^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^ ^^^
^^^ _______ ^^^
^^^ ,' - _ ^^^
^^^ ________,'__________>>> - _ ^ ^^^
^^^ , ' | ^^^
^^^ ~I~ I~I \ / I~I ~I~ .~. _ I\/I I~I I~\ <~ ^^^
^^^ I I_I | I_I I I~I I I I_I I_/ _> ^^^
^^^ `---\__/----------------\__/----' ^^^
^^^ ^^^
^^^ P O S T I N G S Oct 1995 ^^^
^^^ --------------------------- ^^^
^^^ ^^^
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: your mail
To: terlau@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Craig A Terlau)
Date: Sun, 1 Oct 1995 01:56:46 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> Most importantly..........Where did you get the 5K??? and how do you like
> it? I want the full report. In what ways is it different that the 3 or
> 4K? Does it have hydraulic lifters? Is it noticably more powerfull?
5K is 1496cc, used in at least LiteAce vans.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Sun, 1 Oct 1995 14:43:15 +0800 (WST)
From: Travis Morien
To: Gary Hong
Cc: garyh@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, byrd@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Subject: Re: water freezing (was Cooling fuel/Turbo adjustment)
On Fri, 29 Sep 1995, Gary Hong wrote:
> From: Travis Morien
> >On Thu, 28 Sep 1995, Gary Hong wrote:
> >> You are both wrong :). Liquid explands when it gets to it's freezing point.
> >> Try this at home if you like. Fill a jar all the way to the top with water
> >> then cap it and throw it in the freezer. In the morning you'll ssee resuts
> >> of liquid expansion at work.
> >>
> >> Gary
> >>
> >Sorry guys, but I think I'll just break in here. I study physics and
> >chemistry at university. (only 2nd year.. 8( )
>
> Actually, nothing Dick or I said was wrong.
>
> Gary
>
Perhaps, but I was under the impression we were originally talking about
FUEL. If you freeze petrol, petrol ice would sink to the bottom and the
volume of the frozen fuel is smaller than the liquid. ok with you guys?
8) See ya.
Travis
MKI MR2.
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Date: Sun, 1 Oct 1995 05:09:16 -0500
From: rande@qni.com
Subject: me/mine/mods
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Name : Randy Eickhoff
Location: Kansas City, MO
Model : 1991 MR2 Turbo
Engine : 3S-GTE
Mods : Tokico Illumina adjustable shocks
K&N Filter
Schroth harness
MSW Type 44 wheels
BF Goodrich Comp TA R1 race tire for autocross
Email : rande@qni.com
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From: Gary Hong
To: phantom@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: water freezing (was Cooling fuel/Turbo adjustment)
Cc: byrd@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, garyh@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Date: Sun, 1 Oct 95 5:06:16 PDT
From: Travis Morien
>
>On Fri, 29 Sep 1995, Gary Hong wrote:
>
>> From: Travis Morien
>> >On Thu, 28 Sep 1995, Gary Hong wrote:
>> >> You are both wrong :). Liquid explands when it gets to it's freezing point.
>> >> Try this at home if you like. Fill a jar all the way to the top with water
>> >> then cap it and throw it in the freezer. In the morning you'll ssee resuts
>> >> of liquid expansion at work.
>> >>
>> >> Gary
>> >>
>> >Sorry guys, but I think I'll just break in here. I study physics and
>> >chemistry at university. (only 2nd year.. 8( )
>>
>> Actually, nothing Dick or I said was wrong.
>>
>> Gary
>>
>Perhaps, but I was under the impression we were originally talking about
>FUEL. If you freeze petrol, petrol ice would sink to the bottom and the
>volume of the frozen fuel is smaller than the liquid. ok with you guys?
>8) See ya.
> Travis
>MKI MR2.
Ok with me. When I saw a posting saying that liquid compresses when cold,
I was thinking, "that ain't true! Freeze water and see what happens."
Obviously, this is a car group and you guys were talking aboug fuel, not
water. Never assume :).
Gary
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Date: Sun, 1 Oct 1995 13:13:15 -0700
To: "ROGERS" ,
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: Re[2]: ME/MINE/MODS. He's back!
At 10:41 AM 9/29/95 -0400, ROGERS wrote:
>
>Subject: Re: ME/MINE/MODS. He's back!
>From: Aric Shen at Internet
>Date: 9/28/95 2:20 AM
>
>A brief background ...
>I suspect most builders use the extrude hone process where you flow a thick
>"sand like" material throught the head. The one head I saw, had port surfaces
>almost mirror like smooth on the intake side. Let me emphasize this I COULD
NOT
>SEE THE GRAIN or any defects in the port passages. That in conjunction with a
>flow bench is the secret. Basically you try to eliminate any "sharp"
corners in
>the intake ports, and to get the ports volumetrically equivalent.
I've been told to stay away from Extrude Hone because the "ooze" that flows
through your head does not actually "know" where to go. Basically, it will
take material off where ever it hits, not necessarily where it needs to be
taken off. I read some article about it in Turbo Magazine when they did a
hand-port vs. an Extrude Hone port on a Mustang head.
>
>Porting for a big valve naturally aspirated head requires a different
>methodology to a turbo charged one. A good source of info is one the countless
>english magazines that like to give in depth articles on how to port the 4
>cyclinder turbo ford cosworth engine. Car and car conversions has tons of
>articles on this.
Thanks.. I'll have to check that out..
>
>Regading building an 8500 RPM engine, the main thing is reliability of the
>crank shaft and connecting rod strength. The newer 4AGE's (90+) crank and con
>rods can take 8500 RPM no sweat (mine does) If you have a 4AGZe, then you are
>safe for 9000. The reason TRD sells a $25xx crank shaft is because the
atlantic
>engines are in the 6000- 9500 rev range continuously. Buying a billet crank if
>you are not racing on a professional level is a waste of money (IMHO)
I actually do have a 4AGZ motor (just not in the car).. did you do any
machining on your stock rods ? or would you if you were to rebuild it using
stock rods ? The thought of buying a $2500 crank NEVER entered my mind..
although Crower in San Diego said they would make one for $2000.. :) I
figure if your crankshaft breaks.. you are doing something wrong.. or
something the motor was never intended to do..
>The ability to rev high and make useful power comes strictly from the head.
You
>have to balance the cams to the porting strategy. Note if you are building a
>race engine which tends to have a narrow power range, you have to sacrifice
low
>end response for high end response. There's no free lunch!
What cams are you using ? or what cams would you suggest ? I am probably go
with a 264 intake and 272 exhaust.. only because I got the 272 for $150
brand new.. what do you think ?
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Date: Sun, 1 Oct 1995 13:29:20 -0700
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: Returned mail: Host unknown (Name server: gatewy.uucp.:
>>A brief background ...
>
>>I suspect most builders use the extrude hone process where you flow a thick
>>"sand like" material throught the head. The one head I saw, had port surfaces
>>almost mirror like smooth on the intake side. Let me emphasize this I COULD
>NOT
>>SEE THE GRAIN or any defects in the port passages. That in conjunction with a
>>flow bench is the secret. Basically you try to eliminate any "sharp"
>corners in
>>the intake ports, and to get the ports volumetrically equivalent.
I've been told to stay away from Extrude Hone because the "ooze" that flow
through your head does not actually "know" where to go. Basically, it will
take material off where ever it hits, not necessarily where it needs to be
taken off. I read some article about it in Turbo Magazine when they did a
hand-port vs. an Extrude Hone port on a Mustang head.
>>
>>Porting for a big valve naturally aspirated head requires a different
>>methodology to a turbo charged one. A good source of info is one the
countless
>>english magazines that like to give in depth articles on how to port the 4
>>cyclinder turbo ford cosworth engine. Car and car conversions has tons of
>>articles on this.
Thanks.. I'll have to check that out..
>>
>>Regading building an 8500 RPM engine, the main thing is reliability of the
>>crank shaft and connecting rod strength. The newer 4AGE's (90+) crank and con
>>rods can take 8500 RPM no sweat (mine does) If you have a 4AGZe, then you are
>>safe for 9000. The reason TRD sells a $25xx crank shaft is because the
atlantic
>>engines are in the 6000- 9500 rev range continuously. Buying a billet
crank if
>>you are not racing on a professional level is a waste of money (IMHO)
I actually do have a 4AGZ motor (just not in the car).. did you do any
machining on your stock rods ? or would you if you were to rebuild it using
stock rods ? The thought of buying a $2500 crank NEVER entered my mind..
although Crower in San Diego said they would make one for $2000.. :) I
figure if your crankshaft breaks.. you are doing something wrong.. or
something the motor was never intended to do..
>>The ability to rev high and make useful power comes strictly from the head.
>You have to balance the cams to the porting strategy. Note if you are
building a
>>race engine which tends to have a narrow power range, you have to sacrifice
>>low end response for high end response. There's no free lunch!
What cams are you using ? or what cams would you suggest ? I am probably go
with a 264 intake and 272 exhaust.. only because I got the 272 for $150
brand new.. what do you think ?
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: Pictures of Toyota Engines
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 1995 00:25:47 +0200 (EET)
> > BTW, What version is the 4T-GTEU? I'm not aware of it ever being available
> > to the general public, just know of the Group B & Group C versions for
> > racing.
>
> The picture I have shows it in a production car, not a rally/race car. It
> shows the twin plugs, turbo plumbing, no intercooler, etc. Definitely rear
> wheel drive. According to the book, it was available only in 1982. I don't
> know what model. I would guess it's the same model that had the 3T-GTEU.
I'd guess the picture is of a Celica.
> The 3T-GTEU is listed as being in models with the "1800 GT-T" and "1800
> GT-TR" suffix. The 4T-GTEU is listed as being in the models with the "1800
> GT-TS" suffix.
I haven't seen GT-TS listed anywhere. It must have been a very limited
production. Any idea what distinguishes GT-TR from GT-T?
> Here are listed specs:
>
> 3T-GTEU 4T-GTEU
>
> Displacement 1770 cc 1791 cc
> Bore 85.0 mm 85.5 mm
> Stroke 78.0 mm 78.0 mm
> Comp ratio 7.8:1 7.8:1
> Power 160 PS / 6000 rpm for both
> Torque 21.0 kg-m / 4800 rpm for both
>
> Maybe this engine was used in limited production in order to qualify for use
> in a rally car. I need a Japanese interpreter!
I think you're right. Odd that this 4T-GTEU is only 1791cc, instead of
the 2090cc Group B/Group C versions. I wonder what else is different
in the 4T-GTEU compared to 3T-GTEU, otherwise it looks just the same
as mine except some emissions equipment which seems to be missing
in my car ;) I would have expected an upgraded turbo and such, but
I can't see that in the picture. That should have been reflected in
the power/torque figures as well...
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Sun, 1 Oct 1995 20:12:55 -0400
From: Brent Matthew Dye
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re:Dirk is too flattering!
Dirk,
I'm glad you appriciated my advise on whether to buy the 93T in Canada.
I'm not really THAT wise! I just know a lot about the MkII's (as I should,
being an owner of one). That $7000 markup sounds painful, though! If you knew
that I was a Pittsburgh Penguins fan, you probably wouldn't have that much
respect for me anyway. I'm not bandwagon, my family lives in Pittsburgh. How
about that Lemieux, huh?
(Sorry if I've offended anyone by getting off the subject of MR2's.)
--
-Brent Dye- Columbus, OH Personal Mail:bd112593@oak.cats.ohiou.edu
(Fully Loaded) Super Red 94 Turbo @16.1k or bdye@bobcat.ohiou.edu
AKA:Red Sled Lic plate:MISTR 2
Happiest on:sunny day, tops out, @7250rpm with 10 psi boost
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From: EXPORTER@delphi.com
Date: Sun, 01 Oct 1995 21:48:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: posting
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Name: Rick Dormoi
Location: Philadelphia PA, USA
model : 1977 hatch, & 76 Coupe Celicas
Engine: 20-R,s
Mods : engine,suspention, too many to list.
Email: exporter@delphi.com
help
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Date: Mon, 2 Oct 1995 00:43:52 -0700
To: Matti Kalalahti
From: di88429@goodnet.com (James Collins)
Subject: Re: Pictures of Toyota Engines
Cc: Toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>production. Any idea what distinguishes GT-TR from GT-T?
>
When I lived in Japan, my mom owned a 84' Carina GT-TR (Automatic, sadly)
well anyways, i think the difference is that the GT-TR comes with power
everything (locks, windows, etc..)
James
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From: Okelo@aol.com
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 1995 10:20:18 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: me/mine/mods
Corey Nakatani
Vineland, NJ
1987 Toyota Supra Turbo
7MGTE
Turbonetics turbo upgrade, K&N FIPK, Magnecor Wires, HKS: VBC, PFC FCON, TEMS
controller, Tokico Illuminas, Eibach Springs, ST sway bars, GAB strut tower
brace, full rollcage.
okelo@aol.com
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From: Jay_Kopycinski-RYNA10@email.sps.mot.com
Date: 2 Oct 95 10:39:57 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: What does a 1980 Celica Sup
What does a 1980 Celica Supra weigh?
Can anybody tell me what the weight of a 1980 Celica Supra is?
