. >Guessing which two is left as an exercise for the readers... 8{P >Thanks very much! >Stan One note however. The MR-2 is weighted for a reason. The major reason it didnt do so well in the racing circuit is that its gas tank was too small. They always had to pit for gas so the CRX's beat them out. Thus they race the Paseo's now or the Turbo MR-2's. The MR-2 "straight off the lot" will win. Its a well balanced car. Just get a good set of shocks and thats about it. 5 Speed is a must unless you have the Supercharged model. If its the newer one there is a place in Singapore that makes fiberglass bodies also I belive. You might check your "local" 4 wheel drive shop and such that deal with offroading. They can custom fiberglass panels for anything for a price. Since offroad or stadium type racing etc etc use a lot of fiberglass and they always shred. -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 11:31:28 HST From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: KYB shocks and Toy Catalog From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) >> (Illumina insights) >I looked in my March price list from Lou Fusz and the TRD's rear shocks >for the ma61 Supra were going for about $52 for the rears (unless I >miss read the part numbers-- quite possible). That seems to be about >the same price as KYB. I would assume that the TRD part is better, no? KYB makes the TRD shocks just up to TRD spec's If >I< am not mistaken. That sounds about right the price. It depends upon application and suspension set up. If ya wanna impress people on the street get the high pressure front's. You can sometimes lift the front end of ya car due to the high pressure front's Nebber again will i get high pressure front's. They work too damm well =) >By the way, for those of you lamenting the demise of the TRD colour >catalog, Lou Fusz puts out a colour catalog that has a good deal of >the TRD info pasted into it. I found this catalog stuffed into a parts >order last March, with a separate price list, and have found it to >be good reading. It includes some basic Toyota OEM high volume parts, >TRD, and HKS stuff, plus a sobering price list. Wow....how much for the Catalog ? >Jon -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 13:35:59 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: KYB shocks and Toy Catalog > > From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) > > >> (Illumina insights) > > >I looked in my March price list from Lou Fusz and the TRD's rear shocks > >for the ma61 Supra were going for about $52 for the rears (unless I > >miss read the part numbers-- quite possible). That seems to be about > >the same price as KYB. I would assume that the TRD part is better, no? > > KYB makes the TRD shocks just up to TRD spec's If >I< am not mistaken. > That sounds about right the price. It depends upon application and suspension > set up. If ya wanna impress people on the street get the high pressure front's. > You can sometimes lift the front end of ya car due to the high pressure front's > Nebber again will i get high pressure front's. They work too damm well =) > > >By the way, for those of you lamenting the demise of the TRD colour > >catalog, Lou Fusz puts out a colour catalog that has a good deal of > >the TRD info pasted into it. I found this catalog stuffed into a parts > >order last March, with a separate price list, and have found it to > >be good reading. It includes some basic Toyota OEM high volume parts, > >TRD, and HKS stuff, plus a sobering price list. > > Wow....how much for the Catalog ? > > >Jon > $4 for the catalog, just ordered one this morning. Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 5 Jan 94 16:49:22 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: KYB shocks and Toy Catalog > >By the way, for those of you lamenting the demise of the TRD colour > >catalog, Lou Fusz puts out a colour catalog that has a good deal of > >the TRD info pasted into it. I found this catalog stuffed into a parts > >order last March, with a separate price list, and have found it to > >be good reading. It includes some basic Toyota OEM high volume parts, > >TRD, and HKS stuff, plus a sobering price list. > > Wow....how much for the Catalog ? > > >Jon > > -Allen T "Koji" Kam I called LF Toyota today (see 800 number in the supplier list) and they are sending me their catalog...free, I guess. Said it would take a week to 10 days. I probably ought to do this with the other dealerships (Brown, etc.) FWIW Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Thu, 6 Jan 94 10:07:48 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: New Pics I've put some new pictures on the TM Mosaic server: #98 Toyota IMSA Car on the track #99 Toyota IMSA Car in the pits #99 Toyota IMSA Car on the track Check 'em out if you have Mosaic and are interested. If you want them and don't have full internet access, I'll be happy to mail them. Let me know. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: Gary H To: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu, toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Fiberglass Bodies Cc: CHECCA@PK705VMA.VNET.IBM.COM Date: Thu, 6 Jan 94 11:13:30 PST From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu > >>Anyway, looking for race-grade fiberglass replacement panels for MR-2s. >>We have an old SSC race car that got mashed horribly over Xmas and are >>looking to bring it back from the dead as an EP car; given that the EP >>914 and GT-1 911 I help campaign are mostly 'glass, seems reasonable to >>do the same here (especially considering the extent ofthe damage...) > >He can contact or look in the yellow pages for who makes fiber glass bodies >up there the drag ones. I can't remeber his name but he makes all the >glass bodies for the Japan dragsters plus a lot of American ones. They are >in Cali. and also designed the body for HKS 1 I belive and the Lexus dragster >body soon to come out. > >I'm not sure but down here I can goto any fiberglass shop and get one done. >This might be easier cause I last got my fiberglass hood at a dang surf shop >or the guy shaped boards also. If not make ya own. Just the molds are hard >to make. > >>TRD has been contacted, but no response as yet (it's not in their catalog >>so we're really hoping for a referal not a part number...) > >Maybe ya gotta ask RJ nicely..they have a full Fiberglass kit for the car >just not street legal I belive and thats to the "Racers" only. > >>Please mail responses to me directly as I only read two of these lists. >>Guessing which two is left as an exercise for the readers... 8{P > >>Thanks very much! > >>Stan > >You might check your "local" 4 wheel drive shop and such that deal with offroading. They can custom fiberglass panels for anything for a price. Since offroad >or stadium type racing etc etc use a lot of fiberglass and they always shred. > >-Allen T "Koji" Kam On Tuesday, I slid my '82 Celica into an ice bank and damaged my passenger side skirt, front air dam, rear valence, and the front fender. The front airdam is damage beyond repair. The side skirt is intact, but with crumples on every inch and a few tears. Can a fiberglass shop fix this? If so, about how much would they charge? A replacement sideskirt will cost $250; airdam is ~$400. The fender I will try to get from a junkyard. I maybe able to repair the rear valence myself. I just picked up a Sears Craftsman 4hp 25 gallon compressor. I'm curious as to why air power tools are better then electric ones? The repairs I will try to do myself. Gary xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: lupienj@wal.hp.com (John Lupien) Date: Thu, 6 Jan 94 14:26:33 EST To: Gary H , tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu, Subject: Air vs. electric Cc: CHECCA@pk705vma.vnet.ibm.com > From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu > I just picked up a Sears Craftsman 4hp 25 gallon compressor. I'm curious > as to why air power tools are better then electric ones? Air tools are cheaper, smaller, more powerful, and more convenient. Cheaper: no big electric motor on each tool. Smaller: see above. More powerful: you can put a Big Honking Electric Motor on the compressor, and run all your tools at that power level. There's only so much of an electric motor one is willing to heft in a hand tool... Convenience: If I need 6 different tools (not too unusual, drill grinder impact-wrench impact-hammer ratchet cutter for instance) I don't have to hassle with 6 cords, there's just one air line with quick-connect on each tool. -- --- John R. Lupien lupienj@wal.hp.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Thu, 6 Jan 94 14:30:58 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Fiberglass Bodies > I just picked up a Sears Craftsman 4hp 25 gallon compressor. I'm curious > as to why air power tools are better then electric ones? IMHO: 4.) Quieter. With an electric tool, you have the electric motor running right there in your hands the entire time you are using it. With an air tool, you can be far away from the compressor, and it only makes noise when it is pumping up. (OK, the air tool itself does make some noise, but maybe not as irritating as electric motors.) 3.) Impact. With an air-impact tool, you can really break things loose/tighten things down. Ex: AC Compressor nut. No way you will remove this with a hand tool or any kind of continuous-power electric tool, because it is nearly impossible (without a special tool) to hold the shaft still while turning the nut. With impact, it just tap-tap-taps it loose. Same goes for the nut on the top of a shock absorber. Stupid thing will just spin if you're turning it by hand. 2.) Safer. No worry about shocking oneself to death. 1.) More Manly (sorry, ladies.) That's right. I own an air compressor. Plus a full set of air tools. Stand back while I remove this wheel. WHEEE, WHEEE, WHEEE, WHEEE. Did you see the way I did that so fast, pulling the tool back just in time for the lug to come flying off and then me catching it in mid-air before it hits the ground? Plus all of the other good reasons John L. just gave. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: "Allen T " Koji " Kam" Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second Battery Date: Thu, 06 Jan 94 16:50:13 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > Allen T "Koji" Kam writes: > I'm not sure what you want a Motor cycle battery for or what this purpose is > but with my experience with those years Supra. Starting the engine after wearing down the primary battery with a winch, lights or just the stereo. > The First install was a "piggy back" design on the current location of the > stock battery. The Racing batteries are VERY slim and compact so this is > possible. Hmmn. I'll have to measure how much space I have. Could you just strap the two batteries together? > The Second and Third were in the passenger compartment. We pulled the panel > on the Rear left (and one right) and installed it where the "tools" go. > That tool box thinger. Both installations worked cleanly. Did you run cable large enough to start the car, or was that to power stereo equipment? I'll love to put both batteries in back to even out the weight, but I don't really want to run that much #0 wire. > Depends on how serious ya wanna get and what ya need the second battery for. Pretty serious. Redundancy. > -Allen T "Koji" Kam Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second battery Date: Thu, 06 Jan 94 16:56:59 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) writes: > Race cars require a switch like this, although they are not cheap. The > latest Summit catalog has them. The "Big Switch" (made by Flaming > River) costs $45 US, is rated at 200 amps continuous or 1500 for 10 > seconds. Another one, distributed by Summit itself, it a battery > terminal with a built in disconnect switch. This one is $14 US, and is > rated at 100 amps > FWIW A lot, actually. I could get two, so I could disconnect the main battery, so the secondary doesn't have to be charging the main battery *and* turning the starter. I had thought about getting a SPDT switch, but you never want to disconnect the battery while running, and the SPDT might do that while switching back and forth. Of course, last winter I had to use my starter for more than a minute in order to start the car. Cold weather and the wrong oil (20w-50) made it take a long time to get the engine up to speed. It was pretty frustrating, but it worked. So, the 1500 amps for 10 seconds might be too limiting. Of course, for that extreme circumstance, I could use jumper cables to bypass the switch. Normally, the car starts in .5 seconds. Faster than my 1992 truck. > Chris Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 7 Jan 94 13:17:44 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Second Battery >Dan < danapple@vicor.com > wrote: >Starting the engine after wearing down the primary battery with a >winch, lights or just the stereo. I suppose you looked into several "reserve type batteries" and even marine deep cycle batteries. So a "secondary" battery such as a "racing battery" would be more efficient. Several companies make racing batteries with enough cranking power to start a Mack Truck etc etc. Ask your local speed shop what they carry or what they can bring in or suggest. They are ALL "about" the same and do the same purpose. Phoenix Gold makes a battery if you wanna run one of those if you are into serious audio. IMHO its the same as a "Racing battery" but those in the Car Audio etc say different (*shrug*) >Hmmn. I'll have to measure how much space I have. Could you just >strap the two batteries together? The racing battery I picked up was VERY slim about 6 inches wide by 4 inchs width. We just basically added another bracket to the exhisting battery mount and also zip tied the two together. >Did you run cable large enough to start the car, or was that to power >stereo equipment? I'll love to put both batteries in back to even out >the weight, but I don't really want to run that much #0 wire. The cable doesn't have to be THAT large. #0 wire is awesome but unecessary, you can get away with smaller. What ever you use or have about would proably work considering its about 6 gague or so. That works. Yes, we ran it to piggy back the normal battery incase of such failure to start like in playing your stereo for about 3 hours and the car not wanting to turn over. >Pretty serious. Redundancy. Sorry jus had to ask =) (*NOTE*) If you wanna ask a Car.Audio fiend. My friend Ted who started the rec.car.audio forum can be reached at koseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu You can direct the secondary battery questions to him if you also want and maybe can get better insight on a better location. I'll ask him when I see him. Mail Ted and ask for his insights or I'll try have him post to here also. -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 7 Jan 94 13:23:36 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Torn Bumper > Gary (garyh@sco.COM) wrote: >On Tuesday, I slid my '82 Celica into an ice bank and damaged my passenger >side skirt, front air dam, rear valence, and the front fender. The front >airdam is damage beyond repair. The side skirt is intact, but with crumples >on every inch and a few tears. Can a fiberglass shop fix this? If so, about >how much would they charge? Yes they can fix anything. Recently my friend down here with a 1986 GTS with the Japan front end (its a one piece bumper) got clipped by another car. The front bumper was torn and his $5000 investment looked lost. He sold the car. Someone else that I know picked up the car and took it to an autobody shop and they repaired the bumper. Anything can be done today, just have to find the right shop to do it at. My front air dam (Foho) Got cracked also and I took it to a local fiberglass shop and they redid it in 10 days. I dunno how much they would charge just for a bumper. Ask around for quotes is my best bet. Ask your local dealer where they take their autobody work too or get a list from your insurance company and go from there. Get quotes and then ask someone at a speed shop where they goto. They usually can give you some ideers. -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu | | tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan / BFG / 5Zigen / HKS / Mikuni / MSD / SSR / TRD / Toyo / Yokohama | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: "Allen T " Koji " Kam" Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Second Battery Date: Fri, 07 Jan 94 17:04:17 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > Allen T "Koji" Kam writes: > I suppose you looked into several "reserve type batteries" and even marine > deep cycle batteries. I did. My conclusion was that those switcher batteries were great for accidently drain situation, but would be damaged by repeated draining. So, I bought a marine deep cycle for primary power. I just want a small battery capable of starting the vehicle after I've totally drained the deep cycle battery. Maybe next time I'll get a slightly smaller main battery to allow room for a secondary. For now I've got the big battery. I do like having the 72amp*hrs, though. > Phoenix Gold makes a battery if you wanna run one of those if you are into > serious audio. IMHO its the same as a "Racing battery" but those in the > Car Audio etc say different (*shrug*) Of course they do. There are people who call station wagons 'country vans' or whatever. I say, call it what is. Batteries for cars aren't really that esoteric (even if the stereo gear is). > The racing battery I picked up was VERY slim about 6 inches wide by 4 inchs > width. We just basically added another bracket to the exhisting battery > mount and also zip tied the two together. I have no more than 2.5 inches to spare near the main battery. The deep-cycle battery is fairly big. Well, for a car. For a boat or truck, it's tiny. I looked in my Pegasus catalog, and the smallest battery was still bigger than the space next to my main battery. > The cable doesn't have to be THAT large. #0 wire is awesome but unecessary, > you can get away with smaller. What ever you use or have about would proably > work considering its about 6 gague or so. That works. Yes, we ran it to > piggy back the normal battery incase of such failure to start like in > playing your stereo for about 3 hours and the car not wanting to turn over. You start the car through the #6 cable? Cool. I thought I'd need bigger. I may already have a #6 running to the back of the car. I'll have to check. > >Pretty serious. Redundancy. > Sorry jus had to ask =) Didn't mean to be terse. Just answering questions as straightforward as possible. Thanks for the suggestions. I'll look into the racing batteries. I'd love to move the main battery to the back of the car, but I don't want to vent H into the passenger compartment. Bummer, huh? Hate those paranoid restrictions. > -Allen T "Koji" Kam Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: Gary H To: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu, toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Torn Bumper Date: Sat, 8 Jan 94 2:49:28 PST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam >Yes they can fix anything. Recently my friend down here with a 1986 GTS with >the Japan front end (its a one piece bumper) got clipped by another car. >The front bumper was torn and his $5000 investment looked lost. He sold the >car. Someone else that I know picked up the car and took it to an autobody >shop and they repaired the bumper. Anything can be done today, just have to >find the right shop to do it at. > >My front air dam (Foho) Got cracked also and I took it to a local fiberglass >shop and they redid it in 10 days. Allen, How much did it run you? I left a piece of my airdam at Yosemite. I thought I picked up all the pieces, but I guess the piece I forgot was buried in the snow. I'm trying to decide whether to buy a new airdam or take my cracked in half airdam to a fiberglass shop to fix. Price is a big consider- ation. The same goes for the sideskirt. Gary xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Sun, 9 Jan 94 15:49:05 -0800 From: Brian Goble 8727676 To: supras@vicor.com, toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Mk III Supra Turbo in Turbo Magazine I just picked up the March '94 issue of "Turbo & Hi-Tech Performance" magazine. (For those of you in the Seattle area, I found it at Barnes & Noble books in Bellevue--first place I've seen it). The thing that caught my I was on the cover it says: HOT! 12-Second Single-Turbo Supra On page 44 is the story of an '87 Supra Turbo that can a 12.39 1/4 mile at 116 mph. It's generatring around 500 hp (50 of which comes from nitrous)! I noticed the the picture in the lower-left corner of page 44 refers to the car as "second-generation"--when it is really the "third-generation" Supra. Just FYI... -Brian ==)------------ Brian Goble | goble@ee.u.washington.edu "Finishing a close second means you didn't win." ------------(== xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 10 Jan 94 10:09:14 EST From: fergusos@jeff-lab.QueensU.CA (Ferguson Stephen) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: 4AG question Hi, This is one of those borderline maintenance/mod questions. It's time for a timing belt change. Is the Toyota belt more than adequate given my rather "enthusiastic" driving style, or is there an aftermarket belt I should get? Price? Source? Also, if a timing belt breaks on the 4AG engine, does it freewheel, or will the valves hit the pistons? I've heard conflicting opinions. Stephen xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 10 Jan 94 13:38:42 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: He's Back... Greetings, and a happy new year to all. Sorry If I haven't been able to reply to some of the posts or messages some of you guys have sent me/the list, as I just got back to work today after 2 Sun filled weeks in Barbados. (What a drag having to dig my car out from under two feet of snow, but, two pumps on the gas pedal to prime the twin mikuni carbs, and a little coaxing as the battery was low, and the lil ole 4age quickly came to life, --and that was in -15 degrees c weather! .. and someone said carbs are terrible in winter... shoot that rumor out the door. I have gathered "tons" of Toyota Mods information for 4AGE, 4AGZ & 3SGE as well as more pictures, which I will share in the days/ weeks to come. So please bear with me as I try to sift through the almost 200 E-mail messages I received over the last two weeks. Cheers... -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Allan Chen" Date: Mon, 10 Jan 1994 12:18:33 -0800 To: fergusos@jeff-lab.QueensU.CA (Ferguson Stephen), Subject: Re: 4AG question On Jan 10, 10:09am, Ferguson Stephen wrote: > Subject: 4AG question > This is one of those borderline maintenance/mod questions. It's time > for a timing belt change. Is the Toyota belt more than adequate given > my rather "enthusiastic" driving style, or is there an aftermarket > belt I should get? Price? Source? I have found that most stock Toyota parts are more than adequate unless you are building something some type of roid out torque monster. A stock timing belt should be more than sufficient. Most Toyota parts are more than over-engineered anyway. > Also, if a timing belt breaks on the 4AG engine, does it freewheel, or > will the valves hit the pistons? I've heard conflicting opinions. It must freewheel or it was designed with more than adequate piston to valve clearance... A friend of mine broke his timing belt a couple of months ago ('85 Corolla GT-S). His worst worries were to replace bent valves, etc... But all that was required was a timing belt replacement. Toyota does recommend that your timing belt be changed after 50,000 miles. My friend exceeded it by 30,000 miles when it broke. If you would like more info I could ask Larry at Far Perfromance (in Mountain View) about it if you are curious. Thanks, Allan Chen Silicon Graphics Inc. Mountain View, CA allanc@sgi.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Auxiliary Battery plan Date: Mon, 10 Jan 94 17:21:04 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com So, I think I have a plan together for this battery project: 1) Battery mounting Battery will be mounted on the rear face of the front bumper. Bottom of battery will rest on the flange between the upper and lower halves of bumper. A metal strip (1/4" x 1" x ???") will be inserted into the inside of the bumper. It will be long enough to be longer than the battery and reach between two of the holes on the rear face of the bumper. A threaded hole will be tapped on each end of the metal strip, to line up with the holes on the rear face of the bumper. An identical strip will be made, with the exception that the holes will be slightly larger, and untapped. Two threaded rods will be used to connect between the two strips. Between the second strip and the bumper will be held the battery. Nuts will be used to tighten the second strip against the battery (and therefore, the battery against the bumper). Battery will probably be mounted on the starboard side of the vehicle. A plastic shield will be placed around the front and top of the battery to reduce splash. 2) Battery isolator mounting Battery isolator will be mounted in an as yet unspecified location near the alternator or air-flow meter. 3) Charging wiring Alternator will be tapped after ammeter shunt. Existing (stock) wire will be used to charge main battery. New #6 (or so) wire will be used to charge aux battery. Fuse of same wattage as main charge fuse will be inline with new wiring. 4) Standby start wiring and cutover switch #4 wire will be run from aux battery to racing style 'kill switch' located new (but not too near) the main battery. #4 wire will be run from kill switch to main battery. 5) Battery capacity. First attempt will use a small battery of between 60 and 100 CCA. 6) Aux battery ground Aux battery will be grounded using wire at least as big as main battery ground. 7) Prime assumption Supra alternator uses external sense to determine current system voltage and will be able to compensate for the diode voltage drop. 8) Tradeoffs and excuses A) If battery is much higher than front bumper, A/C and radiator will receive slightly less air-flow. a) Possibly use low-profile battery. Also, new manual fan control will allow for extra cooling air when needed. B) In frontal collision, battery may be pushed back far enough to destroy A/C or radiator. a) Frame mounted brushguard should reduce frontal damage in collision. If brushguard and bumper are both deformed enough to impact battery on radiator, I've got far bigger problems. C) Battery will be subject to harsh environment. a) Easy access. Fresh water won't conduct enough current at 12v to be a problem. Fuse at alternator prevents damage to rest of electrical system. Battery H2 can vent easily to atmosphere. D) Weight of battery at front of car increasing front-biased weight distribution. a) Wait until you see the brushguard! I've had the brushguard for about 1.5 years. It is a marvel. Deserves it's own article. I've got some pictures, but since I don't have Internet access, they're hard for me to post. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 09:23:46 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Re: 4AG question >On Jan 10, 10:09am, Ferguson Stephen wrote: >> Subject: 4AG question > >> This is one of those borderline maintenance/mod questions. It's time >> for a timing belt change. Is the Toyota belt more than adequate given >> my rather "enthusiastic" driving style, or is there an aftermarket >> belt I should get? Price? Source? > > I have found that most stock Toyota parts are more than adequate unless >you are building something some type of roid out torque monster. A stock >timing belt should be more than sufficient. Most Toyota parts are more than >over-engineered anyway. > >> Also, if a timing belt breaks on the 4AG engine, does it freewheel, or >> will the valves hit the pistons? I've heard conflicting opinions. > > It must freewheel or it was designed with more than adequate piston to >valve clearance... A friend of mine broke his timing belt a couple of months >ago ('85 Corolla GT-S). His worst worries were to replace bent valves, etc... > But all that was required was a timing belt replacement. Toyota does >recommend that your timing belt be changed after 50,000 miles. My friend >exceeded it by 30,000 miles when it broke. If you would like more info I could >ask Larry at Far Perfromance (in Mountain View) about it if you are curious. > The reason for conflicting reports, is that it depends on which Toyota "4AG", you are talking about? Huh? apparently there are slight differences in the 4age designs over the years, especially in terms of clearances etc.. When I rebuilt my 4age, I went to the toyota dealer and said "give me bearings (main,con-rod) etc for a 4age". Not knowing that you have to match the bearings to the little numbers stamped on the block. The result was that it had to be redone, as the clearances wern't right, and oil pressure resulted in a "knocked out" bearing. (con rod bearing thickness will affect piston to valve clearances) If you are building a 4age to take some "jamming" (as the experts like to say) then the late model 4age's as fitted to the front wheel drive 89 , 90 or later?) corolla GTS, and FX-16's are ideal. In a stock 85 gts, you may be spared bent valves if the belt breaks, however, the majority of 4age's that I have seen at FACES are modified in some fashion with either cams &/or head work. In these cases the higher lift cams will result in bent valves if the belt breaks. I bent 3 valves when the pulley that holds the timing gear on the crank wore on the keyway to the extent that the timing was thrown out by as much as 20 degrees, (i.e you could turn the cams 20 degrees, before the crank would rotate). I have since had loctite put on the crank bolt that holds the pulley, and it was tightened with an air gun. (Note, my engine revs to 8000+ easily, and I have relatively agressive cam profiles.) I am still using the *stock* Toyota timing belt on my engine, however when It is time to replace it, I am deffinitely going to get the TRD one, as it lists for 20.00. If you have ever seen the full page colour Add for the 4AGE dubbed the "Equalizer", you will see a picture of the belt. (Tidbit: formula atlantic engines have not used a distributor since 89, instead they use electromotive systems.). The grooves, visually look a bit deeper, and I think the belt itself may be slightly wider. For $20 it could be a cheap placebo/insurance. Hope this helps... -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 15:35:44 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Re: Second battery Dan, >I'm interested in installing a second battery in my 1986 Supra. I'm >looking for a location out of the passenger compartment which would be >suitable for a motorcycle-sized or bigger battery. I can't find >suitable room in the engine compartment. It is so crammed with junk, >that there is hardly room for extra relays or