Appreciate any info.
Jay
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Fuel problem solved!
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 03:04:02 +0200 (EET)
Hi all, I already tried sending story about this but Murphy's law
applied and it ended up in /dev/null...
Thanks to everybody who replied to my questions, I decided to
first try connecting the pumps in series.
Tuesday. Rains cats, dogs and other small house animals, generally
like Florida when hurricane hits, except here it was cold too (46F).
No way I'm installing a fuel pump in this weather, so I only got
most of the wiring done. 2V drop in wires for just one pump wasn't
quite satisfactory...
Wednesday. Breakfast at noon, then off to the parking lot.
Now, there isn't that much room while I'm working under the fuel tank,
a generous inch above my waist is about it... First problem was:
where to mount the fuel pump? Right next to the original pump
(above the lateral body structure beam above differential) was just
enought room to mount the second one. If I would have had enough room
to get both of my hands where I wanted, this would have been much
faster, easier and less painful task... Then routed the fuel hoses,
which surprisingly was managable with the hoses I had. The hose going
towards the fuel rail was the only problematic at this point, I had
to momentarily take the end slightly lower, which was greeted by
a flow of nice, fresh fuel right on my hands. Remember, that I was
lying under the car, with minimal room to move and my face right under
the fuel pumps, undercoating, dust and rust conviniently dropping on
my face. Once the hoses were connected I made a remark in my mind to
tie the hoses better to some point ot the bodywork as not to let
them hang there and get caught anywhere. It was time to finish the
installation and connect rest of the wiring. Disconnect the battery
ground wire? Never [zzzzap!] heard of that ;)
Time to start testing! With engine off, fuel pumps running we first
tested the zero flow pressure, by pinching the fuel return line
closed. Well, I didn't even pinch it fully closed once Tero was
shouting "Enough, enough!!" and I could see that myself too, as
fuel started spraying from the pressure meter hose connections...
Well, it was over 7bar (102psi), vs the 2.9bar (42psi) of the old pump.
Looks promising at this point, and Tero is jumping like a
[grease?]monkey all over the place to get into on-the-road testing.
So I gather the tools and off we go. What's that knocking noise coming
from the back? Odd theories get exchanged, and we stop on the side
of the road to see if anything seems out of the ordinary. Not with
a quick look, wheel nuts are tight and so on. So we continue, by now
the engine had warmed up enough to get into serious testing at full
power. Once we get moving again, fuel pumps shut off and engine naturally
stops... Burned fuse. Ok, so it didn't quite go ok at first try. We start
the journey back, and after a mile we burn another fuse when I again get
to mild boost. More imaginative theories get exchanged. We decide to
disconnect the old pump wires. Finally, back at the parking lot, and I
punch it in 1st to some mild boost, and seems like we burned another fuse
but actually the fuel delivery just wasn't enough in this setup
for even slight boost as fuel pressure dropped to 1bar...
Reason for the knocking sound is found to be a loose fuel hose/metal
pipe connection hitting the end of the left driveaxle!
Everything seems to be ok, no short circuits. So we look at how much
current the pumps draw. Not that much, about 6A. So back on the road,
once I picked a handful of fuses... Everything works ok for a while,
and I finally get to punch it without problems. Fuel pressure
increases with boost, but at a rate of only about 70% of the
change in intake manifold pressure. This doesn't seem to be a problem
though, as mixture stays very good at 945-930mV at full throttle.
After a few weeks of being forced to stay off high boost, it was
a glorious experience to finally again rev it up to 7000rpm at full
1.2-0.9bar (17.5-13psi) boost. 3x the posted limit comes quick this way ;)
Fuel pressure got up to a maximum of 3.4bar at 1.2bar of boost.
The mixture is slightly better than it used to be when the original
pump was working well, so it really seems that it was maxing out.
The fuel pump noise decreased to acceptable level with the two pump
setup when both are running. While testing with just the old
pump running, the whine was horrible. So this might be a lasting
setup with enough capacity for future needs.
Soon after this, another fuse blows. And another after 300ft.
And another right after it. So we disconnect the wires to new
pump and limp back to the parking lot. No problems.
So it's time to go under the car and try to locate reason for
blowing fuses. Finally it is found to be the wire that got
routed above the beam which differential is hanging from.
This beam moved enough under acceleration that it squashed the
wire to the body, and caused a short every now and then.
After re-routing this wire, no electrical problems.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Track day report =)
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 03:05:37 +0200 (EET)
Thursday. Time for the awaited Ahvenisto track day (twice a year tradition
of the university motoring club TTMK). We had the good intention of
bringing a video camera with us, but that did not happen as the friend
who was supposed to arrange on proved once again to have no arrangement
capabilities whatsoever... So after one hour wasted while he ate and
trying to pick up a camera, we were late already and it was time to
get going. Eppu had just got
new front shock absorbers for Battleship Buick [tm], but we didn't have
enough time to fight witht the installation.
Tero's Alfa limped there
with a defective voltage regulator, and burnt the remaining headlight
on the way there. So what, it needs electricity for just the ignition
nowadays...
Luckily, I find out, that the first fuel filter (non-pressurized one)
had dropped from it mounting and had been hitting the right driveaxle,
before it had been carved through.
Once near Ahvenisto, it's time to fill the tank and bump up the
tyre pressures, 41psi all around. We arrive in time for the second
half hour session of three reserved for cars (motorcycles get their
own sessions).
A cool anecdote: the occasional explosions (when lifting off
the throttle from full boost and back on) in the rear muffler
are visible in broad daylight to drivers behind me ;)
Almost none of you know what kind of track Ahvenisto is.
It's 2.8km (1.7miles) long, with lots of low-speed corners
and almost very short straights, high altitude differences, very
hilly track. Definately a track where handling makes the difference.
I'm already sure by now that I can afford two fast laps in series
before the brakes fade... So I go for the warm-up lap, and
try to leave enough room between myself and the red Golf.
So I get to the corner before the main straights, and go for it!
Damn it, I reach the Golf at the end of the straights already,
and have to pass it on the inside line... I go past the pitlane
at nearly 90mph, and brake for the uphill left-hand corner -
hey, I could've taken that faster! I for sure didn't take that
hill at 65mph before...Then right-hand curve to downhill, and to
my dismay I'm approaching the rear end of green Range Rover...
shit, I can't pass it before the notorious 120degree left-hander,
and I'm stuck behind it until we came out of it. Once past, quick
move back to the right line, and brake for the 60mph left-hander.
Once again I don't quite use the whole track. It didn't handle
even nearly this well before! Now it's time for the series of
the tight curves, which I decide to take on 2nd gear. Get the
rear slightly out with engine braking, then punch it and get
the power oversteer through the first two left/right corners, under
the bridge and for a short while to 3rd gear (>60mph), and back
to 2nd, through the next two left/right corners with power oversteer,
this year now excessive inside rear wheel smoking, just
5% or so of wheelspin with both rear tyres. Off toward the
straights, 3rd, 4th, 90mph, brake slightly, back on throttle,
right to the edge of the track at 95mph, then on the brakes
for the 65-70mph right-hander first uphill, then downhill,
front tyres not happy at this point, takes some persuasion
to make the turn, then accelerate once again past the pitlane.
Second fast lap I had to pass even more traffic, like the previously
fast late model BMW 318 with modified front suspension (very nice, I
rode with that one last time)... the driver of that one is a real
nuttah, no mercy ;) Brakes fade near the end of this second fast lap.
After that lap a cool-down lap, and off to hear how good I actually had
been. 1:48.2 was the answer. I'm quite happy with that, I could have been
about 2-3 seconds faster without the other traffic. And my time last
September had been 1:56, which I was not happy at all about...
that was with dead front shocks, less boost (160hp) and crappy Continental
175/70HR14's. So Koni, LSD, BFG 195/50ZR15 and 35-40hp more (195-200hp)
pulled me from the mid-field to the front runners. With my time
I was 3rd fastest, behind the Escort (very serious, tested several
headers and such on the track, just under 1:46) and the faster
Golf GTi (1:47.8). The next two were the BMW 318 (1:48.8, 225/50R16,
2-3 degrees negative front camber, good brakes) and
Tero's Alfa (finally beat him on the track, 1:49.1 - 205/50R15,
3 degrees negative front camber, stiffer springs, Mintex brakes, 150hp,
200lbs less weight than Carina. First time we both ran 1:56/1:54.2, then
1:56/1:50 - he improved with more power, 195/60R15 tyres and more negative
camber, I ran with similar setups at both times).
So next time improvement will be sought with negative camber to front
(2-3 degrees, now at 0), stiffer springs, and hopefully about 260hp
of power.
Some drivers had spins or slight offs on the track, among
them Porche 924 which spun in front of Buick - no damage.
I only slipped one rear tyre off the track when Tero was riding
with me, it seemed to be more understeering with more weight :(
The only major off was the first fast lap of a Camry V6, which went
to the tyre wall right after the pits. Quite a bit of bodywork
to be replaced there, but he was able to drive home.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: What does a 1980 Celica Sup
To: Jay_Kopycinski-RYNA10@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 03:37:09 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> What does a 1980 Celica Supra weigh?
> Can anybody tell me what the weight of a 1980 Celica Supra is?
Curb weight 1314kg, 2895lbs.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Mon, 02 Oct 1995 20:49:13 -0500 (CDT)
From: kiksta@utxvms.cc.utexas.edu (Seth Willenberg)
Subject: Exhaust for 1992 MR2 Turbo
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
I am looking for the exhaust sytem that will give me the most bang for my
buck. I am currently searching for the most cost-effective, well-proven
and well-manufactured cat-back system. I have thus far received estimates
in the neighborhood of $400 for such a system by HKS (the best?). Is this
a good price? If not, where can I go to get a competitive price? What
other good brands have you seen/heard of? Does anyone have specific
experience with any particular products? What were the ACTUAL performance
gains?
Any help is greatly appreciated, and ANXIOUSLY anticipated.
Thanks in advance,
Seth.
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Date: Mon, 2 Oct 1995 23:22:31 -0700
To: kiksta@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Seth Willenberg),
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: Exhaust for 1992 MR2 Turbo
At 08:49 PM 10/2/95 -0500, Seth Willenberg wrote:
>I am looking for the exhaust sytem that will give me the most bang for my
>buck. I am currently searching for the most cost-effective, well-proven
>and well-manufactured cat-back system. I have thus far received estimates
>in the neighborhood of $400 for such a system by HKS (the best?). Is this
>a good price? If not, where can I go to get a competitive price? What
>other good brands have you seen/heard of? Does anyone have specific
>experience with any particular products? What were the ACTUAL performance
>gains?
>
>Any help is greatly appreciated, and ANXIOUSLY anticipated.
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Seth.
>
Give Dynamic Autosports a call.. I've always had good luck with them :)
(714) 457-1234, ask for Ed, tell him Aric sent you.. and yeah, get the HKS..
the Trust/Greddy stuff seems (to me) overpriced and most importantly, ugly..
you might want to check to see if he has an RS*R available for your car..
the RS*Rs are usually fairly quiet (good or bad) and look pretty good..
% Aric Shen
% Speedline Racing Concepts
% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
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To: michael kronvold
Cc: "toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com"
From: "john.limcangco"
Date: 3 Oct 95 9:45:40
Subject: RE: fuel going, going, gone...
Michael Kronvold writes:
> I have been meaning to test this theory: When the tank is
> low on fuel and I notice the performance loss, Open the cap
> and let the air equalize (do you hear a rush of air when you
> open your cap to fill your tank? I do.) Then get back in
> and drive and see if this effects things.
I do hear a rush of air when I open the gas cap. The 'rush' seems stronger
when the tank is almost empty. I've always had this 'rush' even before I
started doing mods to my engine... however, back then, I didn't feel any
difference.
So, I'm convinced that its the tank's breather. Where is this breather? How
do I unclog it? Do I have to drain the tank? Is it worth it? Maybe I should
just file it in my car's 'special instructions' manual. ( Item # 56 - When the
tank is half full, 'burp' the gas tank...) ; )
John Limcangco
Manila, Philippines
79 Cressida 18R-G
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Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 12:49:45 -0400
From: Brent Matthew Dye
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Quid=Pound?
I guess you learn something new everyday! I'm not much of a Benny Hill
fan, but I love Monty Python. Guess I could have looked up 'quid' in the
dictionary and saved myself the embarassment :). Never heard Monty's cast say
that one before. Matter of fact, never heard any of my college professors
(English) say that either. Never took an Econ class with one though...
Mine just misspell words like liter, meter, airplane, etc. You Brits are
funny... I always wondered how you guys learned the American Revolution in your
history classes.
Anyway, good luck with your newly installed fire extinguisher... hope you never
have to use it.
Yanky
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Date: Tue, 03 Oct 1995 11:27:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: Re: your mail
To: "toyota-mods@cyberauto.com"
Cc: Craig A Terlau
Peter writes:
>STOP PRESS : If anyone's interested, just picked up a copy of "Hot 4's
>& Performance Cars" here in Aust. It's got a KE30 with a 3T-GTEU in
>it! First one I've ever seen. Gonna make for some interesting
>reading. Looks like a fairly easy fit.
Does anyone know if this magazine is available in the US? I would
like to read this article.
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
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Date: Tue, 03 Oct 1995 11:33:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: Re: Limited slip differential for 1980 Celica
To: "toyota-mods@cyberauto.com"
Cc: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
>>Does anyone know where I can get a limited slip differential for my 1980
>>Celica? Is TRD the only supplier?
>Believe it or not, you'll probably be money ahead to get a Supra rear
>axle and put it under your Celica. The limited slip diffs are so much
>cheaper than those for the Celica that you'll pay for the axle, plus
>you'll get rear disks and a stronger differential to boot.
>Chris
Chris,
This sounds like a good solution. Does this require major modifications to
the body of a 1980 Celica? I would guess that it would.
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
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Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 20:51:03 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: What does a 1980 Celica Sup
>What does a 1980 Celica Supra weigh?
>Can anybody tell me what the weight of a 1980 Celica Supra is?
Jay:
After stripping a significant amount of weight out of my 80 Celica
(non-supra), it weighed 2225 lbs without me in it. That was without
AC, gas tank, heater core, side and rear windows. It was _with_ a
roll cage, however. I think you can safely figure your Supra
(with its larger engine) weighs just under 3000 lbs. No lightweight!
If you want to know for sure, simply go by a public scale. These
usually exist at places like big moving companies that charge by
the pound. You can even get a good idea of the front to rear
weight ratio by getting separate readings with just the front and
just the rear tires on the scale. Check the yellow pages.
Chris
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
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Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 21:41:15 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Limited slip differential for 1980 Celica
>This sounds like a good solution. Does this require major modifications to
>the body of a 1980 Celica? I would guess that it would.
Although I never actually got to do this, I looked at several junked
Supra's for this very reason. Truthfully, I think it would just bolt
right in. Keep in mind that those years of Supra were just a version
of the Celica, so the basic body mounts should be identicle. Just
make sure you get one with the solid rear axle and not the IRS. THAT
would be a job!
Chris
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Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 22:14:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Aaron Buhr
Subject: Update on my poor car
To: Toyota Modifications Mailing List ,
I thought I'd update everyone on how my saga is going. You all
may recall that my engine developed a knock at about 3000 rpm, that my
mechanic diagnosed by ear as being a warped rod. My engine has been
completely torn down now. Apparently the knocking was due to a badly
warped rod bearing. In addition to the single terrible bearing most
of the bearings showed signs of more-than-normal wear. Also the
cylinder wall bore apparently is out of whack, and my head is warped
(hm, maybe multiple meanings there?). Also, both engine motor mounts
are broken. And, as it turns out, when we disassembled the engine we
noticed that a turbo compressor wheel blade was fairly dinged up, and
apparently had left a scratch in the turbine housing. We could grab
the compressor wheel and cause it to touch the housing, which isn't
supposed to happen.
Anyway, the diagnosis by my mechanic and Billy Gulley is that the
engine got too hot, either due to detonation or due to running out of
oil when my turbocharger came completely apart about 6 months ago. As
far as the turbo goes, I sent it back to Turbonetics again and they
said that some debris must have been sucked into the turbo to cause
the blade to get dinged up like that and knock it into the housing.
So that's what went wrong. As far as repair, let's take the turbo
first: Turbonetics is going to repair the wheel and do a "maintenance
kit" on the turbo, i.e. bearings and seals. Cost: $240. Not too bad
I guess.
As far as the engine goes, I am going to have Billy Gulley do his
whole prep on it. As it turned out, the rods and pistons were fine.
The crankshaft is scored because of the bad bearing but Billy thinks
his crankshaft guy can fix it (I hope, that's $750 otherwise). Billy
is going to surface the head to get it flat again. He's going to
have to bore the engine combustion chambers, too, since they're
apparently no longer straight (or something, I'm not clear what he
meant there). Anyway, since he's boring the block I have to get six
new .020-over pistons and rings. We're replacing the rod bearings and
main bearings. Then Billy's going to do the rest of his prep, which
as I understand consists of:
* blueprinting the engine and grinding all parts (rods, crank,
block, head) and balancing them to exacting tolerances for
less resistance
* stress relieving the crank
* shaving excess material off the rods and stress relieving them
* competition 3-angle valve job
* thermal-coat exhaust header
* port intake manifold
* ceramic-coat pistons and combustion chamber for less heat
absorption (equals more power and less risk of heat damage)
All that's going to come to about $2600, labor only. Then when
he's done my mechanic gets it back. My mechanic is going to replace
the motor mounts, replace the clutch, replace the head gasket and head
bolts, replace several hoses and assorted other parts, and reinstall
the engine and turbo. My mechanic's parts and labor (all parts
furnished through my mechanic) are going to come to about $2700. That
plus the turbo is going to be around $5600, not including rental car
charges, shipping and handling of various parts, etc.
I wish I could have afforded the time and money to go with
non-stock parts for pistons, rods, and clutch, but I can't afford
either. I think the pistons and rods will be ok for pretty
high-horsepower applications once Billy's done the stress-relief and
ceramic-coat on them, but I have a feeling the clutch will only last
about a year before it's time to replace it again.
I also wish I had a clearer idea what I could have and should have
done to avoid this. Unfortunately I don't really know what in
particular caused the problems I've had. The best advice I can give
to avoid having the sort of problems I've had is that you have to be
very careful when you start increasing the performance of your car.
>From the number of folks who've done it without problems we know that
well-engineered engines such as in Supras can have their power output
doubled or more without problem. I think the amount of attention and
care you have to provide increases exponentially as the power
increases linearly, though. As you increase power the operational
safety margin decreases drastically, and you have to pay more
attention to make sure the engine stays in happy operating conditions.
I would also suggest that unless you're comfortable experimenting
on your car and dealing with some trial-and-error you should follow as
closely as you can in the footsteps of someone who's already done the
pioneering. In some cases that may mean sticking with a
manufacturer's upgrade plan (i.e. HKS), in other cases it may be just
following the footsteps of another list member. When you set out on
your own and push the envelope of the upgrades you've done, as I have
(rather than only pushing them 90% and leaving some safety margin),
you can get into dangerous territory.
Anyway, if all goes well I hope to have my car back again in about
another two weeks (it's already been down for four). If anyone has
any questions or comments I'd be happy to hear them.
Aaron B.
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Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 22:18:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: Aaron Buhr
Subject: NEEDED! Head Gasket
To: Toyota Modifications Mailing List ,
I just received terrible news from Chris. He says that HKS and Greddy
are back-ordered 6 weeks on 7MGTE head gaskets. I'm in a quandary.
I can't handle rental cars for another 6 weeks. I don't think my
old HKS metal head gasket is in good enough shape to re-use, especially
since we've let it get banged up since we were planning on getting another.
And I don't want to put another stock gasket in, because then my options are
either to drop the boost and have my $9000 worth of modifications be
wasted, or face replacing the head gasket again 6 months down the road.
Does anyone have any special connections that could get me a head
gasket? Or any other ideas?
Aaron B.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 1995 21:55:00 -0700
To: Aaron Buhr ,
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: NEEDED! Head Gasket
At 10:18 PM 10/3/95 -0400, Aaron Buhr wrote:
>
> I just received terrible news from Chris. He says that HKS and Greddy
>are back-ordered 6 weeks on 7MGTE head gaskets. I'm in a quandary.
>I can't handle rental cars for another 6 weeks. I don't think my
>old HKS metal head gasket is in good enough shape to re-use, especially
>since we've let it get banged up since we were planning on getting another.
>And I don't want to put another stock gasket in, because then my options are
>either to drop the boost and have my $9000 worth of modifications be
>wasted, or face replacing the head gasket again 6 months down the road.
>
> Does anyone have any special connections that could get me a head
>gasket? Or any other ideas?
>
>Aaron B.
>
Have you tried calling Lance from Toyomoto in Florida.. he's real big on
Supras.. he might have one laying around..
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Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 01:24:29 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Fred_Oberbuchner@mbnet.mb.ca (Fred Oberbuchner)
Subject: Need help on injectors - 4AGE/4AGZE
Hi all!
I urgently need to know what the part# and specs are for the injectors
in the Supercharged 4AGZE. In particular, I need to know how they compare
to the ones originally in my 88 Corolla GTS (4AGE). From looking at them,
the ones in the 4AGE seem different from "normal" injectors.
The 4AGE ones seem to have a "cap" over the business end of the injector which
would apparently split the fuel "jet" into 2 "jets". The larger injectors
out of an early Supra we looked at did not have this cap. (sorry if
terminology is incorrect!) Would this be because the 4AGE has 2 intake
ports? What would be the implications of using an injector without this
splitter cap?
I believe the stock injectors flow 210 cc/min. Can anyone confirm this? The
ones we currently have in flow around 250 cc/min (guess).
Anyone got a set of 4AGZE injectors laying around (cheap!)?
Thanks,
Fred
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Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 01:31:18 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Fred_Oberbuchner@mbnet.mb.ca (Fred Oberbuchner)
Subject: Injector failure modes?
Has anyone every heard of an injector failing in the OPEN position?
(ie. dumping vast amounts of fuel in the engine thereby drowning it?)
Thanks,
Fred
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Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 07:13:51 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: NEEDED! Head Gasket
>Have you tried calling Lance from Toyomoto in Florida.. he's real big on
>Supras.. he might have one laying around..
Nope. Gordon (Lance's brother-in-law) has had his Supra up on blocks
for several weeks waiting on one. First place I looked.
Chris
(BTW, Stillen was the second. They called HKS while I waited and were
the ones that told me to expect 6 weeks. Bummer!)
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 07:30:29 -0400
From: "ROGERS"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Wrong Parts
Hmmmm,
Let me relate a story, 2 weeks ago, I was trying to get some bushings for
my modified starlet. The problem is that I am using the original starlet arms
mated to a celica rear end. When I went to my local toyota dealer, he said he
would have to order the complete starlet arms from japan, 6 weeks yada yada
yada...
My mechanic fixes industrial machines for a living (He fixes cars as a hobby)
and his company sells all types of heavy machinery to places like Ford, GM etc.
one of the machines they have for internal uses is a press machine. They use it
to press bearings into all kinds of gadgets. I went over to his office one day
and pressed the bearings out myself! There is a guage that tells you how much
force you are applying. Since my suspension arms are the originals, 10 years+
of salt and rust required something like 40 tons to get them out. Kudos to you
for beating them out with a cold chisel!!
(Some Industrial machines have bearings which must be frozen in nitrogen and
then put in place -- try beating those ones out!)
On with the story... It turns out (and it makes sense from a tooling point of
view) that many of Toyotas bearings are interchangeable. Toyota part number are
structured something like 42xxx-TA451. Where the part after the dash specifies
the car. Hence in all likely hood 42001-TA451 and 42001-AE851 will most likely
interchange if they are similiar parts. AE851 specifying corolla and TA45
specifying celica.
If you go to Totota, they will not sell you rear suspension bushings for an 87
corolla gts, they will try to sell you complete arms, yet TRD will sell you
competition bushings only -- Go figure.
Also you said you beet the crap out of the bushings to get them out, but did
you get the sleeve out as well? I thought i had burned mine out, and my
mechanic just laughed at my ignorance, the rubber bearing is usually attatched
to a metal sleeve (At least in my case).
End result, I am probably going to order 8 TRD bushings for a corolla GTS and
press the hell out of them into my 83 starlet suspension arms. I cross
referenced this by getting a celica bushing that would work (you can buy early
7x celica bushings seperately) and cross referenced this number in one of the
early TRD catalogues (The ones with the pictures) which has the same initial
number and price as corolla ones.
Roger
_______________________________________________________________________________
Subject: **Wrong Parts**
From: "Dick Byrd"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: **Wrong Parts** at Internet
Date: 9/19/95 10:55 PM
Damn, those dealers piss me off. I picked up from my local, smiling Toyota
dealer the metal-rubber bushings that go into the lower control arms on an
'85 Camry to hold the anti-roll (stabilizer) bar. Had to beat the crap out
of the old ones with a cold chisel to get them out. Then I find out that the
ones the dealer gave me were at least 1/4" to big to go into the holes.
There I am - control arms with no bushings, and bushings that won't fit
into the control arms. *Shit*
Go back to the dealer and he looks it up again and says: Oh, yours is
an '85 Huh! On those, you have to repalce the *whole conmtrol arm* which
has the bushings pressed in at the factory (No wonder I had to beat the
crap out of them). And the bad news is -- $139.00 EACH. Great Day!!.
I'm not giving the rising sun $238 for new control arms -- NEVER.
I reassembled the arm with large washers and exhaust hanger rubber
donuts and it seems to be OK. Am I due for a quick trip into a ditch?
Don't tell me to bus those new control arms. I'd sooner drive it off
the nearest cliff!
Stuff from Dick Byrd
byrd@mnsinc.com
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From: Mark Sink - Imonics Development
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 10:13:36 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Need help on injectors - 4AGE/4AGZE
> From toyota-mods-owner@CyberAuto.Com Wed Oct 4 02:47:00 1995
> Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 01:24:29 -0500
> X-Sender: fredo@access.mbnet.mb.ca
> Hi all!