shunts. > >I include all areas that aren't separated from the passengers by a >metal bulkhead to be 'passenger compartment.' > >Ideas? Anyone? Buehler? > >Dan. I will quote a paragraph from the IFG brochure on the Turbo kit for the Honda Civic. " It is necessary to relocate the battery into the rear trunk area to make room for the Turbo. A Marine Battery box and all necessary Battery cables are included in the kit for that purpose." Is mounting the battery in the Trunk a problem? I had a battery box made just before I went on vacation, and plan to move my battery into the "Trunk" (if you can call it that on a hatch back). Once The cover is strapped down, I don't anticipate any problems with fumes etc. When I bought my Electromotive ignition from the Atlantic team, they had a buch of gel-cell batteries, (I think they were asking $100 CDN each) which, put out more cranking power than your standard battery, and which were used to run the atlantic cars, (which don't have an alternator). The neet thing I recall about these batteries, was that they have no fluids to leak out, and the battery could be mounted in any direction/orientation. The terminals, were also designed in a manner, that allowed one to quickly swap batteries. If mounting the battery in the trunk sounds excessive, how about this: I know someone who mounted the radiator underneath the car facing down at the rear of the car! (So as to make room for a turbo and intercooler in the front of the car). -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 16:23:22 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: 4AG VS 4AGZ Greetings All: And now a little story... The 4AGZ, which I once saw in a corolla GTS, has made its way into a starlet, that has seen the super charger stuff removed, and a custom turbo exhaust manifold mated to a hitachi turbo (from a maxda rx-7 turbo II). The intake side has an HKS pop off valve to handle over boosting. Fuel is controlled by a haltech system, and a haltech air/fuel indicator provides visual feedback. This turbo 4agz is running 12 pounds of boost, and in some quarter mile testing on a 3.9 diff (close ratio gearset) turned in a 13.33 quarter mile (with a slipping clutch -- stock supercharged clutch). As a comparasion there is a naturally aspirated 4AG starlet (running 12.7:1 Compression Ratio!) that runs consistent 12.78's in the 1/4 mile. In actual track times, the 4ag starlet is only hundreds/sec quicker than the 4AGZ prepared starlet. One engine cost $10,000 to build, the other roughly $1500 ! Anyone know which cost which? ... The owner of 4AGZ starlet tried running at 15 PSI (just 3 PSI more) and burnt a piston in the process necessitating a rebuild. No detonation, No running lean, nothing, it seems as though the engine (recall this is a standard 4agz engine with stock pistons) just couldn't handle the "Jamming" of the additional boost. The car did run for several days at 15 PSI, however. The owner undaunted, has ordered the HKS AIC kit (Additional Injector, Controller) and is determined to get the 4AGZ running at 15 PSI reliably. With a metallic clutch and a 4.1 diff, he is hoping to dip below the 13 second mark, stay tuned.... -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 15:40:12 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Anti sway bars Tip.... I saw a really neat trick, which really blew me away, because it was so simple. Since most of the starlets in Barbados are using complete corolla GTS front end transplants, what several people have done (purely from a cost saving point of view) is to double up on the anti roll bars, i.e you take another stock anti-roll bar and somehow attatch it below, or "in front" of the existing sway bar. The mechanics (for most cars) by which an anti-roll bar does its stuff, is via a twisting efect (aftermarket stuff uses thicker bars). Doubling up, is an alternatve. It works and is cheap. especially for cars for which their is no aftermarket stuff. Note you will need to fabricate your own brackets/mounting arrangements. -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: derekd@wv.MENTORG.COM (Derek Deeter) Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 14:23:46 PST To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Auxiliary Battery plan >> Battery will be mounted on the rear face of the front bumper. >>Bottom of battery will rest on the flange between the upper and lower >>halves of bumper. Have you made any provisions for corrosion protection? Seems every battery I've seen in an engine compartment eventually sulfates, which eventually causes corrosion/rust on anything touching or even near the battery. I'd hate to think of your bumper starting to rust, or even worse, the valance sheetmetal under the bumper. It would probably be good to put the battery in one of those marine type boxes, and mount it instead. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: Gary H To: derekd@wv.MENTORG.COM, toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Auxiliary Battery plan Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 15:14:07 PST >From: derekd@wv.MENTORG.COM (Derek Deeter) > >>> Battery will be mounted on the rear face of the front bumper. >>>Bottom of battery will rest on the flange between the upper and lower >>>halves of bumper. > >Have you made any provisions for corrosion protection? Seems every battery >I've seen in an engine compartment eventually sulfates, which eventually >causes corrosion/rust on anything touching or even near >the battery. I'd hate to think of your bumper starting to rust, or even >worse, the valance sheetmetal under the bumper. It would probably be >good to put the battery in one of those marine type boxes, and mount it >instead. Derek, I have a battery in the trunk of my '89 M3 and the battery is so clean, I can probably sell it to you as new and you would buy it. There is absolutely no corrosion/rust on or near the battery. Maybe it has to do with the fact that the battery is in a sealed environment. Gary xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: derekd@wv.MENTORG.COM (Derek Deeter) Date: Tue, 11 Jan 94 15:17:47 PST To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Auxiliary Battery plan >>I have a battery in the trunk of my '89 M3 and the battery is so clean, I can >>probably sell it to you as new and you would buy it. There is absolutely >>no corrosion/rust on or near the battery. Maybe it has to do with the fact >>that the battery is in a sealed environment. I think so... I've seen the same with the battery in my other car, which is in the hatchback area of the passenger compartment, and it's clean as a whistle too. Been that way for many years. But for some reason, in the engine compartment, things deteriorate pretty quickly. Probably the two worst things are the heat and exposure to weather. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 12 Jan 94 11:13:26 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Internet access Netcom provides internet access for a charge. You can contact them at: (408) 554-8649 (voice) Local dialups provided for area codes: 310, 408, 415, 510, 619, 916 Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 12 Jan 94 11:44:00 EST From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: internet access For those interested in dial up internet access, there is public dialup internet access list (PDIAL). To get a copy send email to info-deli-server@netcom.com with the subject SEND PDIAL ---- Jon xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 12 Jan 94 14:57:31 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: strut-upgrade Hi guys, Has anyone done Mcpherson strut replacement on their Toys? Last weekend, I replaced the front struts on my FWD Corolla w/ KYB inserts. It was my first time doing struts and it ain't fun when your learnin' on the job. I managed to install everything back on the car and suddenly noticed that the left-inner CV-joint has popped out from the housing and hanging in the air. **SH*T**, the manual never mentioned anything about this? Anyway, after 2hrs I managed to slide the CV-joint back in the housing and install the boot back on properly. All this time, I though all CV-joints were bolted on. Guess not, I learned the hard way. So people make sure you support those halfshafts properly to avoid what I had to go through! I am replacing the rears on the Corrolla this weekend and next weekend I've got 4 more corners on the Camry to tackle. The ride control on the Corolla is much better now w/ just the fronts installed. Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 17 Jan 94 15:13:31 EST From: Raymond Bahr To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: names and addresses in Japan Hi there! I think that a list of important Toyota names and address would be interesting. I have a perticular need for a important name in Japan to write an unhappy letter to. If anyone has such a name and address please Email it to me. If people mailed me any contact names, I would organize the resulting list and post it. Thanks in advance Ray Bahr xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 21 Jan 94 16:22:20 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Awfully quiet out there... I've been away from the 'puter for a while, so I had a TON of email when I got back, but I noticed very little from the TM group. I kinda suppose that is because of the extremely cold weather that affects the majority of our group. At least I hope it is something like that, and not that everybody has given up on modifying Toyotas or something. Keep in mind that this isn't "my" group, it is "our" group, so if there is something not happening to your satisfaction, let me know so I can fix it. I am merely your humble TM Server Servant. Well, I did get to race last Friday. As you may remember, I pulled the head and had a valve job done on it. I remember a lot of folks on this group saying "I don't do the mechanical work, I'm an EE (or CScientist or whatever) and not given to engine work. Gang, I am and EE (and a CS) and it is _easy_ once you take all of that electronic crap off. Of course, I am not recommending that for your family car. But if you have _ever_ thought of racing, go find yourself a ratted out Corolla for $150, strip that baby down and learn what it is all about. There is a Circle Track near you, (well, If you are in the US or CAN), and they have some sort of 4 cylinder "stock" class. Yes, I know that you want to turn left _and_ right, but this is an excellent, _cheap_ place to start. Sorry, I started chasing rabbits. Anyhow, I got the head back on and it was a piece of cake since I didn't have anything in the way. Remember that I put on the Nissan Z-engine valve springs for lack of anything better. Result? Fastest car on the track. Did I win? Nope. Long story, but bottom line is I need to make the driver faster now. I'm probably giving away about .5 seconds per lap due to my inexperience. But tonight is another chance to get more experience, so I'll be there. Let you know how it turns out. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Awfully quiet out there & Fuel filter Date: 21 Jan 94 16:01:55 -0600 From: mbarre@nomvs.lsumc.edu > Subject: Awfully quiet out there... > > ... "I don't do the mechanical work" ... > > Chris I agree Chris. I am a computer scientist and love working on engines. I think what turns some people off about it is working without the proper tools. That can be very frustration. I kind of look at it like a 300 horsepower jigsaw puzzle (V8's that is). Anyway, I do have a question, though it borders on maintenance. After 50,000 miles I need to replace the fuel filter on my 22RE. I finally found it bolted to the engine block nestled between the starter, oil filter, and intake manifold. If I don't want to remove the intake manifold, I'll have to come in through the bottom. Is this thing as hard to replace as it looks? If so, has anyone modified the system to place the filter in a more accessible place, as is commonly done with oil filters? Best of luck with the racing, Chris. Keep us update. MB xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 21 Jan 94 14:23:28 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Awfully quiet out there... Chris wrote: But if you have > _ever_ thought of racing, go find yourself a ratted out Corolla for > $150, strip that baby down and learn what it is all about. There is a > Circle Track near you, (well, If you are in the US or CAN), and they > have some sort of 4 cylinder "stock" class. Yes, I know that you want > to turn left _and_ right, but this is an excellent, _cheap_ place to > start. Ding! You rang a bell. I've been entertaining the idea of getting a Corolla and make a project out of it. The Corolla will be for my younger brother and he has the street racing blood in him just like his older brother did. Anyway, since I am starting to get back into 4-cyl mods., I have a few questions: What year Corolla did the 3TC engine came with? Also I've heard people switching the 3TC w/ a 2TG engine from Japan. What are the differences between the two engines and what major components needed for a swap. I am towards getting a 3TC Corolla cause of the availability of aftermarket parts. Thks louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 21 Jan 94 14:55:47 PST From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Awfully quiet out there & Fuel filter }I think what turns some people off about it is working without the }proper tools. Ain't that the truth! Anything's easy as long as you have the proper equipment :-) (I'm an EE also :-) ) ] After }50,000 miles I need to replace the fuel filter on my 22RE. I finally }found it bolted to the engine block nestled between the starter, oil }filter, and intake manifold. If I don't want to remove the intake }manifold, I'll have to come in through the bottom. Is this thing as }hard to replace as it looks? Not really, it's just a royal pain to get at it. There are 3 bolts and a bracket that hold it to the engine block. You can get to them by feel from the top :-( No need to remove the starter or intake. Same goes when you're ready to put the whole thing back in :-( When you disconnect the fuel line, be prepared to collect 1/5 gallon of gas, literally. The system is under pressure even after you've parked the car. The manual recommends running the car until it dies with the fuel pump fuse disconnected to relieve pressure. I undid the fuel line instead and got gas all over the place and ended up smelling like regular unleaded for the next couple of days. I didn't expect *that* much gas to come out. So be forewarned! :-) Disconnect the injector side of the filter first, so you'll be able to collect clean gas instead of all the gunk which gets flushed back out of the filter otherwise. Instead of wasting it all, I just dumped it back into the tank. WARNING!!!! WARNING!!!! DISCONNECT YOUR BATTERY BEFORE YOU DO THIS!!! The starter is right next to the fuel filter. If you're wrestling around the area with gas all over the place and you happen to spark one of the starter terminals....... good luck! aaron xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 21 Jan 94 14:09:06 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: 3TC Motors... >>Chris wrote: >> But if you have >> _ever_ thought of racing, go find yourself a ratted out Corolla for >> $150, strip that baby down and learn what it is all about. There is a >> Circle Track near you, (well, If you are in the US or CAN), and they >> have some sort of 4 cylinder "stock" class. Yes, I know that you want >> to turn left _and_ right, but