>
> I urgently need to know what the part# and specs are for the injectors
> in the Supercharged 4AGZE. In particular, I need to know how they compare
> to the ones originally in my 88 Corolla GTS (4AGE). From looking at them,
> the ones in the 4AGE seem different from "normal" injectors.
>
> The 4AGE ones seem to have a "cap" over the business end of the injector which
> would apparently split the fuel "jet" into 2 "jets". The larger injectors
> out of an early Supra we looked at did not have this cap. (sorry if
> terminology is incorrect!) Would this be because the 4AGE has 2 intake
> ports?
>
> I believe the stock injectors flow 210 cc/min. Can anyone confirm this? The
> ones we currently have in flow around 250 cc/min (guess).
>
> Anyone got a set of 4AGZE injectors laying around (cheap!)?
>
> Thanks,
> Fred
>
In '88, the 4AGE was bumped from 112HP to 115HP. One of the differences, if
not the ONLY, was a modified injector, which I believe altered the fuel spray.
So in answer to
>What would be the implications of using an injector without this
> splitter cap?
If it's used to modify the spray pattern, and was not used on pre '88 4AGE's..
I'd say the implications are a 3 HP loss.
Mark Sink
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From: Richard Leong
Subject: me/mine/mods
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 11:50:02 -0700 (PDT)
Name : Richard Leong
Location : Burnaby, British Columbia, Canada
Currently attending Simon Fraser University.
Model : '86 Celica GTS Coupe
Engine : 3S-GE
Mods : Borla universal muffler with 4 inch Sebring tip, HKS powerflow filter,
Aeroform body kit with customized rear apron from a hatchback kit,
PIAA 959 fog lamps, 16*7.5 TSW Stealths w/215/40/16 P700s,
Clifford Arrow with dual perimeter sensor.
Future Mods : new shocks and springs, custom paint job?, catback exhaust,
performance headers, other possible engine mods
e-mail : leongc@sfu.ca
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: your mail
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 00:27:52 +0200 (EET)
> Peter writes:
>
> >STOP PRESS : If anyone's interested, just picked up a copy of "Hot 4's
> >& Performance Cars" here in Aust. It's got a KE30 with a 3T-GTEU in
> >it! First one I've ever seen. Gonna make for some interesting
> >reading. Looks like a fairly easy fit.
>
> Does anyone know if this magazine is available in the US? I would
> like to read this article.
> Bryan Zublin
> bzublin@gi.com
I'd like to read that article too. If I'd get it I'd scan it for all
to read on my WWW pages...
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Wed, 04 Oct 1995 16:06:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: Re: your mail
To: Matti Kalalahti
Cc: "toyota-mods@cyberauto.com"
Matti,
Peter sent me mail saying that the article was a disappointment. But, any
info is better than none. Maybe he can send you a copy.
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
----------
From: toyota-mods-owner
To: toyota-mods
Subject: Re: your mail
Date: Thursday, October 05, 1995 12:27AM
> Peter writes:
>
> >STOP PRESS : If anyone's interested, just picked up a copy of "Hot 4's
> >& Performance Cars" here in Aust. It's got a KE30 with a 3T-GTEU in
> >it! First one I've ever seen. Gonna make for some interesting
> >reading. Looks like a fairly easy fit.
>
> Does anyone know if this magazine is available in the US? I would
> like to read this article.
> Bryan Zublin
> bzublin@gi.com
I'd like to read that article too. If I'd get it I'd scan it for all
to read on my WWW pages...
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: Matti Kalalahti
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list),
Subject: Re: your mail
Date: Thu, 05 Oct 95 09:11:13 +1000
From: Peter Mejak
>I'd like to read that article too. If I'd get it I'd scan it for all
>to read on my WWW pages...
As I've already mentioned to someone else here, the story was
a bit of a let-down -- not much info on the technical aspects
of the swap.
Anyhow, I'll see if I can scan it in sometime in the not too
distant future so that you can decide for yourself.
Cheers,
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: For Info: Car Prices in S'pore
To: btptan@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 01:31:55 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-mods mailing list)
> from "Drive" Mag (local motoring mag) July 1995 Used Car
> Reckoner tables:
>
> Exhange rate is now US$1.41 to SIN$1.00
> Finland, US$
> '88 RX7 S$35K == US$25K $15K, but I can't fit in one
> '92 MX6 S$71K == US$50.7K $21K, nice, but FWD copmobile
> '93 Merc 420SEL S$395K == US$282K ?, about $70K
> '92 BMW 325i S$155K == US$111K $51K
> '93 MR2 S$103K == US$73.5K ('91) $21K
>
> '77 KE30 S$10-14K depending on condition $200-$1600 (stock 3K)
> '76 - '80 TA40, T20 - 2T-B S$12-18K $500-$2600 (stock 2T)
> '78 BMW 315 S$22-24K $1000
> '83 Starlet S$19-26K depending on mods done $400-$1900 (stock)
>
> New Car Prices: Finland [US$]
> LS400 S$368K $173K
> 2.2l Camry S$200K $45K
> 2.0l Corona ABS S$178K $36K (Carina E 2.0 GLi, GTi is $51K)
> 1.6l Corolla S$119K $31K
> RX7 S$236K not available
> MX5 S$166K $53K
> RS Cosworth S$193K ?, about $70K
> Merc S320 S$397K $175K
> Merc 320SL S$494K $237K
> 200SX S$180K not available - top models Maxima, Primera :(
> Audi A8 4.2l S$406K $206K
> BMW 316i cmpt S$120K $34K
>
> Oh, and gas is S$1.08/l for 92 OCT (NOT Gal!)
> S$1.17/l for 98 OCT.
US$1.11/l for 95 unleaded
US$1.14/l for 98 unleaded ($4.3/gallon!)
> It'd be interesting if someone would fill in the prices in the US beside
> these and repost the msg. Maybe someone in Europe and Australia can do it
> too?
>
> Anyone from Israel here? I understand that S'pore is second only to Israel
> for the cost of motoring.
Finland maybe a good runner-up?
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From: Craig Pugsley
Subject: Re: 3TGTEU KE30
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 09:58:48 +1000 (EST)
> > >STOP PRESS : If anyone's interested, just picked up a copy of "Hot 4's
> > >& Performance Cars" here in Aust. It's got a KE30 with a 3T-GTEU in
> > >it! First one I've ever seen. Gonna make for some interesting
> > >reading. Looks like a fairly easy fit.
> >
> > Does anyone know if this magazine is available in the US? I would
> > like to read this article.
> > Bryan Zublin
> > bzublin@gi.com
>
> I'd like to read that article too. If I'd get it I'd scan it for all
> to read on my WWW pages...
Ok ok, if the original poster can't scan the article I'll buy a copy and
scan it in.
OBQuestion:
What factory turbo engines will fit into the first of the front wheel
drive celicas?
Cheers,
Craig.
PS how many fellow Australians are on toyota-mods?
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To: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Cc: Matti Kalalahti ,
Subject: Re: your mail (3T-GTEU into KE30 Corolla)
Date: Thu, 05 Oct 95 10:03:34 +1000
From: Peter Mejak
I've been looking thru my magazines lately trying to get ideas. I'll see
what I can dig up as far as modified Toyota's. One that I read thru last
night may be interesting -- replacing a 1986 4AGE Corolla Seca with a
4A-GZE. Also, a (TA22?) Celica with 3T-GTEU -- 15 sec 1/4 mile; slow due
to wheelspin in at least the first 3 gears!
May your tyres go up in smoke,
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: 3TGTEU KE30
To: c.pugsley@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Craig Pugsley)
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 02:38:20 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> OBQuestion:
> What factory turbo engines will fit into the first of the front wheel
> drive celicas?
3S-GTE is the only sensible option. Unless you want to convert it to RWD ;)
There are also 2E-TE, 3E-TE and 4E-FTE, but those put out only 100-133hp
so forget them.
4A-GZE too, but that is SUPERcharged...
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: your mail (3T-GTEU into KE30 Corolla)
To: peterm@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Peter Mejak)
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 02:49:31 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> I've been looking thru my magazines lately trying to get ideas. I'll see
> what I can dig up as far as modified Toyota's. One that I read thru last
> night may be interesting -- replacing a 1986 4AGE Corolla Seca with a
> 4A-GZE. Also, a (TA22?) Celica with 3T-GTEU -- 15 sec 1/4 mile; slow due
> to wheelspin in at least the first 3 gears!
That sounds PITIFUL! TA22 is at least 200kg lighter than my TA60,
so it should do better (even with completeley stock engine, stock boost).
Wheelspin at 3rd? Better get some *tyres*, not "condom factory rejects".
Even with the worst tyres (Continental SuperContact, Dunlop D40, bald
MXV2) I only got wheelspin up to 90km/h (end of 2nd gear then), and got
the 1/4 mile in 15 seconds. Now it's in the mid 14's, slightly under
100mph, wheelspin only in 1st... To put it short: BFG ZR's kick butt,
but you can't do those 150ft burn-outs ;)
> May your tyres go up in smoke,
Well, a set lasts about 6-7kmiles for me ;)
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 20:50:29 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Wrong Parts
>Also you said you beet the crap out of the bushings to get them out, but
did you
>
>get the sleeve out as well? I thought i had burned mine out, and my mechanic
> just laughed at my ignorance, the rubber bearing is usually attatched to
>a metal sleeve (At least in my case).
Be careful with those sleeves! In some cases (at least in the case
of the Energy Suspension bushings) you must retain and re-use the
original metal sleeves.
FYI
Chris
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Date: Wed, 04 Oct 1995 18:09:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: Re: Limited slip differential for 1980 Celica
To: "toyota-mods@cyberauto.com"
Bryan writes:
>This sounds like a good solution. Does this require major modifications to
>the body of a 1980 Celica? I would guess that it would.
Chris writes:
>Although I never actually got to do this, I looked at several junked
>Supra's for this very reason. Truthfully, I think it would just bolt
>right in. Keep in mind that those years of Supra were just a version
>of the Celica, so the basic body mounts should be identical. Just
>make sure you get one with the solid rear axle and not the IRS. THAT
>would be a job!
Bryan replies:
Yes, I believe that the 1979-1981 Celica Supra rear end should be a direct
bolt-in to a 1978-1981 Celica. I guess I was asking if an IRS rear end
would require majors mods, and you answered that.
Does anyone know if the first Celica Supras (79-81) were available with
limited slip (in the US)? I didn't think that they were. Also, is the
differential stronger than the same year Celicas? I know the ratios are
different, something like 3.909 for the Celica Supra and 3.737 for the
Celicas.
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
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Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 22:14:38 -0400
From: Brent Matthew Dye
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Sqky clutch on 94/my opinion on posts
I know it's been about a week since this topic was last discussed, but I'm
concerned about my clutch, now. I've had a little squeak in it ever since I
got the car, but I've been ignoring it ever since lubrication (i.e. WD-40)
failed to change the somewhat annoying problem. I know someone was replacing a
gammet/pin in the clutch, but is it even possible mine are worn after only
16,100 miles? Not really sure what to do (if anything), but it is a minor
annoyance...and we know how those tend to get MORE annoying later!
***As for the messages about cutting the chit-chat, I'm going to have to go
with Stu. I enjoy everyone's personal stories/disasters with their cars. At
the very least, we can learn from others mistakes. Stu, for instance, has
taken the inititive of getting a fire extinguisher mounted to his MR2 after my
post on a possible flaw in the top-mounted oil filter catching fire (while
changing your oil). Maybe it was more of a scare, talking about engine fires,
that got Stu to take action. I enjoyed the stories later about stupid
grease-monkeys, too :-). I don't care if they weren't answering my question
about the oil filter.***
I can't believe the FAQ on the WWW page said that "<900" 94 MR2's were
sold in the US. That means only about 250 94T's were sold... I feel special :)
--
+----------+--------------+ +------------------------------------------+
|Brent Dye / Columbus, OH |_______|Personal Mail:bd112593@oak.cats.ohiou.edu |
|(Fully Loaded) Super Red 94 Turbo @16.1k +----------------------------------+
|AKA:Red Sled Lic plate:MISTR 2 +--------+ Quiz: I'm my brother's brother.
+--------------------------------+ Who am I? (Answer:Me) :-)
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Date: Wed, 4 Oct 1995 20:37:50 -0700
To: Fred_Oberbuchner@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Fred Oberbuchner),
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: Need help on injectors - 4AGE/4AGZE
At 01:24 AM 10/4/95 -0500, Fred Oberbuchner wrote:
>Hi all!
>
>I urgently need to know what the part# and specs are for the injectors
>in the Supercharged 4AGZE. In particular, I need to know how they compare
>to the ones originally in my 88 Corolla GTS (4AGE). From looking at them,
>the ones in the 4AGE seem different from "normal" injectors.
>
>The 4AGE ones seem to have a "cap" over the business end of the injector which
>would apparently split the fuel "jet" into 2 "jets". The larger injectors
>out of an early Supra we looked at did not have this cap. (sorry if
>terminology is incorrect!) Would this be because the 4AGE has 2 intake
>ports? What would be the implications of using an injector without this
>splitter cap?
>
>I believe the stock injectors flow 210 cc/min. Can anyone confirm this? The
>ones we currently have in flow around 250 cc/min (guess).
>
>Anyone got a set of 4AGZE injectors laying around (cheap!)?
>
>Thanks,
>Fred
The stock 4AGE injectors are 210cc.. I'm not sure about the 4AGZ injectors
though.. I do know however that the stock Supra Turbo injectors are 420cc,
the Eclipse/Talon Turbo are 385cc or 420cc (I've heard arguement over the
figure).. someone told me the Toyota Turbo Truck came with 295cc..
% Aric Shen
% Speedline Racing Concepts
% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
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Date: 5 Oct 1995 16:18:05 U
From: "David Chandler"
Subject: me/mine/mods
To: "Toyota Mods"
Name: A. David Chandler
Location: Huntsville, AL
Model: 1991 MR2 Turbo
Engine: 3SGTE
Mods: None to date, want a new rear suspension
email: david_chandler@cpqm.saic.com
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From: looit@cs_srv1.mh.dpi.qld.gov.au
Subject: Re: For Info: Car Prices in S'pore
To: k124476@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Matti Kalalahti)
Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 19:27:47 +1000 (EST)
Cc: btptan@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
> >
> > Exhange rate is now US$1.41 to SIN$1.00
> > Finland, US$
Ok for OZ, A$1 = 75c US
> > '88 RX7 S$35K == US$25K $15K, but I can't fit in one
A$17(13B)-25K (turbo)
> > '92 MX6 S$71K == US$50.7K $21K, nice, but FWD copmobile
A$30K
> > '93 Merc 420SEL S$395K == US$282K ?, about $70K
sorry don't know but probably around the A$100K
> > '92 BMW 325i S$155K == US$111K $51K
A$70K
> > '93 MR2 S$103K == US$73.5K ('91) $21K
A$35+K, 90 A$29K
> >
> > '77 KE30 S$10-14K depending on condition $200-$1600 (stock 3K)
A$1500-2500
> > '76 - '80 TA40, T20 - 2T-B S$12-18K $500-$2600 (stock 2T)
A$3K
> > '78 BMW 315 S$22-24K $1000
we don't have this, only the 318/320 A$8K
> > '83 Starlet S$19-26K depending on mods done $400-$1900 (stock)
nope, Corolla 83 A$5K
> >
> > New Car Prices: Finland [US$]
> > LS400 S$368K $173K
I think this is around the A$140K mark
> > 2.2l Camry S$200K $45K
A$24K
> > 2.0l Corona ABS S$178K $36K (Carina E 2.0 GLi, GTi is $51K)
dont get this model
> > 1.6l Corolla S$119K $31K
we get the 4AFE and 5AFE, A$18K - A$40K
> > RX7 S$236K not available
A$85K
> > MX5 S$166K $53K
A$42K (my next car, don't worry, the 4AGE stays as well)
> > RS Cosworth S$193K ?, about $70K
import only, A$50-60K
> > 200SX S$180K not available - top models Maxima, Primera :(
A$40K
> > Audi A8 4.2l S$406K $206K
I don't think we get this model yet.
> > BMW 316i cmpt S$120K $34K
A$38K
> > Oh, and gas is S$1.08/l for 92 OCT (NOT Gal!)
> > S$1.17/l for 98 OCT.
>
> US$1.11/l for 95 unleaded
> US$1.14/l for 98 unleaded ($4.3/gallon!)
prices for fuel differ from state to state, and time to time
at the moment in Brisbane, Qld
ULP (92) 59.9c/L, last week 69.9c/L
PULP (96) 4c/L more than ULP from my friendly station
>
Car prices in Australia aren't too bad, but they have gone up quite a lot
recently. You can compare against the OZ made cars
Holden Commodore (3,8L V6, 200hp, TH700) A$30K
Ford Falcon (4.0L OHC 6, 210hp, BW85) A$30KA
Holden Commodore (5.0L V8, 220hp/250hp) A$40K (same for Ford Falcon)
The last of the 4AGE Corolla (93) was A$30K, current Sprinter 5AFE is A$40K
Celica (2.2L, we don;t get 3SGE) A$42K onwards, A$80K for the GpAGT4 if you can find one
No Supra, MR2 3SGE(bathurst - stripper version) A$50K, (GT - loaded) A$65K
TEd
--
#############################################################################
SSSS X X TTTTTT CCCCC
S S X X TT C ted@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C looit@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C
S S X X TT C
SSSS X X TT CCCCC "TALK TO ME" or ...
# Coma?? Coma doesn't hurt, I fall into a coma all the time...zzzzzzz....!!! #
^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^
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Date: Thu, 5 Oct 1995 11:16:55 -0500 (CDT)
From: Scotty!
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 90 Tercel no more
Dear Listers,
I don't have my 90 Tercel anymore. I now have a 91 Honda Civic Si. Does
this mean I'm off the list?????
Curious,
Scott
Scott Y. Amano e-mail: umamano0@cc.umanitoba.ca
Faculty of Management, University of Manitoba, Canada
"Enviro-Unfriendly"
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Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 01:00:58 -0500 (CDT)
From: Craig A Terlau
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Starlet Pushrods
I Put the old tired 4KE engine into my street Starlet to replace the
recently trashed one (needed transportation). I soon discovered that the
engine had severe valve noise even though I had just adjusted the
valves. I decided to replace the hydraulic lifters with solid ones I had
on hand. The only problem is that the total length of the lifter-push
rod assembly for the 4KE (with hydraulic lifters) is 5.5mm (.217 inches)
greater than that of the 4KC (with solid lifters). The reason is that
the 4KE has a shorter head and dished as opposed to flat-top pistons. A
trial fit revealed that the valve train geometry would be unacceptable.
The solution was to cut .217 inches from the center portion of the
pushrods and TIG weld them back together using a clever jig. I did this
and installed the shortened push rods. The result is a quiet runing
engine with experimental push rods. I was uncertain about this mod when
I first dreampt it up, but it seems to work fine. I have already driven
it a couple hundred miles. I'll report if the thing fails. Meanwhile
preparing the next Super-K.
\|/ ____ \|/
@~/ ,. \~@
/_( \__/ )_\
\__U_/
Craig
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Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 10:24:13 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: fmarsh@helix.nih.gov (Frederick Marsh)
Subject: Exhaust
I'm looking for some advice on exhaust systems. I have a '85 Celica GTS
and I am considering going with a header and exhaust system. I drive my
car everyday, so I dont want it to be too loud. If I notice a significant
amount of difference in power, then I wont mind the noise so much. Any
recommendations, and if so, how much noise, and is it worth the noise?
-Frederick "CULTURE"
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From: Richard Leong
Subject: Tire problem
To: toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Fri, 6 Oct 1995 11:42:45 -0700 (PDT)
I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this but anyways...
Which way are you supposed to mount Pirelli P700 tires. For those who
have seen the tread pattern on the tires, they sort of have treads
looking like arrows. When looking at the tires from directly in front of
the car, are you supposed to mount the wheel so that the tread
pattern(arrow) points up or down? In other words :
/^|^\ /v|v\
|^|^| |v|v|
|^|^| <-- UP DOWN --> |v|v|
|^|^| |v|v|
\^|^/ \v|v/
Which way is it? Right now I have it so that the tires are pointing
downward on all fours, after the idiot installer put the tires in the
front pointing one way and the tires at the back pointing the other way.
Someone please tell me that's not the right way to put them on. Then I
called them back after discoverring they had made the blunder. The guy
said the tire tread, the "arrow", is supposed to point toward the front
of the car. Right now, I'm just seeking some second opinions. Another
puzzling thing is that I've been flipping through magazines comparing
other cars with the same tires. Some have them pointing down, some up,
and some have them one way in the front, the other way in the back. I'm
confused.
Richard
leongc@sfu.ca
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From: Gary Hong
To: leongc@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Subject: Re: Tire problem
Date: Fri, 6 Oct 95 13:39:59 PDT
From: Richard Leong
>
>I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this but anyways...
>Which way are you supposed to mount Pirelli P700 tires. For those who
>have seen the tread pattern on the tires, they sort of have treads
>looking like arrows. When looking at the tires from directly in front of
>the car, are you supposed to mount the wheel so that the tread
>pattern(arrow) points up or down? In other words :
>/^|^\ /v|v\
>|^|^| |v|v|
>|^|^| <-- UP DOWN --> |v|v|
>|^|^| |v|v|
>\^|^/ \v|v/
>
>Which way is it? Right now I have it so that the tires are pointing
>downward on all fours, after the idiot installer put the tires in the
>front pointing one way and the tires at the back pointing the other way.
>Someone please tell me that's not the right way to put them on. Then I
>called them back after discoverring they had made the blunder. The guy
>said the tire tread, the "arrow", is supposed to point toward the front
Richard,
I know you're talking about the arrows on the surface of the tire, but look
at the direction arrows on the sidewalls and that'll tell you in which
direction the tires will rotate.
The dir arrow points in different directions if you look at it when the arrow
is at the top vs when it's at the bottom of the sidewall (it's all relative:)).
I have P700z on my M3 and my tires have the dir arrows pointing to the front
when the dir arrow is at the top. Pointing towards the rear when the dir arrow
is at the bottom of the sidewall.
I think the tires should look like this from the front. I'll check my car
this evening.
/v|v\
|v|v|
DOWN --> |v|v|
|v|v|
\v|v/
>of the car. Right now, I'm just seeking some second opinions. Another
>puzzling thing is that I've been flipping through magazines comparing
>other cars with the same tires. Some have them pointing down, some up,
>and some have them one way in the front, the other way in the back. I'm
>confused.
It depends on the tires and tread.
Gary
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From: KlingK@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 1995 07:14:07 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Cc: KlingK@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: Kevin Kling
Location: Galway, NY ( north of Albany, west Of Saratoga )
Model: 91, MR2 Mk II, Black, T-Top, 89K Miles, No LSD, EH Steering,ABS
Engine: 5SGTE
Mods: None - YET
Email: klingk@aol.com
It was a great experience finding this group and the MR2 web page I spent
about 3 hours looking through the information there. I also found out that I
am effected by BOTH of the recalls on this model ! Is there any way I can
find out if the prev owner had them done or should I just drag it to the
dealer and have them do them. Also what is involved with the fixing of the
problems ( do I get a new steering wheel ! ).
Problems I have had:
Temp Sensor: replaced ( saw that in FAQ )
Alternator Idler Pully - Bearings went: Replaced ( didn't see that one )
dealer wanted to replace my TURBOCHARGER ( not under warranty at a cost of
2200.00 for parts ) because bad bearings in it were causing the noise I was
hearing, after explaining to them that there was no oil loss, blue smoke and
that the problem was related to engine speed and not turbo speed they backed
down and gave up on the problem. Took to a small garage and they found the
problem nd replaced the bearing.
Boost Overrun: under some conditions boost gauge would go off scale and
making the assuption that the stock engine may not handle this I had them
replace something under warranty ( wastegate maybe ??? ) that didn'f fix it
anyway - problem went away on it's own. Although After seeing the HKS
products it looks like I could have saved some money and just left it broken
and had extra boost - assuming the fuel cutoff worked it would have been kind
of safe.
Wet/Cold: hesitation and bucking when getting into boost, any boost anybody
have any ideas on this ? The problem goes away when it warms up.
Transaxle noise: general gear noise - may be normal ? I have never driven
another and it has been doing it for 55k with no filings or any other
problems although the 2nd gear syncros are getting a little touchy mostly
when cold - And I hate to say it but with 4 Blizzaks on it I have never been
stuck in the last 2 winters I have had it on the road ( I know that is a
stoning offense but .... ) It also started fine one morning when it was 40
BELOW - ever shifted with a gearbox that felt like it was full of oatmeal ?
Yes I have been living in a cave but I Really Really like my MR2 and would
like some feedback from other people who are as hooked as I am and can give
me some guidance about making mods and general info on the make Given that it
is destined to become a classic now that they are out of production ( sniff,
sniff ).
thanks for reading my ramblngs
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From: Richard Leong
Subject: P700 problem
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 10:16:13 -0700 (PDT)
I wrote something regarding having problems with the way I should install
my P700s on my car a couple days ago. Thanks to all of those who replied
back. I forgot to mention that these tires DO NOT indicate anywhere on
the sidewall which way the tires are supposed to be installed. I assume
they can be put on in any fashion. I'm more concerned with the advantages
of having it put on one way as apposed to the other way, if there are
any. Particularly in the rain. Someone posted before that he had an M3
with P700s on. I was wondering which way he had it on, and if his tires
had arrows on the sidewall indicating the direction. I am also not yet
convinced that these tires hold well in the rain like they should. I
thought that getting these tires would solve wheel spin during
acceleration in the rain, but it doesn't seem to. I do know
that the CELica I have, '86 GTS is known for that problem.