this is an excellent, _cheap_ place to >> start. >Ding! You rang a bell. I've been entertaining the idea of getting a Corolla >and make a project out of it. The Corolla will be for my younger brother >and he has the street racing blood in him just like his older brother did. >Anyway, since I am starting to get back into 4-cyl mods., I have a few >questions: What year Corolla did the 3TC engine came with? Also I've heard >people switching the 3TC w/ a 2TG engine from Japan. What are the differences >between the two engines and what major components needed for a swap. I am >towards getting a 3TC Corolla cause of the availability of aftermarket parts. The Corolla 3TC motor 1.8 came out in 1976 in the Corolla SR-5 till 1983. The 2TG is a direct drop in no crossmember changes if you have a T-series motor because it uses the same bottom end. The 2TG is obviously Twin cam motor. A Old techonology that still works and it works VERY well. You can make the 2TG put put some 200HP with it set up properly. About 3TC parts being available, I dunno in Hawaii we build 3TC and its hard for us to get parts anymore since 1988, because they stopped production of most items. I'll list some of the parts "still available for the Corolla 3TC. Arias still makes pistons for your car but i belive its special order. Crane Isky, TRD makes cams for the car. TRD Gear drive is available after they get an order for 100 sets or more. The Quick shift kit for the car is also available if you get 100 sets ordered. Carbs are available through many people. Mukuni is a good street carb they stay tuned VERY long and very reliable. Weber is the fastest though. They output more gas so if you gonna run Top end or 1/4 go for the Weber. The Delartos are good and cheap because they come in the bigger sizes 48's and up also semi streetable/raceable due to the size. The Mukuni manifold is the best cause its the shortest. They have the Cannon manifolds which is good if ya gonna run NOS lines later on but they extend the cars out into the Strut tower on almost all Toyota's so you gonna have to run the small stacks and no chance of air filters. Trans gearing and rear end gears are available through TRD (mostly and some HKS) and same goes for the brakes and exhaust manifolds. I suggest the TRD "header" type unit for your car (because i have it) and its a "stock" replacement part and it doesn't hang low like the Hookers or the Doug Thorley. Mainly its a desired thing. If you want Forged Pistons a big cam small cam big valves etc etc. The Valves are big bucks btw... i would only get them if you gonna do serious 1/4 racing. Also a quick "hop up" mod for your 3TC is to find an older 2TC head like 1975 and earlier. You will notice the intake manifold is different. It doesnt' have the emissions hole on the front. (ya gotta check it if the intake manifold is a big ugly sucker or its smaller and shorter there is a hole in the front which the 3t's have that isn't there on the early year motors). The Early 2TC heads are "high compression" and you will notice a BIG hop up from stock performance. Better top end and the RPM's come faster. One note if you gonna run dual carbs. (This i suggest thatyou do run duals if you gonna be serious) You have to get a 1977 Corolla Distrubitor cause the 3T distrubiotr is too big. And the 1977 Dist has the electonic's. The Mallory dual point distrubitor is too big also if you run duals unless you offset it 180 degree's and run your car that way. I would suggest running dual carbs. The single sidedraft theory works, i have tried the 2 manifolds out there but if you gonna run one, then might as well get the other. The Weber "Progressive" carb is good. However it is limited to 15 second runs. The jet sizes are unavailble and it doesn't flow. You end up buying drill bits for jet sizing as you go on. >Thks >louis Hope I Bubbled well enuff.. Oh Welps... Good luck...... -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | koji@io.soest.hawaii.edu | | koji@interact.uucp@netcom.com | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan Racing / HKS / MSD / SSR / Toyota Racing Development / Yokohama Tires | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 21 Jan 94 16:34:46 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: 3TC Motors... Thanks Thanks Koji for the info 'bout the 3TC. I still have other questions if you don't mind answering. Where to get a 2TG engine? and are aftermarket parts available for it? Thks Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 09:10:47 EST From: Raymond Bahr To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Toyota parts for sale The following parts are for sale - shipping is not included! The are for a 1991 MR2 Turbo but may fit other Toyota's 1) Fuel Filter $15.00 2) Front and Rear Brake pads ( Toyota) $50.00 3) HKS cat back muffler ( will also fit a 1992 am not sure about 1993) used good shape $100.00 4) Fitipaldi Indy rims 15x7 - with a BRAND NEW set of BFG comp T/A3's (2) 205-50ZR15, (2) 225-50ZR15 with McGuard lugs ~ rims are about 2 Years old $800.00 5) Factory Manuals ( 2 Volumns) $25.00 6) Timing Belt $15.00 I will entertain offers for one or all of these items! Toyota parts are about 1/2 of the normal price, tires and rims were about $1200, muffler was about $350.00 If interested call me at: (617)-329-8742 ( H) (508)-977-8780 ( W) Thanks Ray Bahr xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 09:23:37 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: 3TC Motors... Something Koji said gave me cause to wonder... > The 2TG is a direct drop in no crossmember changes if you have a T-series > motor because it uses the same bottom end. If the 3TC and the 2TG have the same bottom end, could you just find a good 3TC bottom end and then bolt on a 2TG head? An even better question as far as _my_ pursuits go, can you bold the 18RG head on a 20 or 22R block? I would think an 18RG head on a overbored 22R block would qualify as a V8 assassin! Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 04:30:42 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: 3TC Motor or Bottom Ends >Something Koji said gave me cause to wonder... >> The 2TG is a direct drop in no crossmember changes if you have a >>T-series >> motor because it uses the same bottom end. >If the 3TC and the 2TG have the same bottom end, could you just find a >good 3TC bottom end and then bolt on a 2TG head? Yes...Get the Yamaha heads though. Its a better flowing design. You can bore out the 1.6 2T to a 1.8 3T spec or ever a 13T spec with is a stock 2.0 motor. Then you can all it a 4TG if you wish... -shrug- >An even better question as far as _my_ pursuits go, can you bold the >18RG head on a 20 or 22R block? Yes.. You can. Same Bottom End block. >I would think an 18RG head on a overbored 22R block would qualify as a >V8 assassin! Yes, They do. >Chris Sorry its early in the morning and i can't think. BTW For Allan Chen I lost your internet address and too tired to think But on Friday i seen Andrew High and his Supra and on Sat night i seen your GTS at Restraunt Row...JUS FYI Allan =) *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | koji@io.soest.hawaii.edu | | koji@interact.uucp@netcom.com | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan Racing / HKS / MSD / SSR / Toyota Racing Development / Yokohama Tires | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* P.S Please Unsubscribe kamallen@pulua.hcc.hawaii.edu i got into a big tiff with A root and they biffed my account. -Me xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 11:08:58 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: RM Sport Price List... I received some info from a RM Sport (Hertfordshire England), who deal mainly with the corolla (AE86) and later. Listed here is their price list. (All prices are in **pounds sterling**). (Makes for interesting reading) 4-2-1 Exhaust Manifold 165.00 Exhaust System 169.00 Inlet Manifold 2 X 45 DCOE 140.00 Injector Blanking Bungs (Set 4) 10.00 Fast road head (including machining) 275.00 Bronze valve guides if required, each 4.95 'GP A' cyclinder head std. valves including machining 345.00 Big valve head including machining) 375.00 Large valves per set 16 (2 mm oversize valves) 239.00 Machining for high lift cams 50.00 valve springs (depending on type) 8.50-14.00 Cam followers, (shim underneath type each) 14.97 valve retainers, (shim underneath steel each 6.50 valve retainers, (shim underneath aluminium each 6.94 Steel spring platforms each 3.53 ** Camshafts-- new pair any profile-) 375.00 ** Camshafts -- second hand pair when available 300.00 **Adjustable vernier cam pulleys -- Alloy pair 135.00 Valve adjusting shims each 2.95 Lightweight racing distributor to suit lumenition 175.00 Steel flywheel 175.00 Lightened standard flywheel 80.00 clutch 4 paddle type 295.00 Forged pistons -- high compression -- per set 450.00-900.00 Alloy strut tower brace 95.00 High ratio steering rack 165.00 5:1 and 4:7 crown wheel and pinion-- available to order Spring kits and special Bilstein dampers -- available to order Fibreglass/kevlar Bonnet -- to order Fibreglass/kevlar Tailgate -- to order The info highlights a fact little mentioned else where, in that when using high lift cams in a 4AGE, you have to change the cam followers, to ones where the (valve clearance) shim sits underneath the "bucket" that pushes down on the valve (as against on top of it), because a hot cam (>300 degrees & > 8 mm lift) can literally wipe the shim out of the bucket in the stock arrangement. (TRD's catalog simply had stuff like -- modification to valve train necessary) Also great is the fact that these guys will grind a cam to any profile you want! The Adjustable vernier pulleys, allow you set cam timing without taking off the timing belt. -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 11:45:21 EST From: Raymond Bahr To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Talk about going fast Hi all! All this talk about racing and going fas is tough to take with < 20 deg f weather, lots of snow on the ground, more comming etc. Withdrawel is setting in!!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 11:36:33 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Jacobs Accuvolt unit (Q) Here is one for the EE guys on this list: Has anyone heard of/has comments on the Jacobs accuvolt system? (Connects between battery and rest of car electronics) and supplies a constant voltage to your ignition system (14-18 volts if I recall correctly) which is supposed to provide for a "more consistent ignition spark"? Huh? My feeling, is that this system only benefits situations where the engine does not have an alternator. How important is the difference in time to charge an ignition coil with a battery that is putting out say 14 VS 12 VS 8 volts? Don't many of todays ignition systems handle low voltage situations. (e.g Electromotive's system starts the coil charging sooner for the next cycle if the coil is not charged to "desired" level -- Is this what they refer to as the Dwell Time?) Comments? -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 10:04:46 PST From: do@etdesg.trw.com (Louis Do) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Jacobs Accuvolt unit (Q) > > Here is one for the EE guys on this list: > > Has anyone heard of/has comments on the Jacobs accuvolt system? (Connects > between battery and rest of car electronics) and supplies a constant > voltage to your ignition system (14-18 volts if I recall correctly) which > is supposed to provide for a "more consistent ignition spark"? Huh? Watch out for the Jacob products everyone. Their stuff sounds like "snake-oil" to me. I called their tech line once to get some tech info on their products and all I got was " If you buy the package now, we'll take $100 off the list price." and "This offer is only good if you buy now". Real pushy sales droids. There has also been talk on rec.autos about their products and sure sounds like people are unhappy w/ them. So beware! Louis xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 10:00:14 PST From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Jacobs Accuvolt unit (Q) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com }Has anyone heard of/has comments on the Jacobs accuvolt system? (Connects }between battery and rest of car electronics) and supplies a constant }voltage to your ignition system (14-18 volts if I recall correctly) which }is supposed to provide for a "more consistent ignition spark"? Huh? Sounds like a scam to me...the fact that your alternator has a regulator on it already keeps your battery and electrical system between 12-14VDC! Furthermore, unless your battery is shot, it'll maintain roughly 12V even with the engine on and the alternator disconnected. }My feeling, is that this system only benefits situations where the engine }does not have an alternator. What modern car doesn't?? :-) } How important is the difference in time to }charge an ignition coil with a battery that is putting out say 14 VS 12 VS }8 volts? Coils are simply transformers. The lower voltage you feed it, the lower output voltage you'll get..it's linearly proportional given a fixed load. IMHO, the time to 'charge/discharge' (for a lack of better terms for dv/dt) an inductor is negligible for all practical automotive purposes. The importance of voltage output is the ability to jump the sparkplug gap. You can think of Dwell as simply the length of time each sparkplug gets juice (ie. sparked) aaron xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 13:29:41 EST From: Raymond Bahr To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: RE; Jacobs Accuvolt unit I have NOT read good things about the Accuvolt unit in other newsgroups. In general, the alternator will maintain 13.8 volts ( assuming no problems, or current drain exceeding capacity of alternator), if there is no alternator the battery will provide a 12v source for quite a while - once again assuming minimum loads. Mos cars with EFI will not work below 8v or even 10v ( fuel pumps gvenerally have a problem), also ( in theory) the output of the coil ( transformer) is linearly proportional to the input voltage! so a drop from 12v in to 8v in willproduce a 25% decrease in the coil output voltage. Ray Bahr xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: 24 Jan 1994 12:04:14 U From: "Jim Chott" Subject: Re: Jacobs Accuvolt unit (Q To: "toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.c" Louis Do wrote: "Watch out for the Jacob products everyone. Their stuff sounds like "snake-oil" to me. I called their tech line once to get some tech info on their products and all I got was " If you buy the package now, we'll take $100 off the list price." and "This offer is only good if you buy now". Real pushy sales droids. There has also been talk on rec.autos about their products and sure sounds like people are unhappy w/ them. So beware! " Jim responds: I was subscribed to a mailing list called the 'Hotrod list' for a while which is run by a John DeArmond. He writes a magazine called Performance Engineering which mates computers and autos to some extent. He did some testing on the Jacobs setup and concluded it basically was 'snake oil' like suggested above. I have no personal experience with Jacobs, but John seemed like a well informed individual who tested it with a scope, etc. and didn't think it was worh buying. He suggested an MSD ignition. Jim Chott xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 14:06:16 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Timing issues revisited 3 weeks ago I wrote a rambling treatise (sp?) on timing. Since then I have found a tool that no racer should be without. A buddy of mine, who is a full time Nissan Mechanic and nearly full time racer, has a great timing light. On the back is a knob where you can "dial in" your desired timing rate. Remember that I said that timing on a race car is best set at operating speeds? Note however that the timing marks on your car (if there are any) are only applicable for timing the car at idle, not at the 35-40 degrees of advance necessary at high speed. With this timing light, if you want to set your timing at 38 degrees, you set the knob on the light at 38 degrees, and then rev the engine to whatever speed you desire to check your timing at. When your timing mark on the pulley lines up with the 0 degree marker, you are at 38 degrees (or wherever you set the knob.) Cool, eh? Now for a reality check. My buddy bought his used for $75 US. Not cheap. But, like I said, probably worth it if you are seriously into racing (and winning.) Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 14:28:40 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Jacobs Accuvolt unit (Q FWIW: I have the Jacobs energy team on my 4x4. I didn't notice any real difference, except that the engine seems to run much cleaner. Probably due to the hotter spark. BTW, if you ever get a high power coil like that and want to see some fireworks, just pull the coil wire off of the coil, turn over the engine a few times while standing back...way back. I made that mistake just after I installed the system and got a spark about 18 inches long from the top of the coil to the raised hood. Sounded like somebody slapping a ruler down flat on a desktop every time it hit. No doubt the system puts out a bunch of voltage! Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 14:37:34 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Re: Jacobs Accuvolt unit (Q) The reason, I brought this up in the first place, is that I have noticed a downturn in the way in which some mags, review products, Turbo mag, in particular seems to be lacking in this area. Their jan article on ignition system, would lead you to believe that the accuvolt system is a great product. I kind of like the term "Snakes Oil" ;-) -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 16:20:23 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Timing issues revisited > I don't recolloct seeing any specs for timing at anything other > than idle. Does anyone know what/where they are for a 22RE in an > 84 celica? > > aaron > This engine and others are discussed (timing-wise) in the TPHandbook. I am pretty sure Pat sez don't exceed 40 degrees at 4000 rpm. The 4000 doesn't really matter, basically it just means that is where the centrifugal/vacuum advance ends. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 15:33:34 CST From: J Grant Montgomery To: Subject: Air/Fuel Mixture Can I get better performance, either from the line or top end, by adjusting the air/fuel ratio mixture on my '85 Supra? Just wondering. Thanks. Grant UT BAD1 / '85 Toyota Celica Supra 5-Speed & Alpine / WA24%UTMARTN.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu / Nothing Ventured...Nothing Gained!!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: lupienj@wal.hp.com (John Lupien) Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 16:46:24 EST To: Chris Myer , Subject: Re: Timing issues revisited > idle, not at the 35-40 degrees of advance necessary at high speed. With > this timing light, if you want to set your timing at 38 degrees, you set > the knob on the light at 38 degrees, and then rev the engine to whatever > speed you desire to check your timing at. When your timing mark on the > pulley lines up with the 0 degree marker, you are at 38 degrees (or > wherever you set the knob.) Cool, eh? > Now for a reality check. My buddy bought his used for $75 US. Not > cheap. But, like I said, probably worth it if you are seriously into > racing (and winning.) The $50 timing light I got at Sears has the advance adjust knob. Still, I was pissed off when I found that I couldn't use it to adjust the timing on my VW - the AE engine wants 5deg retard! -- --- John R. Lupien lupienj@wal.hp.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 16:48:47 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Timing issues revisited > The $50 timing light I got at Sears has the advance adjust knob. > Still, I was pissed off when I found that I couldn't use it to > adjust the timing on my VW - the AE engine wants 5deg retard! > > -- > --- > John R. Lupien > lupienj@wal.hp.com > I guess that's part of the difference in price. My friends is a Snap-On model, and goes both positive and negative. Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: J Grant Montgomery Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Air/Fuel Mixture Date: Mon, 24 Jan 94 14:13:12 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > J Grant Montgomery writes: > Can I get better performance, either from the line or top end, by > adjusting the air/fuel ratio mixture on my '85 Supra? Just wondering. > Thanks. It is possible to adjust the airflow meter. Under load, mixture is mainly determined by the O2 sensor. In an old TRD catalog, it described a way to richen the mixture by adjusting the air-flow meter. On page 82 of the TPHandbook, it describes how to add a dashboard richness control by intercepting a signal from one of the water temp sensors. You don't want to run too rich with a catalyst, apparently. You can overheat the catalyst. If you are not subject to emmisions control (standard disclaimer), you might look into disabling the EGR stuff. This will improve your off the line performance. But you didn't ask how to do, only if there was an advantage. I kinda doubt it, unless you've put in a higher flow exhaust or intake. I thought the Supra was bottlenecked by the exhaust and air-flow meter. K&N, as well as Cyberdyne, sell Air/Fuel ratio meters that can be installed in the dash, and hooked up to a stock O2 sensor. I'd bet the K&N is a better unit. > Grant Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 1994 17:01:31 -0800 From: Joe Woodsprite To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: new 22R heads >>An even better question as far as _my_ pursuits go, can you bold the >>18RG head on a 20 or 22R block? > >>Yes.. You can. Same Bottom End block. > >>I would think an 18RG head on a overbored 22R block would qualify as a >>V8 assassin! > >Yes, They do. As a bit of a newbe to Toyota mods I'd like to know why the 18RG heads are better performance-wise than the ones on the 22R. 4 valves/cylinder? Magic? I'd also like to know what cars the 18RG came in. Thanks Woodsprite ******************************************************************************* ** * 1983 Celica ST * Joe Woodsprite *** ** Looking for Julie, * * Unsafe at any speed *** ** Whereever I go. * I don't drive * *** ** --- * fast. * lantera@kira.csos.orst.edu *** ** I'll do what it * I fly low. * lanteran@xanth.cs.orst.edu *** ** takes to find her. * * *** ** * 72 Honda CB350 * *** ******************************************************************************* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Cc: tomj@orl.mmc.com Subject: Re: new 22R heads Date: Mon, 24 Jan 1994 21:01:35 -0500 From: Tom Julien >As a bit of a newbe to Toyota mods I'd like to know why the 18RG heads are >better performance-wise than the ones on the 22R. 4 valves/cylinder? >Magic? > >I'd also like to know what cars the 18RG came in. Joe, This a DOHC version of the the 18R series engine and develops more HP than it's SOHC counterpart. However, the 18R-G was not exported to the U.S. :( We received the 18R-C in our 72-74 Celicas, Coronas, and pickups. If I remember correctly, the 18R-G (as opposed to the 18R-GR or 18R-GU) puts out 145 hp compared the 18R-C's 97 hp. When I lived in Japan, I had heard that I could put the 18R-G head on my 18R-C block, but I never inquired into the specifics (I was too caught up in music gear at the time -- it took all my money!). I have been meaning to ask Koji ever since he joined the list (talk about procrastination!) about this and other things related to the 18R. Guess I could discuss it here to keep Chris happy w/ some traffic to his TM mailbox. :) (*** Koji, pay close attention here ... i.e. no sleeping like in class ;) 1. I'd like to know specifically why the 18R-C is not suitable for performance mods. More than "it's not designed for it", etc. Is the head the weak point? I can say that I stretched the timing chains at 75K mi on my 18R-C and have yet to on my 20R at 210K mi. (I have run them both equally hard). I was wondering if this an example of the 18R-C's weaknesses? I'd like to know why though. I just love them details! 2. What's involved in putting the 20R in a '74 Celica. Once I believe you mentioned having to move crossmember #1. I know the pan that's on my truck 20R is cut different than the Celica 20R's to clear the steering linkage. Any problems mating the 20R w/ the W50 xmission? Any other mods necessary? 3. What are the differences between the Toyota and Yamaha heads for the 18R-G? I believe Koji just mentioned something about a better flow design for the 2T-G Yamaha heads. 4. Hmmm... I know I had more questions, but I'm drawing a blank at present. Hopefully I'll remember if a discussion gets rolling on this topic. Any input guys? Btw, the 18R info as well as some good info on the 3T-C and 2T-G engines that Louis Do asked about the other day is in the Toyota Performance Handbook (listed in our book/mag listing). If you guys can swing the $18.95, pick up a copy at your local book store -- there's some decent info in there for sure. Tom /************************************************************* Thomas J. Julien E-Mail: tomj@orl.mmc.com Engineer, Image Processing Lab Tel: 407-356-3442 Martin Marietta Corp. Fax: 407-356-8944 *************************************************************/ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 1994 12:07:47 +1000 (EST) From: Murray Chapman Subject: Re: new 22R heads To: Tom Julien Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com On Mon, 24 Jan 1994, Tom Julien wrote: > When I lived in Japan, I had heard that I could put the 18R-G head on > my 18R-C block, but I never inquired into the specifics (I was too caught > up in music gear at the time -- it took all my money!). I have been > meaning to ask Koji ever since he joined the list (talk about procrastination!) > about this and other things related to the 18R. Guess I could discuss > it here to keep Chris happy w/ some traffic to his TM mailbox. :) Not quite as simple as that. You will need to include all the R-G timing gear (including casing), as well as shifting the water pump and distributor. Since your engine is now a crossflow, you might have to reorganize things like the size (height) of your oil filter, your brake master cylinder, your airconditioner, etc. You also need to find yourself some air filters, which probably won't come with the head. Murray -- Murray Chapman Zheenl Punczna -- -- muzzle@cs.uq.oz.au zhmmyr@pf.hd.bm.nh -- -- University of Queensland Havirefvgl bs Dhrrafynaq -- -- Brisbane, Australia Oevfonar, Nhfgenyvn -- xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 1994 16:23:39 +1000 From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: 18RG Motors >>>An even better question as far as _my_ pursuits go, can you bold the >>>18RG head on a 20 or 22R block? >>Yes.. You can. Same Bottom End block. >>>I would think an 18RG head on a overbored 22R block would qualify as a >>>V8 assassin! >Yes, They do. >As a bit of a newbe to Toyota mods I'd like to know why the 18RG heads are >better performance-wise than the ones on the 22R. 4 valves/cylinder? A 18RG motor is a Twin Cam motor. There are several Heads for 18RG. The best one is the Yamaha design. I belive there is also a Suzuki and a something else. The Yamaha flows the best that I know of. The 18RG Motor design came out in 1971 i belive and is still used today in Iron Man Stewarts Unlimited Truck. Old techonology is making a come back on the racing circuit. I'm not sure why the reason but a lot of the racers have gone back to it. >Magic? Quite so. From What >I< remeber about the motor its a "stock" 9.7:1 compression that puts out some @140 HP. Its a 1990 cc displacement. Someone with a TRD catalogue can quote you direct numbers and figures. This motor can be pushed out to over 200HP with minor modifications and even up to 300hp i heard of somewhere. HKS and TRD still make cams and gear drives for this motor. Just the waterneck parts etc the "stock" parts the hardest to find. >I'd also like to know what cars the 18RG came in. More then likely on in Celica's made in Japan. Or motors imported from Japan or from Europe. >Thanks >Woodsprite >P.S. Hope you find Julie Soon.. *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | koji@io.soest.hawaii.edu | | netcomsv!koji@interact.uucp | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan Racing / HKS / MSD / SSR / Toyota Racing Development / Yokohama Tires | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Cc: tomj@orl.mmc.com Subject: 18R-C and 18R-G Date: Mon, 24 Jan 1994 21:47:12 -0500 From: Tom Julien >Not quite as simple as that. You will need to include all the R-G timing >gear (including casing), as well as shifting the water pump and distributor. I didn't think I implied simplicity: "... but I never inquired into the specifics ...", but oh well. I was definitely expecting the timing assembly to change w/ dual cams, timing gears, etc. and figured the water pump/fan might be offset. This is definitely what I'd like to know ahead of time so I can consider my options. The distributor shouldn't be a problem -- I'm going to change it out for a pointless one anyway. Any suggestions on a good one? Errol had once suggested the Jacobs a while back, but also said there were some other notable units. With the recent discussion of the Jacobs, I'd probably lean to the MSD, but my buddy kept frying 8.8 wires on his `68 Camaro w/ one of their spark units, so I had my doubts there too. >Since your engine is now a crossflow, you might have to reorganize things >like the size (height) of your oil filter, your brake master cylinder, your >airconditioner, etc. What do you mean by crossflow? The head width/capacity will definitely change and there's a good bit of room for a larger oil filter, but moving the master cylinder (if the new head comes that close) might be a pain. I'll have to check that clearance. No airconditioning, so no problem there. >You also need to find yourself some air filters, which >probably won't come with the head. Well, I have a new Holley carb and Offenhauser intake that I never installed, so I need a new filter and linkage setup anyway. I have been considering going w/ dual Mikuni's, but I'm still undecided there. Thanks for the info Murray... /************************************************************* Thomas J. Julien E-Mail: tomj@orl.mmc.com Engineer, Image Processing Lab Tel: 407-356-3442 Martin Marietta Corp. Fax: 407-356-8944 *************************************************************/ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 1994 13:15:03 +1000 (EST) From: Murray Chapman Subject: Re: 18R-C and 18R-G To: Tom Julien Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com, tomj@orl.mmc.com On Mon, 24 Jan 1994, Tom Julien wrote: > >like the size (height) of your oil filter, your brake master cylinder, your > >airconditioner, etc. > > What do you mean by crossflow? The head width/capacity