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From: Gary Hong
To: leongc@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Subject: Re: P700 problem
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 12:17:01 PDT
From: Richard Leong
>
>I wrote something regarding having problems with the way I should install
>my P700s on my car a couple days ago. Thanks to all of those who replied
>back. I forgot to mention that these tires DO NOT indicate anywhere on
>the sidewall which way the tires are supposed to be installed. I assume
>they can be put on in any fashion. I'm more concerned with the advantages
>of having it put on one way as apposed to the other way, if there are
>any. Particularly in the rain. Someone posted before that he had an M3
>with P700s on. I was wondering which way he had it on, and if his tires
>had arrows on the sidewall indicating the direction. I am also not yet
>convinced that these tires hold well in the rain like they should. I
>thought that getting these tires would solve wheel spin during
>acceleration in the rain, but it doesn't seem to. I do know
>that the CELica I have, '86 GTS is known for that problem.
Richard,
I have P700z on my M3. These tire are performance tires and are not made
specifically for the rain. It handles ok in the wet but I don't risk
doing anything stupid in the rain.
If you want the tires to handle in the rain, why don't you get aquatreads? :)
I have my car downstairs so I can take a look at the tires later on. The P700z
do indeed have an arrow. Its not obvious in that it's not painted white.
Look for a raised arrow on the sidewall.
Gary
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From: Gary Hong
To: toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: P700 problem
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 95 12:40:45 PDT
From: Richard Leong
>
>I wrote something regarding having problems with the way I should install
>my P700s on my car a couple days ago. Thanks to all of those who replied
>back. I forgot to mention that these tires DO NOT indicate anywhere on
>the sidewall which way the tires are supposed to be installed. I assume
>they can be put on in any fashion. I'm more concerned with the advantages
>of having it put on one way as apposed to the other way, if there are
>any. Particularly in the rain. Someone posted before that he had an M3
>with P700s on. I was wondering which way he had it on, and if his tires
>had arrows on the sidewall indicating the direction. I am also not yet
>convinced that these tires hold well in the rain like they should. I
>thought that getting these tires would solve wheel spin during
>acceleration in the rain, but it doesn't seem to. I do know
>that the CELica I have, '86 GTS is known for that problem.
Richard,
I have P700z on my M3. These tire are performance tires and are not made
specifically for the rain. It handles ok in the wet but I don't risk
doing anything stupid in the rain.
If you want the tires to handle in the rain, why don't you get aquatreads? :)
I have my car downstairs so I can take a look at the tires later on. The P700z
do indeed have an arrow. Its not obvious in that it's not painted white.
Look for a raised arrow on the sidewall.
Gary
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From: KlingK@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Oct 1995 17:11:36 -0400
To: leongc@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: P700 problem
I don't have the P700's but from other directional tires I have had the tread
pattern looks like a directional one, the v shaped lateral grooves are the
general sign.
As far as direction to mount them if there are no arrows and the words "this
side toward outside" or something like that I would say that you want the
"V"'s to point backward ( the open part of the "V" backwards ).
Also on the wet traction issue all you can really hope for is better
aqua-planing resistance since I don't think a stationary ( or nearly so )
tire behaves the same as a high speed rolling tire. So other than a really
soft compound I dont think much will help here. But I could be wrong :-o
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From: Michael Kronvold
To: "toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com"
Subject: tires again (was RE: P700 problem)
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 07:58:39 -0500
I put a set of Dunlop D60A2's on my Mk III and boy did they make a
difference in the rain. These aren't sold as a rain tire or a snow
tire, they're an "All season performance tire". *shrug* whatever.
they have 4 (yes 4) 5/8" channels (huge channels imho, I have found
lotsa neat things stuck in them too, like rocks, a ball bearing, a
.32 cal Semi wad cutter.) They are only H rated (120?) but I don't
race on these and rarely get near 120 on the street. Their dry
performance has been good. Not as good as the RE71's (obviously)
but they have a treadwear rating of 280 and I'm expecting at least
30k miles if not more. (Actually, I got them with a 50k treadwear
warranty so I guess I'm getting 50k outta them whether they last that
long or not!) Compared to the ultra performance tires (which I get
10k-15k miles on) this is a pleasant change. Should last quite a
few winters. At this point in time I am planning on getting p-zero's
when the spring rolls around and use these as "winter" tires. But,
in all likliness I will not have the money come spring and drive them
all year 'round.
Anyone else tried these tires? I think these are great tires
for all year street use. Obviously not track tires, or for serious
street performance nuts, but how often do you push the car past its
limits? I don't think I've ever slid through a turn or ground the
front tires (supra's natural understeer in action) around an extremely
hard right. Am I nuts? Are these tires going to disappoint me
eventually? I've only put about 2k miles on them so far and no snow
yet.
Speaking of understeer, "The Toyota Performance Handbook" suggests
varying tire pressure to fine tune your suspension to a more neutral
balance. Any suspension buffs out there? I'm looking to learn more
about suspensions...
--
Michael Kronvold, Network Administrator, Addison Machine Engineering
(708)543-9191 424 Interstate Road Addison, Illinois 60101 USA
-----
From: Gary Hong[SMTP:garyh@sco.COM]
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 1995 2:17 PM
To: leongc@cyberspace.cyberauto.com; toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com; toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: P700 problem
From: Richard Leong
>
>I wrote something regarding having problems with the way I should install
>my P700s on my car a couple days ago. Thanks to all of those who replied
>back. I forgot to mention that these tires DO NOT indicate anywhere on
>the sidewall which way the tires are supposed to be installed. I assume
>they can be put on in any fashion. I'm more concerned with the advantages
>of having it put on one way as apposed to the other way, if there are
>any. Particularly in the rain. Someone posted before that he had an M3
>with P700s on. I was wondering which way he had it on, and if his tires
>had arrows on the sidewall indicating the direction. I am also not yet
>convinced that these tires hold well in the rain like they should. I
>thought that getting these tires would solve wheel spin during
>acceleration in the rain, but it doesn't seem to. I do know
>that the CELica I have, '86 GTS is known for that problem.
Richard,
I have P700z on my M3. These tire are performance tires and are not made
specifically for the rain. It handles ok in the wet but I don't risk
doing anything stupid in the rain.
If you want the tires to handle in the rain, why don't you get aquatreads? :)
I have my car downstairs so I can take a look at the tires later on. The P700z
do indeed have an arrow. Its not obvious in that it's not painted white.
Look for a raised arrow on the sidewall.
Gary
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From: Richard Leong
Subject: P700s
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 09:25:20 -0700 (PDT)
I'm not writing about my tire woes again, rather just to let everyone
know that I bought these tires because they were the only tires in this
size besides the Euro TAs, which I avoided. If I could've found a better
rain tire, I would have. The right size is actually 215/45/16 to keep the
stock diameter, but only a brand or two makes it, and it's expensive.
Anyone who could find another brand in that size or close would be nice,
but I would like something in the 215/45/16 or 215/40/16 range
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Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 12:47:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: Aaron Buhr
Subject: HKS PFC F-CON?
To: "Leslie C. Fong"
Cc: supras@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Leslie, have you installed your new F-CON yet? You did just the F-CON,
no injector upgrade right? I'd like to hear what you think of the F-CON
unit by itself. I think most other members who have the F-CON did the
injector upgrade at the same time. You are running higher than stock
boost, right? What boost level are you running now?
Aaron B.
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Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 14:53:01 -0400 (EDT)
From: Aaron Buhr
Subject: Latest Update
To: Toyota Supras Mailing List ,
BTW, as far as the update for my car goes, apparently I misunderstood.
I didn't actually have a spun rod bearing, so therefore the crank was not
actually scored. Apparently they're just going to polish it up and it'll
be fine, which is good since I don't want to spend the $750 for a new
crank.
Also, I managed to locate a new head gasket. On Monday A2Z systems
told me that Greddy had a couple 85mm x 2mm head gaskets in stock, so I
bought one and should have it by Friday. While I was doing some research
on head gaskets, trying to find one I discovered some interesting
information and conclusions. The stock cylinder bore size is 83mm. HKS
makes 7MG head gaskets only in the 86mm bore size, in thicknesses of 1.0,
1.2, 2.0, and 3.0 mm. Greddy makes them in either 83mm or 85mm bore
sizes, with thicknesses of 1.0, 1.5, and 2.0. Billy Gulley pointed out
to me, and I have to agree, that you're best off getting a head gasket of
the exact same bore as your cylinders. Otherwise, you have two "lips"
(upper and lower), something like this:
/------\
| | <-- cylinder head (83mm diameter)
_| |_
|_ _| <-- head gasket (85 or 86mm diameter)
| |
| | <-- block cylinder bore (83mm diameter)
|--------|
|:piston:|
|: :|
The sharp edges on those lips will tend to act as focus points for heat
energy, thus hastening detonation and engine damage. I was running the
HKS 86mm bore by 1.2mm thickness, which was 3 mm wider than the 83mm
stock cylinder bore size I was running. Since my new cylinder size is
going to be 83.5mm, after being bored .020 over, I'm stuck with getting
a too-large head gasket. But I do recommend that anyone with stock cylinder
bore sizes get the Greddy 83mm x1.5mm head gasket when they change head
gaskets.
The new gasket has a 2.0mm thickness, which I have mixed feelings
about. The main reason I went with it is that that was the only size that
was readily available, but there are other good reasons to drop
compression, namely to run higher boost with less chance of detonation.
Unfortunately, for now I will not be running any higher boost than
before, until I get a new fuel computer/injectors, so power will be down
a bit from what it could have been, but with all the balancing, grinding,
etc. I expect the car will still be significantly more powerful than it
was before the rebuild, even with the compression drop.
Does anyone know how stroke is measured? Bore is the diameter of the
cylinder in which the piston moves, of course. But does the stroke
include the space within the head, or not? And is it measured as the
amount of space within the block (or block & head), or is it a measure of
the piston travel? The figures I have for a stock 7MGTE are 83mm bore,
90.9mm stroke. Using a simplistic equation, compute engine displacement
by (bore diameter/2)^2 * pi * stroke * number of cylinders, which for the
7MGTE is (83/2)^2 * pi * 90.9 * 6 ( / 1000 for mm/cc) = 2951 cc, which
is pretty close to 3.0 liters. I suppose there is still room for the
head volume, because I think the actual displacement of the 7MG series is
2995 or something. If there were 42 cc's left over, divided among 6
cylinders, that's 7 cc per cylinder cylinder head volume. That doesn't
really seem like enough, since the cylinder bore is already 8 cm diameter.
Can anyone shed light on how these things are calculated? Once I know how
to calculate displacement from bore * stroke, I can figure out what my new
compression ratio will be (stock is 8.4 for the turbocharged engine).
Aaron B.
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From: Gary Hong
To: toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: P700s
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 12:13:16 PDT
From: Richard Leong
>
>I'm not writing about my tire woes again, rather just to let everyone
>know that I bought these tires because they were the only tires in this
>size besides the Euro TAs, which I avoided. If I could've found a better
>rain tire, I would have. The right size is actually 215/45/16 to keep the
>stock diameter, but only a brand or two makes it, and it's expensive.
>Anyone who could find another brand in that size or close would be nice,
>but I would like something in the 215/45/16 or 215/40/16 range
Richard,
I check my tires and the drivers side (from the front has arrows pointing
down). The passenger side has arrows pointing up (from front). Never knew
I was out of sync :). The tires are bald (literally) anyways so I'm going
to change them within the next few weeks.
Gary
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Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 12:47:52 -0700
From: leslie@cadence.com (Leslie C. Fong)
To: ambuhr@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: HKS PFC F-CON?
Cc: supras@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Aaron,
I haven't put the HKS PFC F-CON into my Supra yet. I need to
negotiate the estimated time with my fiance (one of the perils of
engagement). Between that and debugging my MPG problem, repairing
her 240SX, reroofing the house, etc.... I haven't had a whole lot
of lattitude in scheduling "optional" car repairs. At least I have
all the related HKS instructions/manuals now.
I used to run higher than stock boost, but then my Supra (7M-GTE)
picked up a strange appetite for premium gas even with only stock
boost levels, so I disabled my CarTech hyper-boost "switch". Turns out
it was due to a bad radiator cap causing the block/head to run too hot
(detonation), even though the temp gauge never showed it to be a problem.
I erroneously assumed it was from a non-dealer tune-up which put in some
bum platinum plugs, so I switched over to the HKS plugs last time, with
no real improvement in detonation. Now that I've got that problem solved,
I can go back to hyper-drive when I reconnect everything up with the
F-CON too. The sooner the better, as I'm getting tired of newer cars
coming out that are as fast as us (stock). With boost around 11PSI, I
recall being able to induce wheelspin when shifting into 2nd (manual)
gear.
The F-CON should be the last engine mod for a while, until I
learn more about future Calif emissions tests. It's unlikely it'll
get any easier to pass a modified car here. I've already upgraded
the intercooler, boost, exhaust, plug wires, air filter, and I still
passed the current tests (with both cats in place). The next logical
step would be a turbo upgrade with injectors (and metal gasket), but
its big bucks and would probably be nixed by the gas sniffers. Now
they even have road-side detectors being planned around here...
A better upgrade path might be an NOS kit, since it could be
completely disabled (and hidden?) during the testing process. But I
don't like the idea of having to fill the bottle, or worrying about
laughing gas leaking into the passenger compartment.
In any case, I'll be sure to file a good write-up on the (old style)
F-CON when I finally get it installed...
Leslie
'87 Supra turbo, targa, 5sp, HKS EAC-T (TEMS), leather, ONLY 173K miles!
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: disaster - $2000 vacuum hose?
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list),
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 1995 22:36:15 +0200 (EET)
Cc: k124775@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Katajainen Tero),
This morning I started driving towards Toijala, to pick up my parents
Nissan PAtrol - in order to participate in the yearly fuel economy
competition (we won out class last year with the Carina - true
consumption was about 5.4l/100km, 43.5mpg). Up to halfway the 33 mile
trip, everything was fine. I was passing the other traffic at
80-120mph. I had to slow down to 40mph behind a van, and once I had
passed it and kept accelerating up to 120mph just for the fun of it,
I felt a hesitation. Immediately I got off the throttle and looked
at the mixture. Just fine. Test at more boost, still just fine, actually
somewhat on the rich side. But while the mixture was ok, the boost
wasn't. I could only get up to 15psi, from there the boost dropped to
10psi at 6000rpm. At this point I'm cursing - I knew this was big bucks.
So I pull up to the side of the road, and raise the hood. Moment of
silence. I'm shocked and I'm outraged! Oil all over the cam cover and
exhaust manifold. And I can see the reason too. Vacuum hose that came
disconnected, the one supplying vacuum/boost through a couple of
VCV's and such to distributor! That means I didn't get the pressure
retard I should. So any damage occured is 95% sure to be due to
excessive timing advance. The hose had signs of age, contributing
to it getting pulled off, among the VCV it was connected to dropped
hanging from it, no connected to the intake manifold as it should.
Desparate thoughts run through my mind, but after a minute or two
I decide to drive the remaining 10 miles to Toijala.
I had just gotten through the rush of exams, and would have a month
or so time to work on my car. I was planning on doing the intercooler
now, as well as TA40 lower control arms for negative camber to the
front. K&N filter too. And EGT meter. And original GT-T combination
meter if I could find one. Rust work too, if I could find a set
of fender flares to install at the same time. I WAS NOT PLANNING
ON SPENDING ALL MY MONEY IN AN ENGINE REBUILD!!!! ARRRRRRRRRGH!!!!
I mean, the last rebuild when my car was stolen was just 7500 miles/
a year ago (almost exactly)! And it was using NO oil yesterday!!!!
I take half an hour to recover from the shock slightly, and let
the engine cool down. Time to dig up the compression meter.
The results:
2 strokes 5 strokes >10 strokes, reading won't rise anymore
#1 7.3bar/107psi 8.9bar/131psi 9.4bar/138psi
#2 6.5bar/96psi 8.2bar/120psi 8.5bar/125psi
#3 7.4bar/108psi 8.5bar/125psi 9.2bar/135psi
#4 7.5bar/110psi 8.6bar/126psi 9.2bar/135psi
Overall, not bad. A month after the rebuild I had 8.2-8.5bar/121-125psi
in all cylinders. #2 remained slightly worse than the others, even
after several tests.
Next test: start the engine, remove oil filler cap. Uh uh...
lots of blowing, crankcase clearly getting pressurized, pulsing
airflow felt up to 5 inches above the filler hole. Definately not
normal. Oil looks normal, just getting blacker at 1600 miles after
last change, and it is still at the full mark.
Another test. What's the coolant looking? Nothing alarming, no oily film,
radiator full. No bubbles coming out with engine running. Oh, the temp
guage didn't move anywhere from normal at any poing of the trip.
So I'd say the cooling system is working as it should.
Then, look for the blue smoke from the exhaust. Arrrgh... car-sized
puffs, when I raised the revs from idle. No wonder with that
pressurized crankcase.
Then I take another look at the engine cover. How exactly did the
oil get where it now was? With the engine running, I start sqeezing
the piece of rubber hose connecting the intake pipes. A leak.
The hose had ruptured right next to the clamp. I didn't have any
55mm hose in my disposal, so I took another clamp and put it on the other
side of the rupture. As I noticed on my way back, this did the job
and boost got back up to previous figures, even slightly better -
hinging that this rupture has had some effect already for a few
months... There are no new noises coming from the engine. I did
get at least 10 small explosions in the exhaust on the way back,
though. The mixture was slightly leaner now, with this hose fixed,
at the figures I had earlier this year - 910mV. No knock, no hesitation.
No noticable oil loss within the 33miles back. But clouds of blue
smoke. I had less blue smoke when I REALLY had a broken piston after
that incident with the thieves last year.
So, what is the nature of the damage done? I'll be taking the car to
leakdown test tomorrow, if possible. Theories are welcome.
I haven't completely given up the hope yet, that a piston set may not
be necessary...
What do we learn from this? At least, that when you utilize the
engines potential at 95%, NOTHING may go wrong or it will be trouble...
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Wed, 11 Oct 95 22:43:30 PDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Brett Fraser (by way of Brett Fraser )
Subject: the new exhaust on my 83 Celica..
At 11:33 AM 10/11/95 -0400, you wrote:
>I just want to know the low down. Was Santa good to you?
>
>-CULTURE
>
Ah ha .. glad you reminded me,forgot all about it almost ..
Hmm.. ok .. performance wise I do notice better low end .. not enough to make me
say "Omygod, this is what Ive been missing all my life" but its a decent
enuf boost
that I can justify the 225$. Noise wise .. as I had the catalytic removed, I
expected it to be loudish ... and wasnt overly surprised .. accelerating,
especially
hard, definately makes people look at you as you go down the street .. But
Ive heard
around that the Toy cat's are some of the most restrictive out there .. so I
didnt
really mind ..
Recommendations .. well .. Id definately say go for the exhaust, even if you
keep
the Cat .. what you might do though, is chop the cat for starters .. if you
find
it too loud .. just have em flange it back in .. my shop assured me that
would be
no probs if I wasnt happy .. I like it.
Brett
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Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 00:47:49 -0500 (CDT)
From: Craig A Terlau
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Latest Update
Stroke is measured as piston travel and has nothing to do with the space
above the piston at top dead center (combustion chamber). If your over
bore is 0.5 mm, then you will have 0.25 mm of gasket exposed on the
cylinder side of the gasket, but not on the head side of the gasket.
Now, there are really two types of head gaskets, solid gaskets and
laminated gaskets. If you are using a solid metal gasket, then you
should radius and polish the lower edge of the gasket where it is exposed
to the cylinders. When you do this, just remove the corner and don't
touch the sealing surface of the gasket. Make the radius 1/4 to 1/3 the
thickness of the gasket. If you are using a laminated gasket, then it
will have material rolled over at the cylinder holes. This will already
have a gentle radius and with 0.25 mm of over-hang shouldn't cause
detination or burn up the gasket. You may be able to obtain a head gasket
from FelPro which is a popular brand of high quality gaskets.
As far as the thickness of the gasket, a very rough rule of thumb for
small engines like Toyotas is that 1.0 mm change in thickness is about a
1 point change in compression ratio. So if you choose a gasket that is
0.5 mm thicker than stock, and your compression ratio is 9.5:1, then your
new compression ratio will be something like 9.0:1. So you can probably
set your ignition timing slightly more advanced before pinging occurs.
\|/ ____ \|/
@~/ ,. \~@
/_( \__/ )_\
\__U_/
Craig
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Date: Thu, 12 Oct 1995 13:46:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Aaron Buhr
Subject: Displacement?
To: Toyota Supras Mailing List ,
Ok, apparently stroke is just the amount of piston travel, and does
not include the space above the piston in the combustion chamber.
Therefore an engine "displacement" is not equal to the volume of air
burned for an engine cycle, which I thought it was. I looked up the
7MGTE displacement and it's listed as 2954 cc, which is pretty close to
(bore/2)^2 * pi * stroke * number of cylinders, (83/2)^2 * pi * 90.9 *
6 (/1000) = 2951 cc. If you include the head combustion chamber volume,
you'll be over 3 liters of air burned per one complete engine cycle
(assuming 100% intake efficiency).
Anyway, then, maybe we can find my new compression ratio as follows:
if we have an 8.4:1 compression ratio with 90.9mm of travel, that means
that x * 8.4 = x + 90.9, x = 12.28, y = x + .8 = 13.08, y * r = y + 90.9,
r = (y + 90.9) / y = 7.95 : 1 compression ratio.
I'm making a simplifying assumption that the combustion chamber is
perfectly cylindrical, which is obviously not the case but hopefully
close enough. The formulas above assume that the height of the space in
the cylinder with the piston at top dead center is x. Then the height of
the space in the cylinder with the piston at bottom is x + 90.9. The
ratio of these two spaces is 8.4:1. Thus the formulas above. Now, when
I put in my 2.0 mm gasket, it is .8 mm thicker than the stock one.
Therefore the space above the piston at top dead center is x + .8 .
Since piston travel is the same, the ratio of those two spaces is 7.95:1,
i.e. the new compression ratio is 7.95:1.
Aaron B.
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Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 21:01:25 -0500 (CDT)
From: Craig A Terlau
To: Toyota-Mods
Subject: wheel studs
Does anyone in the group have a source of long wheel studs for Toyota?
Info on this would be much appreciated.
___
(o o)
+-----ooO-(_)-Ooo-----+
| Craig |
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From: aly abulkheir
Subject: me-mine-mods
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 02:06:54 -0400 (EDT)
Name: Aly AbulKheir
Location: New Paltz,NY or Yorktown Hts, NY
Model: '85 MR2
Engine: 4A-GE
Mods: K&N filtercharger, tokico illuminas,yokohama (avs,378,509)
Tornado air flow piece
Email: abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu
Future Mods: I am interested in making the car more fun than it already is
for the street and also for autocrossing. I have been looking
into the hks and trd stuff for a while now and have come to
different conclusions. One thing I want to discuss with other
owners is a basic hop up package and what results they have
had. This start is one I have planned:
powerflow or k&n fipk 5-7hp which one is truly better?
jacobs or hks ignition 3-5hp which one performs better?
hks,trust,5 Zigen exhaust6-10hp ditto.
trd header 3-5 hp best or is there better?
hks 256 and 264 cams 8-10hp ditto.
this cam arrangement was recommended to me by sarizer in NJ.
Formerly Toy Store East. These advertised hp ratings bring the car
to an advertised hp rating of approximately 145 hp. My main question is:
will these modifications give similar results as driving a stock
supercharged mr2? i.e. similar quarter mile and 0-60 times? I am not
expecting the same powerband characteristics as a supercharged model, i.e.
much more low end torque, but can I expect the same type of speed increase?
or more because of the 200 lb lighter weight of the 85 model in comparison
with a SuperCharged model. Also, don't forget that the gearing in the 85 is
supposedly lower than in the SC model.
Another question, how can I tell if my car has the 3.56:1 first
gear ratio or the 3.17:1 first gear ratio, was it simply by month of
manufacture? the car is an April '85.
What are people's thoughts on the stroker kit? is it worth the
price? I have a quoted price of 4500 installed. I have read the articles
in turbo from 91 and july 89. It gives more low end, but how does it act in
the higher revs? Also, the articles show the 5AGX stroker kit and they say
it "brings the motor to 2 liters". Was this a previous stroker kit? Because
the '93 hks catalog shows it as 1.711 liters.
I would like to discuss these ideas with anyone interested. I also
have planned to install trd progressive springs, sway bars, and bushings.
Any thoughts on those would be helpful as well.
Also questions regarding transmission durability.
Thank you,
Aly
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From: Gary Hong
To: terlau@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: wheel studs
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 95 3:56:17 PDT
There is a place in Santa Cruz that has 'em. I had to replace all 4 of mine
after I broke all three bolts on my rotor/hub assembly. I can give you
the # of the place I bought it from and maybe you can ask them if they ship.
The studs where something like $2/stud.
Gary
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From: RamziM2@aol.com
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 13:17:14 -0400
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: ramzi shakra
location: los angeles
model toyota mr2 86
engine: 4AGE
suspension mods: TRD Bushing set, Tokico 5 adjust shocks, Eibach
springs,Suspension techniques adjustable sway bars
Engine mods: HKS powerflo filter, Seibring dual tip exhuast (92 style)
future mods: 15x7 rims with 205/50 A-509- and better springs.
E-mail: ramzim2@aol.com
Hi everyone!
The car handles great, but the Eibach springs did not lower it at all. So
i'm looking to change to Jamex springs, or Tokico. I'd like to purchase the
TRD race springs but they don't sell them anymore. Also I guess they are too
stiff for street use.
I've autocrossed twice in the last 6 months at southern cal events.
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: 6.08 0-60mph with blue smoke...
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 22:44:50 +0200 (EET)
Ok, things were not quite as bad as it seemed at first look.
Leakdown test gave pretty good results, between 8-20%, #2 being
the worst as the compression test already revealed. Oil loss
is still not that much, everynthing seems to come out as blue smoke,
and that only happens when oil is warm AND I create a vacuum of
0.7bar/21inHg or more. That is, it occurs after engine braking and
some of the time at idle. No smoke after starting from cold.
So I have to agree with the professionals, my turbo oil seals are
shot. Theory: caused by the ruptured intake hose after turbo,
lots of air goes straight to atmosphere and the turbo overspeeds,
damaging its oil seals.
So, engine rebuild is NOT necessary. I think that I will replace
the CT20 I now have with a CT26. At the same time, I'll add the
intercooler. Changing the turbo would require different intake
piping anyway, as the compressor outlet is different, as well as
turbine outlet. But it will bolt on to my exhaust manifold.
After these mods, I may also need larger injectors, but that is not
quite certain yet. Hunt for the parts starts on Monday...
BTW, the BFG's and LSD really helped off-the-line acceleration,
during wheelsping (0-26mph) average acceleration is 0.73g's vs
0.51-0.54 on Dunlops/no LSD.
0-30mph comes in 1.96 seconds (was ~2.5)
0-50mph 4.36
0-60mph 6.08 (on 3rd)
0-80mph 10.23
1/4 mile 14.4-14.5@94-96mph
all numbers for 1337kg = 2 persons aboard, almost full tank
weather 993mbar, 11C , dry road. That would require slightly over
1% of weather correction (weather being worse than DIN standard
1013mbar, 15C), but that is left out in these figures.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 07:39:35 -0600 (MDT)
From: Lance Heinrich
Subject: Re: me/mine/mods
To: RamziM2@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
On Sat, 14 Oct 1995 RamziM2@aol.com wrote:
Hi there!!
> Hi everyone!
> The car handles great, but the Eibach springs did not lower it at all. So
Depends on what your after. Are you after handling or looks. Eibach
takes pride in getting the best handling possible out of your car.
Lowering too much usually greatly affects handling (not in a good way
necessarily) and unless you make a lot of other changes to the suspension
geometry, you are better off not getting too low. We have had a lot of
new guys show up at our autox events this year with really modified cars
which look great, but handle as bad as is possible. In fact, many of
these cars are downright unsafe in any kind of emergency scenario or at
speed.
Lance.
---------------------------------------------------------------
| Lance Heinrich @ Valmet Automation (Canada) Ltd.
| lanceh@sa-cgy.valmet.com
|
| 1991 MR2 Turbo
| Previous MR2's : '86 Normally Aspirated, '89 Supercharged
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Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 17:23:39 -0400
From: Derek Motloch
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name : Derek Motloch
Location : London, Ontario Canada
Model : 1991 MR2 NA
Engine : 5SFE
Mods : Ram air kit, new short block, timing tweeks, etc.
email : jmotloch@mustang.uwo.ca
Derek.
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Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 08:59:56 +1000 (EST)
From: Paul Pyyvaara
To: Craig A Terlau
Cc: Toyota-Mods
Subject: Re: wheel studs
On Fri, 13 Oct 1995, Craig A Terlau wrote:
> Does anyone in the group have a source of long wheel studs for Toyota?
> Info on this would be much appreciated.
I have used Toyota Landcruiser studs in my 71 model Corolla - I think
they were around 1-1 1/2 cm longer.
Cheers,
Paul.
------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Pyyvaara - paulp@dstc.edu.au
Research Scientist - Distributed Systems Technology Centre
B O N D U N I V E R S I T Y, QLD, 4229, AUSTRALIA.
Phone (+61 7 55 953 324) Fax (+61 7 55 953 320)
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Date: Sun, 15 Oct 95 23:33 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cgrant@enterprise.ca (colin grant)
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: Colin Grant
Location: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Model: 1987 Celica GTS
Engine: 3S-FE
Mods: Preformance exhaust with Dynomax muffler, Accel Starter Coil.
e-mail: cgrant@enterprise.ca
Future Mods: plan to shave the head to increase compression, upgrade to a
preformance suspension, and add a high flow air filter.
Colin
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From: peymaan@acs.bu.edu
Subject: Transmission
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 12:59:50 -0400 (EDT)
Hi everyone:
My automatic transmission in my Supra turbo finally gave out to the 500+
horsepower the HKS modified engine is feeding it. It now slips going from 1st
to second. I believe my first run down the 1/4 mile track ever is what finally
pushed it over the edge. I need help now from someone in doing something about
this. Should I rebuild the toyota one with the HKS upgrade? Should I change it
all together to a stick? Should I put in a heavy duty GM tranny like a 700R4
or the 200R Buick GNs use? Anyone have any ideas here? I like having an auto
and it makes for a faster car at the 1/4 mile track, but the car is now more
dedicated for "special use", since I will be mainly using another car for my
daily driving. Therefore, a 5 speed or 6 speed is OK now, and I know for
autocross or other racing besides "straight ahead" a stick is better. But I
want to do this once, I don't want to rip it apart again, and if anything will
allow me to use slicks/soft compound tires that would be great. If anyone has
any ideas or knows someone to talk to please let me know.
Thanks,
Dave T
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From: Gary Hong
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 12:12:04 PDT
>From: Aric Shen
>Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 11:07:57 -0700
This guy sure has alot to say eh? :)
Gary
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From: aly abulkheir
Subject: MSD Ignitions
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 16:37:42 -0400 (EDT)
Greetings to all,
What are everyone's feelings on the MSD 6A ignition amplifier.
I am interested in it because of the price. It is only $150 compared to
$400 for a jacobs or $450 for an HKS. I would suppose that you would get
more for your money with the more expensive ones, but if anyone of you are
using the MSD ignition, I would like to know your thoughts on it.
Did it make a noticable difference?
How is the spark plug wear with it installed?
If MSD is good, is the 6A the best deal for my '85 MR2, or is another model
better?
Does the MSD 6A mess up anything with the stock rev limiter? ie, do I need
to go with the 6AL with the rev limiter?
The bottom line is, IS THE MSD IGNITION AMP ANY GOOD?
I have seen it used on the ITAC MR2 in the July '89 issue of Turbo.
Thank you,
Aly at abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu
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From: Gary Hong
To: toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: NOS
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 95 13:46:52 PDT
Does anyone have any experiences with a NOS kit? I am pondering the idea
of putting a 50hp NOS kit in my 82 Celica.
1. Can I fill up the NOS bottle locally when I run out?
2. Can I put in compress air in the bottle to get more air in the cylinders
so it can act like a pseudo turbo when I'm not in the NOS mood? :)
The NOS kit will bring up the GT to about ~146HP, which is just perfect for
my Celica. I just want a little more power available on tap - not like I'm
going to race this 22R equipped car or anything, but it would be nice to
be able to move out of someone's way at a decent rate when I need to. I plan
to keep the car for a while and am hoping it will last me over 200K. The
though of being stuck with this 96HP engine doesn't sit well with me so a
slight improvement, such as NOS would be reasonable. I've looked at the LC
Engineering catalog and they want 4k for the motor and 2k for the accessories.
No thanks, I'll pass.
Also, on the flip side, if I don't want to run NOS that week, I was thinking
about putting compress air in it. It'll be like running the engine under
boost for a few seconds. It must improve HP marginally. I expect a slight
increase with compress air to bring the total HP to a bit over 100HP. Is
that reasonable?
Any help or info would be appreciated.
Gary
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Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 22:26:31 -0700
To: Gary Hong ,
From: Speedline Racing
Subject: Re:
At 12:12 PM 10/16/95 PDT, Gary Hong wrote:
>>From: Aric Shen
>>Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 11:07:57 -0700
>
>This guy sure has alot to say eh? :)
>
>Gary
>
Sorry.. it kept telling me I had an error sending and to resend it.. so
thats what I kept doing..oops
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Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 00:35:39 -0500
To: aly abulkheir ,
From: Fred_Oberbuchner@mbnet.mb.ca (Fred Oberbuchner)
Subject: Re: MSD Ignitions
When I first started modding my car I went out and bought the el-cheapo MSD-4.
My opinion on it was that it didn't do much (as it won't unless you mess
with the air/fuel mixture to richen things up therefore needing more spark)
and it packed it in (died) about 1.5 years into the game. I opened it up
(being an EE) and was disgusted at the cheap techniques and components used
in this unit. To me it was all packaging with no meat behind it. Something a
second year student could build in a lab. Personally, I would say "you DO
get what you pay for".... go for something better. BUT FIRST... decide
how much you want to mod... you may be better off saving your peanuts and
waiting until you actuall NEED more ignition and then buying a complete
fuel computer system/distributorless system....
(now THAT should start some flaming!)
Regards,
Fredo
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Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 22:39:28 -0700
To: aly abulkheir ,
From: Speedline Racing
Subject: Re: MSD Ignitions
>The bottom line is, IS THE MSD IGNITION AMP ANY GOOD?
>
>I have seen it used on the ITAC MR2 in the July '89 issue of Turbo.
>
> Thank you,
> Aly at abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu
I am using the Jacobs Ultra Coil and have never had any problems.. but the
ignition computer I got was bad.. I bought it off a friend as brand new but
I never worked for me.. I never got around to sending it back..
I've heard a lot of people say the MSD 6A worked well for them.. I've never
really heard anyone complain about it come to think of it.. but I heard the
6A is fairly old technology.. its been out for quite a while without any
modifications..
the HKS Twin Power, in my opinion, is very overpriced.. back in the days
when HKS Stages ended at 3, they use to tell you not to bother getting the
Twin Power.. they also use to say not to get the EVC unless you are going to
be doing serious racing.. but thats all changed.. from what I hear its the
same technology as a MSD 6A.. its probably just as old..
I've been hearing lots of good things about the Crane HI-6.. Dynamic
Autosports sells it for $160 + tax (if applicable) and shipping.. it comes
with a built in rev limiter and its pretty new stuff.. Peter Farrell used it
on a 1993 or 1994 RX-7 twin turbo and picked up like 50 or 60 horsepower..
but before you hit the ground in uncontrollable laughter, let me explain why
(as it was explained to me).. on the RX-7, at very high boost levels (15-18
psi), the intake charge begins to blow out the spark generated by the
ignition system, so at high boost, power begins to drop off sharply.. after
they installed a Crane HI-6, there was no drop in power and since the spark
was strong enough to ignite all the fuel mixture, they gained lots of
horsepower.. it was in an issue of Turbo Magazine farily recently..
supposedly they didn't get the same results with the MSD.. if you were gonna
pay $150 for a 6A, I'd pay the extra $10 for the HI-6 just for the rev limiter..
% Aric Shen
% Speedline Racing Concepts
% 1987 RX-7 Turbo & 1986 MR2
% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
& check out: http://www.webcom.com/~dynamic
% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
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Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 00:40:51 -0500
To: Gary Hong ,
From: Fred_Oberbuchner@mbnet.mb.ca (Fred Oberbuchner)
Subject: Re: NOS
>2. Can I put in compress air in the bottle to get more air in the cylinders
> so it can act like a pseudo turbo when I'm not in the NOS mood? :)
Run the calculations...
displacement x RPM = liters/minute
I did this some time ago thinking I could use one of my SCUBA tanks as a
"turbo"... came out to something like 10-20 seconds of NORMAL running (no
boost)... and those tanks were 3000psi, 80 cubic feet...
When you look at NOS, I believe the effect is more chemical than physical...
Nitrous Oxide and fuel versus air (Nitrogen Oxygen etc) and fuel...
any chemical engineers out there?
just my senseless rambling!
Regards,
Fred
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From: Gary Hong
To: Fred_Oberbuchner@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, garyh@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Subject: Re: NOS
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 0:04:56 PDT
From: Fred Oberbuchner
>
>>2. Can I put in compress air in the bottle to get more air in the cylinders
>> so it can act like a pseudo turbo when I'm not in the NOS mood? :)
>Run the calculations...
>displacement x RPM = liters/minute
>
>I did this some time ago thinking I could use one of my SCUBA tanks as a
>"turbo"... came out to something like 10-20 seconds of NORMAL running (no
>boost)... and those tanks were 3000psi, 80 cubic feet...
That's good enough for passing ;). A nos bottle will only last a little
over a minute.
>When you look at NOS, I believe the effect is more chemical than physical...
>Nitrous Oxide and fuel versus air (Nitrogen Oxygen etc) and fuel...
Supposidly, the cooling effect will lower air temp by 60-70 degree. When
air is decompress, it'll come out cool as well, but I'm not sure if it'll
be as cool as NOS decompressing.
>just my senseless rambling!
And my senseless ideas.
Gary
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Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 00:48:01 -1000
From: Allen T "Koji" Kam
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: SEMA Road Trip !
So far the bunch of guys from the Toyota Mods Listing is
Chris "Buy me drinkie" Myer
Allan "Botoboy" Chen
and myself Allen "Koji buys Chris drinkie" Kam
Gary Hong is unsure.
Our purpose on going to Sema and pow wowing is to discuss
the Toyota Mods FAQ (ya i've been slacking on working on it)
And update all the listings and proably doing some major
drinking !!!
Oppps i meant...errr Looking for kewl aftermarket parts for TM list =)
So far, it stands got us, and my friend Ted Koseki from the Rx-7 list,
and 3 of their dudes =)
Everyone is welcome to come !
Please feel free to email myself
koji@ohana.com or return this koji@mael.soest.hawaii.edu
If anyone feels there are any pressing matters to be discussed at our gathering
please let me know.
like things for the TM FAQ =)
The follow up post is the unfinished TM-FAQ by Chris,
-Koji
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| Allen T "Koji" Kam koji@ohana.com |
| |
| PARTY NAKED !!! - NO ONE KNOWS IN CYBERSPACE..... |
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