will definitely > change and there's a good bit of room for a larger oil filter, but moving > the master cylinder (if the new head comes that close) might be a pain. > I'll have to check that clearance. No airconditioning, so no problem > there. Ahh! Just remembered... Brake cylinder is on the RHS of my car... I'm Down Under. Combination of carbies and air filter and brake system didn't work too well on my RH drive vehicle. No problems with the 18R (which was a non-crossflow: intake and exhaust both on LHS of head). I installed extractors and a 2-inch exhaust system at the same time... not much clearance where the extractors join the exhaust. Front LHS floor well gets very hot. > Thanks for the info Murray... Not a prob. I've got a lengthy file of repair/mods history for my Celica, and I'll mail the list when I get my butt into gear. > Thomas J. Julien E-Mail: tomj@orl.mmc.com -- Murray Chapman Zheenl Punczna -- -- muzzle@cs.uq.oz.au zhmmyr@pf.hd.bm.nh -- -- University of Queensland Havirefvgl bs Dhrrafynaq -- -- Brisbane, Australia Oevfonar, Nhfgenyvn -- xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 24 Jan 1994 17:22:23 +1000 From: tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: 18RG Stuff >>As a bit of a newbe to Toyota mods I'd like to know why the 18RG heads are >>better performance-wise than the ones on the 22R. 4 valves/cylinder? >>Magic? >>I'd also like to know what cars the 18RG came in. >Joe, >This a DOHC version of the the 18R series engine and develops more >HP than it's SOHC counterpart. However, the 18R-G was not exported >to the U.S. :( We received the 18R-C in our 72-74 Celicas, Coronas, >and pickups. If I remember correctly, the 18R-G (as opposed to the >18R-GR or 18R-GU) puts out 145 hp compared the 18R-C's 97 hp. The Celica started production in 1971 I belive. You can tell the differences by the front grill design and the hood. The Corona's did have the same motor Good point. The Trucks ditto but they came with a 8RC motor also =) Jus FYI 18RG = 9.7 : 1 compression @ 140hp 18RGR = 9.2 : 1 compression @ 135hp but with forced air induction The first two had Suzuki heads or Hitachi or something 18RGU = 9.7 : 1 compression @ 140hp air induction, with EGR =( electronic distrubitor and a Yamaha head with dual 40mm Solex Carbs 18RGEU = 8.3 : 1 compression @ 120hp Early Attempt at EFI system for this motor. Yamaha head and full electronic distrubitor >When I lived in Japan, I had heard that I could put the 18R-G head on >my 18R-C block, but I never inquired into the specifics (I was too caught >up in music gear at the time -- it took all my money!). I have been >meaning to ask Koji ever since he joined the list (talk about procrastination!) >about this and other things related to the 18R. Guess I could discuss >it here to keep Chris happy w/ some traffic to his TM mailbox. :) Music Gear =) Heh...Sounds familiar...Oh Grand...pick on me day =) >(*** Koji, pay close attention here ... i.e. no sleeping like in class ;) >1. I'd like to know specifically why the 18R-C is not suitable for performance >mods. More than "it's not designed for it", etc. Is the head the weak point? >I can say that I stretched the timing chains at 75K mi on my 18R-C and have yet >to on my 20R at 210K mi. (I have run them both equally hard). I was wondering >if this an example of the 18R-C's weaknesses? I'd like to know why though. I >just love them details! The 18RC Motor has several modifications for it. However building a 18RC motor is quite costly. The main point why they were not built is that the intake and the exhaust is on the same side. Bad design. Its a strong motor, puts out more "stock" then a 20R does and has a higher RPM band but thats about it. Cost wise to build a 20R and a 18R is a big thing. A headers are the same cost as with cams. If you do get a cam for your 18R i would suggest the "truck" cam because of the power band. It works the same was a RV cam great torque and horsepower and yet very effiecent and streetable. Sluggish RPM but great power at lower RPM's nice even power curve. The "dual carb" set up for the 18RC i belive is some $600 quite a big difference then the $400 price of a 20R similar set up. Still the intake and exhaust is on the same side. I think this is the main reason why the project was abandoned. Carbs tend to heat up and have a chance of "vapor locking" etc etc. If you love your 18R motor try get a Nissan 510 carb from an early year. It works better and is a direct bolt on =) Bigger The 18R motor is a good design just the RC is a bad head yes. In so many words else Ironman Stewart wouldn't be using the same motor and kicking everyones butt with it for so long... BTW good story about him. His pit crew is racing along on the desert paved roads at about 80MPH + and they see this cloud of dust right next to him. Low and behold he's running along side them at the same speed except on the offroad terrain. Another one is that they had the pit area set up in this canyon with a one way in and path out. Well, he started late in the race and they heard him comming. If you ever heard a 18RG motor flat running at top speed, ya'll know the sound Well..anyway..to make a long story short. The end of the pit road the path out was through a gully type thing with 10 foot sides and so happened someone stalled in that area blocking all cars in and out. So low and behold, Stewart comes in at full speed into the "pit area" then makes a detour to climb the sides of the face of the "gully" and by pass all of the stuck vehicles. Clims the 10 foot face of the gully and races on. His pit could only say "I guess he didnt need to pit" (*shrug*) Heh..thats a neat story. Oh..btw when you watch him race in stadium racing... You always noticed the tires spinning at REALLY high speeds as he does jumps. This is because he has his foot ON THE GAS...WHILE IN THE AIR. He's known for this. Also known for losing body parts. If you happen to goto a race where hes racing you could proably take home a body panel or two =) They give them to fans or used to =) >2. What's involved in putting the 20R in a '74 Celica. Once I believe you >mentioned having to move crossmember #1. I know the pan that's on my >truck 20R is cut different than the Celica 20R's to clear the steering >linkage. Any problems mating the 20R w/ the W50 xmission? Any other mods >necessary? Basically all you have to do is get a 1976 or 1977 crossmember. Change the motor mounts and reverse the radiator to the outside of the engine compartment. Minor changes. The steering isnt affected. The transmission shouldn't be a problem just as long as you make sure the bell housing fits. Which it should. If you have a/c or other such nicities you have to reroute some lines but thats really minor. Just have longer hoses. Anything else is minor details. Oh remounting the coil and hmmmm ignition is minor also. I personally did this swap in a 1974 Celica putting in a 20R motor from a 1977 Celica. Did it the night of my graduation party in high school too =) Ha ha. >3. What are the differences between the Toyota and Yamaha heads for the 18R-G? >I believe Koji just mentioned something about a better flow design for the >2T-G Yamaha heads. Basically Toyota motors ARE Yamaha's. Yamaha designs motors for Toyota or used to. I think they still do. Early on before Yamaha Toyota made their own or contracted it out to others but i belive Toyopet picked Yamaha as their main engine builder and stuck with them. Thus is why you don't see Yamaha cars or Toyota Motorbikes =) >4. Hmmm... Hmmmm....Sounds like a smooth running cam. Just make sure to advance your timing maybe 2 degrees off stock for a better stock performance. Keep regular upkeep of your car. Tuneup's etc etc . To have a good "modified" car you must have the basics. Else you gonna be spending more time and money on a car that keeps breaking cause of abuse of non-regular upkeep. Change your brake fluid to dot 4 at least if you can. Bleed your brakes before a race night or day. I bleed mines at least minimum once a month. Change your coolant from the stock ones. Synthetics oil can only help your car. Fix exhaust leaks in your car as soon as possible (look at me talking about this one sheesh heh) Wipe down your rims if you have bronze metallic brake pads else they develop rust on your rims =) Errrr Hmmm..anything else =) >I know I had more questions, but I'm drawing a blank at present. >Hopefully I'll remember if a discussion gets rolling on this topic. Gee...changing cam's on a 20R is a sinch...jus open up the dang valve cover and throw the cam in. Gee..don't need to bother with all the T motor probs. >Any input guys? Hmmmm Mukuni's are good intake's and streetable too =) Air filters are worth the effort but I like the bigger stacks without air filters cause you can tune your carbs without a syncho by using your hands =) >Btw, the 18R info as well as some good info on the 3T-C and 2T-G >engines that Louis Do asked about the other day is in the Toyota Performance >Handbook (listed in our book/mag listing). If you guys can swing the >$18.95, pick up a copy at your local book store -- there's some >decent info in there for sure. Gee... I gotta clean my room and find some books =) Or Get a (*gasp*) J-O-B ! >Tom Aloha Tom... Gee...Why is eberry bunny picking on me ;) -Allen T "Koji" Kam *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | | | Allen T "Koji" Kam tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | koji@io.soest.hawaii.edu | | netcomsv!koji@interact.uucp | | | | Live Life, Taste Death....Speed is Pure !!!!!!! 1980 Toyota Trueno | | Don't let up till you see RED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan Racing / HKS / MSD / SSR / Toyota Racing Development / Yokohama Tires | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 00:29:43 HST From: Allen T "Koji" Kam To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Timing Lights ! >3 weeks ago I wrote a rambling treatise (sp?) on timing. Since then I >have found a tool that no racer should be without. A buddy of mine, who >is a full time Nissan Mechanic and nearly full time racer, has a great >timing light. On the back is a knob where you can "dial in" your >desired timing rate. Remember that I said that timing on a race car is >best set at operating speeds? Note however that the timing marks on >your car (if there are any) are only applicable for timing the car at >idle, not at the 35-40 degrees of advance necessary at high speed. With >this timing light, if you want to set your timing at 38 degrees, you set >the knob on the light at 38 degrees, and then rev the engine to whatever >speed you desire to check your timing at. When your timing mark on the >pulley lines up with the 0 degree marker, you are at 38 degrees (or >wherever you set the knob.) Cool, eh? (*Gasp*) You mean you didn't buy the Sears adjustable one ? I belive it was only $55 or less. Sorry I keep on forgetting trivial tools =) >Now for a reality check. My buddy bought his used for $75 US. Not >cheap. But, like I said, probably worth it if you are seriously into >racing (and winning.) Errr I won't tell you how much the Snap - on One is then =) >Chris *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* | Allen T "Koji" Kam tkoseki@uhunix.uhcc.hawaii.edu | | Life Life... koji@io.soest.hawaii.edu | | Taste Death... koji@interact.uucp@netcom.com | | Speed is Pure !!!!! | | Don't let up till you see RED !! 1980 Toyota Trueno SR-5 Sports Coupe | | Advan Racing / HKS / MSD / SSR / Toyota Racing Development / Yokohama Tires | | V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! | | How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... | | Love is the only ting dat has 2 be earned... | | Eberry ting else can be hacked ! - Reflex the Kismet Thief of Hearts | *-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 13:34:24 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Indexing Plugs (Q) Has anyone heard of the technique of Indexing Plugs? I caught a brief mention in a magazine article written by a "Jacobs Engineer", -- "Act now and our readers can get their 24.95 booklet on ignition systems for 15.95" It seems that by indexing plugs, you align the spark gap opening so that the gap "opens" into the intake stream. (Jacobs has Indexing rings -- various thickness "washers" to use on plugs, so that you can tigthen them as necessary to get desired alignment). | | | \ / | |_| |_____ <- Indexing plug points open end of plug gap into the Incomming air fuel mixture The diagrams in the article were in conjunction with a "Cross Flow" head, where the spark plugs were on the opposite end of the head,as compared to the intake. Comments? -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 13:51:06 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Exhaust Thermal Wrap (again)... FYI, In the december issue of car and car conversions mag, they rehashed the topic of wrapping the exhaust header with thermal wrap (on a naturally aspirated modified 2.0 litre engine) , any how, the reviewer concluded that they could not measure any real improvements on their "rolling road" (Dyno), and that the wrap (which apparently crumbles and flakes off after a while) once disintegrated, would not be replaced. They did remark, at how the underhood temperatures were noticably cooler. Which I guess could be considered an improvement, if you run your engine really hard, and then need to work on the engine right away). -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 14:38:44 EST From: Raymond Bahr To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Indexing Plugs (Q) I Have heard of this in some ultimate tuning book - I don't remember which one> The theory is ( as best as I can remember): mixture ignition is a probabilistic processes based on a number of factors: 1) Fuel used 2) Air/Fuel ratio 3) Spark Gap - The bigger the gap the more room for molocules of air / gas 4) The duration of the spark 5) The compression ratio 6) a bunch of other stuff I can't remember The after market ignition systems try to increase the gap by increasing the applied voltage to the plug, and they increase the duration by multiple sparks (MSD) or simply a longer duration spark. The indexing of the plugs try's to make the plug gag more accesable to the incomming stream. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 12:06:48 PST From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: returned mail for toym }. The indexing of the plugs try's to }make the plug gag more accesable to the incomming stream. I wonder if this idea led BMW to use multi-electrode sparkplugs in some of their cars (I forget which ones...I think the M3 is one of them...Gary, can you confirm??) aaron xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 15:48:11 EST From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: returned mail for toym > }. The indexing of the plugs try's to > }make the plug gag more accesable to the incomming stream. > > I wonder if this idea led BMW to use multi-electrode sparkplugs > in some of their cars (I forget which ones...I think the M3 is > one of them...Gary, can you confirm??) > I tried indexing my plugs a while back. I bought about 20 plugs and put a red dot (nail polish) to indicate the location of the electrode, then I started stuffing them in and torqueing them to spec. If the red dot pointed towards the exhaust valve (or reasonably close) I moved on, otherwise I tried another plug until it lined up. After I got six plugs to line up I noticed no real difference, but this was on the street, not the track. Has anyone heard of using the 'electrodeless' plugs that are used in Mercury two-stroke outboard engines? The outer electrode on these is a ring surrounding the center electrode. They work well in outboard engines, I've never seen one foul and there is no gap to go out of adjustment, but they require very high voltage to drive (typically a CD unit is used). Jon xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 1994 13:28:25 -0800 From: Joe Woodsprite To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: electrodeless plugs >From hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com Tue Jan 25 12:58:55 1994 > }. The indexing of the plugs try's to > }make the plug gag more accesable to the incomming stream. > > I wonder if this idea led BMW to use multi-electrode sparkplugs > in some of their cars (I forget which ones...I think the M3 is > one of them...Gary, can you confirm??) > I tried indexing my plugs a while back. I bought about 20 plugs and put a red dot (nail polish) to indicate the location of the electrode, then I started stuffing them in and torqueing them to spec. If the red dot pointed towards the exhaust valve (or reasonably close) I moved on, otherwise I tried another plug until it lined up. After I got six plugs to line up I noticed no real difference, but this was on the street, not the track. Has anyone heard of using the 'electrodeless' plugs that are used in Mercury two-stroke outboard engines? The outer electrode on these is a ring surrounding the center electrode. They work well in outboard engines, I've never seen one foul and there is no gap to go out of adjustment, but they require very high voltage to drive (typically a CD unit is used). Jon Mazda requires something like this for use in Rotary engines. They use multiple side electrodes pointing at the center electrode. Thus the gap is located on the sides rather than the top of the center one. The resulting plug does not go as deep into the combustion chamber, and is rediculously expensive. The cheepest I could ever get them was $8US _each_. I changed to normal plugs for awhile and noticed no performance differences, but I started burning condensers up about one every other week. Woodsprite ******************************************************************************* ** * 1983 Celica ST * Joe Woodsprite *** ** Looking for Julie, * * Unsafe at any speed *** ** Whereever I go. * I don't drive * *** ** --- * fast. * lantera@kira.csos.orst.edu *** ** I'll do what it * I fly low. * lanteran@xanth.cs.orst.edu *** ** takes to find her. * * *** ** * 72 Honda CB350 * *** ******************************************************************************* xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Tue, 25 Jan 94 16:38:23 EST From: Raymond Bahr To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Plugs > Has anyone heard of using the 'electrodeless' plugs that are used in > Mercury two-stroke outboard engines? The outer electrode on these is a > ring surrounding the center electrode. They work well in outboard > engines, I've never seen one foul and there is no gap to go out of > adjustment, but they require very high voltage to drive (typically a CD > unit is used). > Jon I have seen these for sale in J. C. Whitney's They have been available for a while but I have not seen them used, so I don't know if they work!! Ray xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 26 Jan 94 10:10:24 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Indexing Plugs (Q) > Has anyone heard of the technique of Indexing Plugs? I caught a brief > mention in a magazine article written by a "Jacobs Engineer", -- "Act now > and our readers can get their 24.95 booklet on ignition systems for 15.95" > The diagrams in the article were in conjunction with a "Cross Flow" head, > where the spark plugs were on the opposite end of the head,as compared to > the intake. Comments? > > -- > Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, > Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, > Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 I saw Jacob's advertisement for plug index-ers, and I agree with the basic theory that it might help, but I don't think that racers use it much. I spent all day in Daytona yesterday rubbing elbows with the Big-boys of NASCAR Winston Cup (more on that later) and I didn't see anybody indexing plugs. This on cars with (nearly) unlimited budgets and knowledge. FYI -- Christopher P. Myer cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com ================================================================ = ________ ________ ___ ___ ________ ________ ___ = = /__ __// / ___ // \ \\ / // / ___ // /__ __// / \\ = = / // / // / // \ \/ // / // / // / // / /\ \\ = = / // / // / // \ // / // / // / // / //_\ \\ = = / // / //_/ // / // / //_/ // / // / _____\ \\ = =/ // / // / // / // / // / // \ \\ = ================================================================ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Wed, 26 Jan 94 11:42:16 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: 18RG Heads + Stuff (Q). Could someone clarify, whether the 18RG DOHC head is actually a 2 or 4 valve per cyclinder head? and whether 16V heads were ever an option? I have seen a 3T-GTE head (Twin Spark plugs/cyclinder) as is used in the Toyota carinas, and was supprised, that for such a "big" (and heavy) DOHC head, there were *only* two (very large) valves per cyclinder. Also maybe we might want to start a small database (Library so to speak) on Toy. engines that would include stuff such as: engine size Bore, Stroke Valves/Cyclinder Piston size? Comments Interchangability of Components.(Heads/Gear Boxes etc..) etc.. Rev limits: (88 C&D says stock corolla redline is 7700 RPM!?) (94 acura integra vtec touted as reving to 7800) (Chris I am ashamed to say, That I don't know exactly what the setup is on the 20R, 22R engines (DOHC 8V,16V, SOHC 16, DOHC with single belt outside engine & gear drive under cam cover to other cam) Since this is a list for modifications, I would think, this info could be very useful, especially if you're into Transplants & interchanging components. It could even be extended to suspension components. (EG, I discovered you can use a 6.7 Corolla GTS LSD, in a 6.7" Celica Diff. assembly. The TPHandbook is a little bit dated in this area (Especially as relates to valves/cyclinder) eg, no hard info for 4AGZ, 3TGTE,3SGTE etc... What base engine did TRD use in the 99 GTP car? (The ads/press suggest the engine from the All-Trac celica/Turbo MR2, but the guys at FACES suggest the 3TGTE. I may even volunter to catalog the data, if there is an interest. Comments? -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Cc: tomj@orl.mmc.com Subject: Re: 18RG Heads + Stuff (Q). Date: Wed, 26 Jan 1994 13:01:44 -0500 From: Tom Julien >Could someone clarify, whether the 18RG DOHC head is actually a 2 or 4 >valve per cyclinder head? and whether 16V heads were ever an option? I have I thought they were 2 valves per, but I could be mistaken. >Also maybe we might want to start a small database (Library so to speak) on >Toy. engines that would include stuff such as: > engine size > Bore, Stroke > Valves/Cyclinder > Piston size? > Comments > Interchangability of Components.(Heads/Gear Boxes etc..) > etc.. > Rev limits: (88 C&D says stock corolla redline is 7700 RPM!?) > (94 acura integra vtec touted as reving to 7800) > >(Chris I am ashamed to say, That I don't know exactly what the setup is on >the 20R, 22R engines (DOHC 8V,16V, SOHC 16, DOHC with single belt outside >engine & gear drive under cam cover to other cam) Since this is a list for >modifications, I would think, this info could be very useful, especially if >you're into Transplants & interchanging components. It could even be >extended to suspension components. (EG, I discovered you can use a 6.7 >Corolla GTS LSD, in a 6.7" Celica Diff. assembly. Roger, this is a great idea. Chris had mentioned something along these lines awhile back wrt engine, chassis, rear-ends, etc. and wanted to have it available on the mosaic server. We could also mail it out periodically to those who don't have the mosaic access. I'd be willing to give you a hand gathering data or whatever you wish. The TPHandbook is indeed dated. Which reminds me ... does anyone know what the Z engine suffix stands for? I initially thought it might denote supercharger as in the 4A-GZE, but what about the 3V-ZE that comes in the newer trucks? If we had a good database of this as you suggest, I guess I would know exactly what the 3V-ZE plant is! :) Tom /************************************************************* Thomas J. Julien E-Mail: tomj@orl.mmc.com Engineer, Image Processing Lab Tel: 407-356-3442 Martin Marietta Corp. Fax: 407-356-8944 *************************************************************/ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Allan Chen" Date: Fri, 28 Jan 1994 06:25:36 -0800 To: gregg@sun1.InterLan.COM (Gregg Zupcsics), Subject: Re: Roof racks for Supra w/ sport roof? On Jan 28, 8:12am, Gregg Zupcsics wrote: > Subject: Roof racks for Supra w/ sport roof? > > Has anyone tried putting roof racks on a Supra with the "sport > roof"? If so, what brand and model racks did you use? > > I have a Supra with the sport roof, and I'd like to use it to > transport some of my toys (surfboards, windsurfer, etc.). I'm not > sure whether the sport roof is strong enough that the racks (and > toys :-) will stay attached without damaging the roof. If the sport roof is like a glass t-top or something to that extent, your options will be very limited or in the worst scenario... none. Most roof-racks utilize a clamp system to secure it to either a rain gutter or the top of your doorways (gutterless system). It's just the idea of clamping or crimping the sport roof that does not settle well with me. > Fyi I've considered some of the other options (trailer, a second > car, etc.) and a rack solution would be the best one for my needs > if it safely be made to work. If all else fails, get a second car... atleast a beater. Make it a beater Toyota Corolla station wagon. It made an excellent surf car for Hawaii. Roomy. fold down rear seat... well a windsurf board is a wee bit big. Hmmm... how about trying regular surfing (just kidding). And to top it off... if it is too small you can mount a rack system on these without worrying about your sport-roof > Any suggestions? Have you tried checking Yakima (I think their phone number is 1-800-4YAKIMA). They are usually really good on developing different roof-rack mounts. Or another option would be to check out Thules, and ROLA (kind of stylish). Try to contact their technical assistance for more information. The racks I am familiar with when I was working for a bike shop in Hawaii were Yakimas. They manufacture racks for a majority of cars. I do recall that they do not recommend the rack system if you have a glass top namely t-roofs and sport tops (i.e. corvettes). If you have any other question please feel free to email me or drop on by to your local bike/surf shops. They should brochures and info regarding the brands I mentioned. Thanks, Allan Chen Silicon Graphics Inc. Mountain View, CA allanc@sgi.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 09:55:03 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Engine Information/format.. Okay, here is a (sample) possible format of the information which I am volunteering to collect. If anyone has suggestions, or comments send them to me, and I will revamp the list. ============================================================================= ENGINE:3S-GTE or is that 3SGTE TYPE: Turbo and Intercooled 4. Iron Block, Alloy Head BORE x STROKE: 86 x 86 mm DISPLACEMENT: 1998 cc's COMPRESSION RATIO: 8.5:1 ECU: Toyota & Port Injection EMISSIONS: 3 Way CC, Feedback Fuel-Air Control. EGR control TURBO: Toyota CT26 POWER: 190 BHP@6000 TORQUE: 190 BHP@3200 REDLINE: Anyone know?? VALVE GEAR: Belt Driven Double over head cams. VALVES/CYCLINDER: 4 VEHICLE: Celica-All Trac from 88?, Turbo MR2 From 90 (?) COMMENTS: Engine is transversly mounted, Cam lobes directly operate valves Do we want to include timing information? -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 10:08:09 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Tuning Toyotas Twin Cam Terror... The Subject line is taken from the cover of the Jan. 94 issue of Car, and Car conversions (British Magazine). Contains useful info, that even "I" didn't know ;-) One point mentioned, was the fact that "the head design, is such that if the belt brakes, there is sufficient tolerances that you *shouldn't* bend a valve". Also the fact that "later 4AG blocks used reinforced "ribs" to eliminate sonic resonance, vs for strength". All in all not a bad article as they compare the FX-16, to MR2, to GTS. -- Roger Smith | Research Computing Services, Software Development | The Hospital for Sick Children, Internet:roger@sickkids.on.ca | Toronto, Canada. (416)-813-5779 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Allan Chen" Date: Fri, 28 Jan 1994 07:21:23 -0800 To: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith), Subject: Re: Engine Information/format.. On Jan 28, 9:55am, Roger Smith wrote: > Subject: Engine Information/format.. > Okay, here is a (sample) possible format of the information which I am > volunteering to collect. If anyone has suggestions, or comments send them > to me, and I will revamp the list. > ============================================================================= > > ENGINE:3S-GTE or is that 3SGTE > TYPE: Turbo and Intercooled 4. Iron Block, Alloy Head > BORE x STROKE: 86 x 86 mm > DISPLACEMENT: 1998 cc's > COMPRESSION RATIO: 8.5:1 > ECU: Toyota & Port Injection > EMISSIONS: 3 Way CC, Feedback Fuel-Air Control. EGR control > TURBO: Toyota CT26 > POWER: 190 BHP@6000 > TORQUE: 190 BHP@3200 > REDLINE: Anyone know?? > VALVE GEAR: Belt Driven Double over head cams. > VALVES/CYCLINDER: 4 > VEHICLE: Celica-All Trac from 88?, Turbo MR2 From 90 (?) > COMMENTS: Engine is transversly mounted, Cam lobes directly operate valves > > Do we want to include timing information? Most certainly... Any information goes a long way. But wouldn't that be in the line of tune-ups? Is this a general information list. If not, could we also include valve lash and spark plug gaps. Allan Chen Silicon Graphics Inc. Mountain View, CA allanc@sgi.com xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 13:42:40 EST From: eyoung1@cosmos.bellcore.com (Errol Young) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com@bellcore.com Subject: Re: new 22R heads > From: Tom Julien > Status: R > > 2. What's involved in putting the 20R in a '74 Celica. Once I believe you > mentioned having to move crossmember #1. I know the pan that's on my > truck 20R is cut different than the Celica 20R's to clear the steering > linkage. Any problems mating the 20R w/ the W50 xmission? Any other mods > necessary? > A couple of my friends who have replaced the 3T-C with the 2TG in their Corollas used the prior engine's oil pump and oil pan. They decided to do this because, if they didn't, they would have had to move the Xmember as you're suggesting.... Just adding my $0.02..... -Errol. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 13:56:30 EST From: eyoung1@cosmos.bellcore.com (Errol Young) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com@bellcore.com Subject: Re: 3TC Motor or Bottom Ends > From: Allen T "Koji" Kam > Message-Id: <9401241430.AA13098@uhunix.uhcc.Hawaii.Edu> > To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com > Subject: 3TC Motor or Bottom Ends > > >Something Koji said gave me cause to wonder... > > >> The 2TG is a direct drop in no crossmember changes if you have a > >>T-series > >> motor because it uses the same bottom end. > > >If the 3TC and the 2TG have the same bottom end, could you just find a > >good 3TC bottom end and then bolt on a 2TG head? > > Yes...Get the Yamaha heads though. Its a better flowing design. > You can bore out the 1.6 2T to a 1.8 3T spec or ever a 13T spec with is a > stock 2.0 motor. Then you can all it a 4TG if you wish... -shrug- > igreed... but, you have to change the pistons..... > >An even better question as far as _my_ pursuits go, can you bold the > >18RG head on a 20 or 22R block? > > Yes.. You can. Same Bottom End block. > Ditto with the previous comment.... -Errol. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 14:08:25 EST From: eyoung1@cosmos.bellcore.com (Errol Young) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com@bellcore.com Subject: Re: 3TC Motors... > From: Allen T "Koji" Kam > Subject: 3TC Motors... > > The Corolla 3TC motor 1.8 came out in 1976 in the Corolla SR-5 till 1983. > The 3T-C came in Corollas (1.8, DX, SR-5, wagon, etc) from 1980-1982 in the US. The 2T-C was prior and the 4A later. > The 2TG is a direct drop in no crossmember changes if you have a T-series motor > because it uses the same bottom end. > Depending on which one you get, the oil pan and oil pump may need to be changed. The older 2T-G's come with the same oil pan and pump as the 2T-C's while the 2T-GE* (2TGE and 2TGEU) came with the 3T-C's. > The 2TG is obviously Twin cam motor. A Old techonology that still works and it > works VERY well. You can make the 2TG put put some 200HP with it set up > properly. > 8-valve twin cam producing 120HP stock. Unfortunately, it is almost impossible to get one of these anymore... I saw an ad in the "Want Ads" for a Austin Healey (replica) that came with the 2TG. Although the 2T-G is a far superior motor for modifications than the 3T-C or 2T-C, there are companies out there that still sell modification parts for the 2T and 3T that will make them perform close to the 2T-G. Ask Chris Meyers about the Starlet with the 3T-C that he raced last year..... -Errol. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 15:12:42 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Quick note on the way out the door... Sorry I didn't get time to post my results from last weeks race. Short story: Started 25 of 27, finished second. Had first, but let a 200SX dart under me with a lap and a half to go. Decided not to try to get it back, since by holding on I got 2nd place (best finish ever) and $25! Big bucks in this class. I'm on my way to go racing again tonight. Hope to do a better job of letting folks know how this one goes. See ya! Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: Gary H To: stan@tta.com, toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: MR-2 fiberglass? Date: Fri, 28 Jan 94 14:50:37 PST From: stan@tta.com (Stan Hanks) > >Anyone know of fiberglass fenders, deck lids, etc. for MR-2? We're >building an E-Production race car and want to cut weight... Yes, Mitcom sells kits for Toys. I was looking at prices yesterday since I have to replace my side skirt and front airdam. Their number is 213-638-0588 and they go by the name of either Mitcom or Prototype Plastics. I gave up on trying to get someone to fix my side skirt and airdam. I'll just buy brand new ones, but am hesitating because I don't want to spend $400 on an 82 Celica with 96 HP! It's only cosmetic. The jobber cost is only about $260. When I ordered my entire areo kit from Mitcom, I got a deal from a friend who ordered me the parts at jobber's price and I paid him $50 as profit. Is anyone willing to do the above for me? >Not on this list so *PLEASE* direct e-mail me if you have answers. I decided to post this on the list in case anyone else has comments on the above since I am looking to buy fiberglass parts soon. Gary xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan" Subject: Testing HP To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com (mods) Date: Sat, 29 Jan 1994 12:53:09 +0800 (WST) Anyone know of a way of approximating HP? I'm wondering how much punch I'm pulling now after my mods. Obviously, I don't have / have access to a dyno machine. Ideas? find about a hundred horses.. get a harness... bentan '79 Corolla KE30 xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan" Subject: Re: Timing issues revisited To: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) Date: Sat, 29 Jan 1994 09:05:11 +0800 (WST) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com > 3 weeks ago I wrote a rambling treatise (sp?) on timing. Since then I > have found a tool that no racer should be without. A buddy of mine, who > is a full time Nissan Mechanic and nearly full time racer, has a great > timing light. On the back is a knob where you can "dial in" your > desired timing rate. Remember that I said that timing on a race car is > best set at operating speeds? Note however that the timing marks on > your car (if there are any) are only applicable for timing the car at > idle, not at the 35-40 degrees of advance necessary at high speed. With > this timing light, if you want to set your timing at 38 degrees, you set > the knob on the light at 38 degrees, and then rev the engine to whatever > speed you desire to check your timing at. When your timing mark on the > pulley lines up with the 0 degree marker, you are at 38 degrees (or > wherever you set the knob.) Cool, eh? Question now is how do I estimate (or calculate, or just guess) what timing I want at what speed. Is there a formula for this or is it another black art? On another, but related note, what's the best (easiest?) way to tell that the engine is starting to ping? My hearing ain't so good.. bentan xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 13:26:42 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Testing HP > Anyone know of a way of approximating HP? I'm wondering how much punch I'm > pulling now after my mods. Obviously, I don't have / have access to a dyno > machine. Ideas? > > find about a hundred horses.. get a harness... > > bentan > '79 Corolla KE30 I recently found out that Analog Devices is selling an "accelerometer on a chip". Not sure about price or availability, but I have been doing some thinking on the subject. Seems like you could build a little board with one of these chips, an rpm pickup, and a RS-232 port, and plug it into a portable computer. My thinking is that you could then get a torque vs RPM readout in each gear. Obviously this doesn't precisely quantify torque in ft-lbs or anything, nor does it give you horsepower. But it would give you a fine way of determining where to shift in each gear to get maximum acceleration, which is really more useful (other than for bragging purposes) than raw horsepower readings, anyway. For Circle track racing, by knowing precisely what your torque curve looks like, you can dial in your gear ratio to fit the track precisely! (BTW, if any of you guys develop this idea and make a bunch of money, I expect a cut!) Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 13:32:10 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Toyota Mods Machine went down... After I went home Friday, they shut down all of our machines because the Air Conditioner was going to be down for maintenance. Usually I would send out some mail and warn everyone, but as I mentioned, I was already gone when they decided to do so. Sorry for any inconvenience it may have caused you... Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 10:53:24 PST From: lung@San-Jose.ate.slb.com (Aaron Lung) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Testing HP Chris sez: }I recently found out that Analog Devices is selling an "accelerometer on }a chip". Not sure about price or availability, but I have been doing }some thinking on the subject. If you can sweet talk a AD salesdroid rep, you might be able to get a few as freebie 'evaluation' samples! } Seems like you could build a little board }with one of these chips, an rpm pickup, and a RS-232 port, and plug it }into a portable computer. My thinking is that you could then get a }torque vs RPM readout in each gear. Actually, you can extend this idea even further. Take your rpms and which gear you're in, you can derive velocity and acceleration since you know what the gear ratios are. The accelerometer can be used to take lateral forces, etc. All this data can be pumped into a laptop or something in the car and logged into the memory/disk as a histogram for review and analysis later. You can even generate those neato-keen velocity vs. time charts that C&D magazine always have. Actually, one of my friends did this with a microcontroller. He basically tapped into his Tercel and rigged it up with LCD display and included it as 'an on-board computer'. Being the 'nerd' he was :-) , he computed his velocity and 0-60 times with floating-point(!) to some riduculous accuracy. (Kinda senseless if you asked me) It makes a fun senior-thesis type project in any case if you can get away with it. Actually, now that I think of it, I can see why cars with on-board computers such as those in BMW's don't give you the option of measuring 0-60 times or whatever, even though they're perfectly capable of doing so. }(BTW, if any of you guys develop this idea and make a bunch of money, I }expect a cut!) Hey! Me too! ;-) aaron xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 14:27:17 EST From: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: power steering mods Does anyone have any experience modifying the power steering on a Supra. I find I can 'beat it' in a fast slalom. I am wondering what, if anything, can be done to beef it up, or maybe it is getting old and needs new seals or something? I don't know where to start with it though! Jon xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 31 Jan 1994 17:04:07 -0500 To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com From: roger@resunix.ri.sickkids.on.ca (Roger Smith) Subject: Testing HP First off, my computer went away, (due to disk problems) on Friday, so I will be a little slow in responding to some of the mail re:Engine Database. With regards to measuring HP, in some of the C&D magazines (CICA 1988) which I cleared out of my parents "Basement" over christmas, were ads for the G-Analyst by Valentine Research (Makers of the Valentine-1 Radar Detector), I called Valentine Research earlier today (1-800-331-3030) and spoke to someone who said "ah--yeah we still make the device, however we are expecting some parts, and probably won't be able to ship one before March 1 (1994 -- Valentine research normally has a long waiting list for its products). The G-Analyst sells for US $379. While I don't think it provides HP readouts, I believe it is capable of telling you info on how much faster through that "S" bend you are as a result of different techniques/modifications. I'll try to find the AD later tonight. (I obtained the info for the 3SGTE from same (CICA 88) C&D magazine) xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 16:22:41 EST From: cmyer@su102a.ess.harris.com (Chris Myer) To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: Testing HP > With regards to measuring HP, in some of the C&D magazines (CICA > 1988) which I cleared out of my parents "Basement" over christmas, were > ads for the G-Analyst by Valentine Research (Makers of the Valentine-1 > Radar Detector), I called Valentine Research earlier today (1-800-331-3030) > and spoke to someone who said "ah--yeah we still make the device, however > we are expecting some parts, and probably won't be able to ship one before > March 1 (1994 -- Valentine research normally has a long waiting list for > its products). The G-Analyst sells for US $379. While I don't think it > provides HP readouts, I believe it is capable of telling you info on how > much faster through that "S" bend you are as a result of different > techniques/modifications. I'll try to find the AD later tonight. (I > obtained the info for the 3SGTE from same (CICA 88) C&D magazine) Been there, done that. I have a G-Analyst, and it is a nifty tool, although it is a little pricey. I probably should have mentioned it in my last post, but if this "accelerometer on a chip" is half as good as it seems, I think the average CS/EE/internet user should be able to rig up a _better_ setup for far less. All the G analyst tells you is the number of "G"s the car is pulling, and it does it via a low resolution LCD screen. Even if you just made a setup where this Analog Devices chip was printing only G info, you could get a lot better resolution. Plus, by adding a little creativity, you could find a way to "trigger" your readings, so that you could do side-by-side comparasons of changes in suspension setup. Anybody out there sleeping with an AD rep and can get us some samples? (Of the accelerometer, not of the "sleeping with"!) :-) Chris xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To: hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) Cc: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Subject: Re: power steering mods Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 13:38:54 -0800 From: danapple@vicor.com > hacker@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker 21420) writes: > Does anyone have any experience modifying the power steering on a > Supra. I find I can 'beat it' in a fast slalom. I am wondering what, > if anything, can be done to beef it up, or maybe it is getting old and > needs new seals or something? I don't know where to start with it > though! I have the same problem. My '86 had 90,000 miles on it, but somehow I don't think it's the seals. One review in 1985 said the Supra (when new) had an underpowered steering pump. In the slalom test, they were able to get ahead. In autocrosses, I find the problem is worst at the first turn, usually 20 feet from the starting line. Full throttle, but low RPM. One idea I had, which I never pursued, is that the Supra has a vacuum controlled boost level. When there is least vacuum, there is least boost. The idea being that at high speeds, there is less vacuum, and you want less boost. It may be completely speed (vs. throttle) sensitive, though. Anyway, you might want to look into modifying the vacuum controls to the power steering pump. On the other hand, this may not be fixable. How about putting a manual rack in? I've been thinking about that, but I do like the power steering in parking lots. > Jon Dan. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx From: arvidj@aol.com To: toyota-mods@su102a.ess.harris.com Date: Mon, 31 Jan 94 19:49:09 EST Subject: Re: Testing HP Chris, My G-Analyst came with a serial port that I can then hook to a portable PC (or Mac, for the Apple people in the crowd). It works in 'real time', at 2400 baud, so you get .1 second samples of what ever you have on the screen. The resolution is the standard .1g over a 0 to 2.54g max rating. I admit I would want better than that, but am not sure I'm willing to go to all the trouble of making a device to do it. My driving is based upon an error factor of at least 10%, so having data to .1% is sufficient for the time being. Arvid. p.s. The Mac software shipped as an extra cost accessory to the G-Analyst SUCKS. If that was the best they could do, they should have NEVER admitted they had it. The G-Analyst, and my Valentine-1 Radar detector, both appear to have great hardware quality though. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx