^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^ ^^^
^^^ _______ ^^^
^^^ ,' - _ ^^^
^^^ ________,'__________>>> - _ ^ ^^^
^^^ , ' | ^^^
^^^ ~I~ I~I \ / I~I ~I~ .~. _ I\/I I~I I~\ <~ ^^^
^^^ I I_I | I_I I I~I I I I_I I_/ _> ^^^
^^^ `---\__/----------------\__/----' ^^^
^^^ ^^^
^^^ P O S T I N G S Nov 1995 ^^^
^^^ --------------------------- ^^^
^^^ ^^^
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: hi
To: levoc@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (KeNdRiCk W.)
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 02:55:43 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> Today, i had my exhaust changed. anyways, after i got home, i realized
> there's a strong burning smell from under the car. when i checked the
> engine i realized one of hte spark plug wires was pulled out! So i was
> basically running with three plugs
>
> my car is' a 93MR2 turbo. I was wondering what would be the consequence
> of running with one of the plug wire out? and what is that burning smell
> from? the car was running fine, turbo came on nicely so i didn't know
> something was wrong til i got home and smell that strong burning odor.
While three cylinder burning the fuel, the 4th injector was still
supplying fuel. This fuel got sucked to the exhaust, probably
burning in your exhaust manifold and turbo, heating them considerably,
causing the smell. Probably no damage, unless you travelled long
periods of time at (high) boost.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 09:52:22 +0500
From: toyota@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker (Toyota))
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: hi
> > Today, i had my exhaust changed. anyways, after i got home, i realized
> > there's a strong burning smell from under the car. when i checked the
> > engine i realized one of hte spark plug wires was pulled out! So i was
> > basically running with three plugs
> >
> > my car is' a 93MR2 turbo. I was wondering what would be the consequence
> > of running with one of the plug wire out? and what is that burning smell
> > from? the car was running fine, turbo came on nicely so i didn't know
> > something was wrong til i got home and smell that strong burning odor.
If one plug was misfiring then you would have a very rich mixture in
the exhaust. This mix would oxidize in the catalytic converter making
it extremely hot. Hopefully it was a short trip home because
eventually the catalyst will get so hot it will melt, permanently
damaging it.
Its also worth noting that new exhausts tend to smell for the
first few hours because of the oils, paint and so on left
from the manufacturing process. Hopefully that is the
actual cause of the burning smell.
Jon
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From: aly abulkheir
Subject: The cat
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 11:15:35 -0500 (EST)
To all,
Has anyone removed their catalytic converter on a 4AGE or similar
motor and Truly Passed a real State inspection Emissions Test? I don't mean
paying someone to have it passed. I mean a real emissions test. I am not
too fond of removing it because of what I learned from Chemistry 101 of what
comes out of an engine before it reaches the cat, but if it will give the
car a little more power and allow certain exhaust systems to be put on more
easily, I will consider the possibility of removing it. I just don't want
to remove it (or hollow it out as I have seen some people do) then get to an
emmisions test, find it won't pass, and then be stuck having to buy a new
cat. That would be terrible. If anyone has passed a true emissions test
without a catalytic converter attached during the test, and did not pay the
station to pass it, please respond.
Thank you,
Aly
'85 MR2, all options
Looking for a little more power
the best handling,
and the most cost effective mods
abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu
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From: Gary Hong
To: abulkh34@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: The cat
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 95 10:55:49 PST
From: aly abulkheir
>
>To all,
> Has anyone removed their catalytic converter on a 4AGE or similar
>motor and Truly Passed a real State inspection Emissions Test? I don't mean
>paying someone to have it passed. I mean a real emissions test. I am not
>too fond of removing it because of what I learned from Chemistry 101 of what
>comes out of an engine before it reaches the cat, but if it will give the
>car a little more power and allow certain exhaust systems to be put on more
>easily, I will consider the possibility of removing it. I just don't want
>to remove it (or hollow it out as I have seen some people do) then get to an
>emmisions test, find it won't pass, and then be stuck having to buy a new
>cat. That would be terrible. If anyone has passed a true emissions test
>without a catalytic converter attached during the test, and did not pay the
>station to pass it, please respond.
Yes, THIS I would like to know. I live in CA and this would be beneficial to
those in Cali.
Gary
22R Celica
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Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 12:31:00 -0800 (PST)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: Re: The cat
To: "toyota-mods@cyberauto.com"
The presence of the catalytic converter is probably the most important item
that the mechanic will check when doing the visual inspection. If it has
been replaced by a test pipe, he will know. However, if you replace it with
a look-alike low restriction "pre silencer" or simply remove the guts, then
you can probably get away with the visual inspection. It still has to pass
the sniff test, however.
Find an old cat, remove the guts, install it, and take the car to a "pass or
don't pay" station. If it passes, you have your answer. If it doesn't,
then you pay nothing.
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
----------
From: toyota-mods-owner
To: abulkh34; toyota-mods
Subject: Re: The cat
Date: Wednesday, November 01, 1995 10:55AM
From: aly abulkheir
>
>To all,
> Has anyone removed their catalytic converter on a 4AGE or similar
>motor and Truly Passed a real State inspection Emissions Test? I don't
mean
>paying someone to have it passed. I mean a real emissions test. I am not
>too fond of removing it because of what I learned from Chemistry 101 of
what
>comes out of an engine before it reaches the cat, but if it will give the
>car a little more power and allow certain exhaust systems to be put on more
>easily, I will consider the possibility of removing it. I just don't want
>to remove it (or hollow it out as I have seen some people do) then get to
an
>emmisions test, find it won't pass, and then be stuck having to buy a new
>cat. That would be terrible. If anyone has passed a true emissions test
>without a catalytic converter attached during the test, and did not pay the
>station to pass it, please respond.
Yes, THIS I would like to know. I live in CA and this would be beneficial
to
those in Cali.
Gary
22R Celica
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From: Mark Sink - Imonics Corporation
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 16:53:53 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: The cat
>
> To all,
> Has anyone removed their catalytic converter on a 4AGE or similar
> motor and Truly Passed a real State inspection Emissions Test?
If you remove it, you fail! regardless of test results, which they won't
even bother to run. You might even get a nice $5000 fine. Who Knows?
Mark
Whatever you do, put the thing back on before you ask a state inspection station
to look at it!!!
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From: reyb@wildcat.sandiegoca.attgis.com
Subject: Re: The cat
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota Mods)
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 14:34:15 -0800 (PST)
>
> Find an old cat, remove the guts, install it
>
I've done this on my '86 4Runner(22RE) and found that it
does nada/zip/zilch for performance.
-Rey-
============================================================
Rey Berin Phone: (619) 485-3285
AT&T Global Information Solutions Fax: (619) 485-3010
17095 Via Del Campo
San Diego, CA 92127 Rey.Berin@SanDiegoCA.ATTGIS.COM
============================================================
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Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 18:57:00 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Brake pads
>Stock toyota pads. I autox a LOT. That's all I use. I even do the
>occassional lapping session on our 2 mile road course. No problems.
Gotta agree with Lance. If cold performance is an issue, you will
want to avoid performance brake pads.
Chris
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Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 19:08:53 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: The cat
>I've done this on my '86 4Runner(22RE) and found that it
>does nada/zip/zilch for performance.
I'll have to agree with Rey here, especially if you don't do any
"heavy" mods, such as upgrade the cam, etc. I once completely
disconnected my exhaust at the cat and took the pickup out for
some testing. I figured that top-end testing would be about
the best/most consistent way of going. I tried it with everything
hooked up, with just the breather open, with just the exhaust open,
and with both the breather and exhaust open. Result: Nothing, really.
I think that with both the breather and exhaust open, I got like
1 more mph at top speed. (Matti can give us a guesstimate of how many
hp this was.) Trust me, there was no boost off the line whatsoever.
Your results may be different if you try this in a turbo/super charged
car, but for a NA car, I wouldn't expect much difference.
Chris
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From: EXPORTER@delphi.com
Date: Wed, 01 Nov 1995 20:21:10 -0500 (EST)
Subject: 22-RTE
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>I have a '85 Celica GTS Conv. and I've been inquiring about
>possibly swapping engines. I was wondering if anyone in
>the mods group knew of, heard of, or even put a 22RTE in
>a Celica? Since it is a 22-RE base, I figure it should bolt
>right in, but will it fit? Any ideas on the $$'s of such a job?
>Is it even likely? Should I go that route, or can I upgrade
>the 22RE to the same power w/ less cost?
-culture
I Can make one suggestion, Replace your 22-RE head with
a 20-R engine head. It will bolt right on. It will raise your
compression about one full ratio and give you all around
better performance and more usable rpm. The 22-R Heads
in general have swirl combustion design to meet
stricter emission standards of its time. Unfortunately
it dose not have the performance potential of the 20-R
especially in the higher rpm. You will have to get rid of
the EFI and run carburetors instead. Most likely duel side
draft style for clearance.
Look for an older model 20-R head without a mechanical
fuel pump that bolts on the front of the head. You will
have to run a different electric fuel pump because the
one for the fuel injection is going to be too high a
pressure for carburetors which only needs about
4 to 8 lbs. max. Compared to your stock EFI pump which
puts out about 80 lbs..
The 22-RTE is a rare find (a least around here)
if your not too mechanically inclined . You can just
modify your 22-RE by just adding carburetors or bigger
fuel injectors. I like carbs myself compared to the stock
EFI the throttle response much is better.
Also keep in mind, if you think passing emissions will
be a problem in you area.
Rick Dormoi / T & R Auto / exporter@delphi.com
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From: Gary Hong
To: EXPORTER@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: 22-RTE
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 95 18:46:49 PST
From: EXPORTER@delphi.com
>
>Look for an older model 20-R head without a mechanical
>fuel pump that bolts on the front of the head. You will
>have to run a different electric fuel pump because the
>one for the fuel injection is going to be too high a
>pressure for carburetors which only needs about
>4 to 8 lbs. max. Compared to your stock EFI pump which
>puts out about 80 lbs..
Isn't there a few different 20-R heads that differ between years?
Gary
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From: aly abulkheir
Subject: throttle body
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 22:45:37 -0500 (EST)
Dear all,
I live in the NY area and I would like to know if anyone out there
has had their throttle body modified (bored out, better butterfly plate,
throttle position sensor recalibrated, etc.), where they had it done, and
how much it costs. I can travel anywhere in the NY,NJ,CT area. Even if you
don't live in this area, but have had experience with this type of
modification, please respond. We have Sarizer Motor Company (formerly Toy
Store East) nearby in NJ, but if anyone has had anyone else do it, please
do tell.
Thank you,
Aly
'85 MR2,red with ALL options
Looking for a little more power
the best handling
and the most cost effective mods
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Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 21:13:06 -0800 (PST)
From: "KeNdRiCk W."
To: toyota mods
Subject: hi
I was wondering if installing an external type airfilter like powerflow
or K&N injection kit in a MR2 (MKII) will have problems during the
winter when rain is abundant. I mean since water can enter the engine
compartment thru the engine cover vents and also along the lid edges, would
the airfilter get drenched if the car is parked in the rain all day or
even during car washing.
Ken..
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:03:57 -0700 (MST)
To: Gary Hong ,
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: The cat
>> Has anyone removed their catalytic converter on a 4AGE or similar
>>motor and Truly Passed a real State inspection Emissions Test? I don't mean
>>paying someone to have it passed. I mean a real emissions test. I am not
>>too fond of removing it because of what I learned from Chemistry 101 of what
>>comes out of an engine before it reaches the cat, but if it will give the
>>car a little more power and allow certain exhaust systems to be put on more
>>easily, I will consider the possibility of removing it. I just don't want
>>to remove it (or hollow it out as I have seen some people do) then get to an
>>emmisions test, find it won't pass, and then be stuck having to buy a new
>>cat. That would be terrible. If anyone has passed a true emissions test
>>without a catalytic converter attached during the test, and did not pay the
>>station to pass it, please respond.
>
>Yes, THIS I would like to know. I live in CA and this would be beneficial to
>those in Cali.
>
Well, in California you need to pass a *visual* inspection as well. Your
car can pass with flying colors but if the smog tech sees that you have no
cat, then he, by law, is supposed to fail you.
% Aric Shen
% Speedline Racing Concepts
% 1987 RX-7 Turbo & 1986 MR2
% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
& check out: http://www.webcom.com/~dynamic
% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
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From: Gary Hong
To: abulkh34@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, shafted@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Subject: Re: The cat
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 95 23:16:02 PST
>
>Well, in California you need to pass a *visual* inspection as well. Your
>car can pass with flying colors but if the smog tech sees that you have no
>cat, then he, by law, is supposed to fail you.
>% Aric Shen
Yeah, but who says we have to actually take the cat out? :) We can gut
the thing out!
Gary
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:17:47 -0700 (MST)
To: "KeNdRiCk W." ,
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: hi
At 09:13 PM 11/1/95 -0800, KeNdRiCk W. wrote:
>
>I was wondering if installing an external type airfilter like powerflow
>or K&N injection kit in a MR2 (MKII) will have problems during the
>winter when rain is abundant. I mean since water can enter the engine
>compartment thru the engine cover vents and also along the lid edges, would
>the airfilter get drenched if the car is parked in the rain all day or
>even during car washing.
>
>Ken..
>
I've never seen a Power Flow kit for the 85-87 MR2, but the 88-89 kit puts
the filter in the trunk.. I'm using a large size Power Flow (from my RX-7),
a piece of 4 inch "hose" and an adapter piece that bolts up to the air flow
meter, and YES, when it rains, it drenches the air filter.. I usually put a
plastic bag over the opening if I know it raining.. how does everyone else
put a filter on their 85-87 MR2 ? I'd like to know..
% Aric Shen
% Speedline Racing Concepts
% 1987 RX-7 Turbo & 1986 MR2
% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
& check out: http://www.webcom.com/~dynamic
% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 07:20:16 GMT
From: Joe Gaffney
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: MR2 Kit Cars?
I am a new subscriber to this list. After driving (and fixing!) Rabbits
for years, I'm thinking about moving to a Toyota. I hadn't considered
Japanese cars before because I'm 6'2", 200#, and the ones I'd tried
just didn't fit like my Rabbit did. Then I tried an MR2...
These are great little cars! I'll get used to no back seat, I promise!
Then, I found www.mr2.com and this list. This is great! I never knew there
was such a following for this little car.
So, here's my question: I have a chance to pick up a Mk I cheap. It has
120k miles, and almost every panel is crinkly. The interior is pretty
ratty, too. But, she was religious about servicing the car, and it runs
great. I could pick it up for a project car and park the Rabbit outside.
I would want to re-body it, though. Does anyone know of a kit car for
the MR2? I'd be really interested in one that comes with its own frame.
I have visions of a Toyota sports racer for the street. A real summertime-
only car. I picked up a copy of Kit Car, but, other than 100 different Cobra kits,
the only ads were for Fiero re-bodies. Any help here....
Joe Gaffney
jgaffney@wco.com
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 01:29:32 -1000
From: Allen T "Koji" Kam
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: RE: MR-2 Kit Car
>From toyota-mods-owner@CyberAuto.Com Wed Nov 1 21:23:55 1995
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 07:20:16 GMT
From: Joe Gaffney
Subject: MR2 Kit Cars?
>I am a new subscriber to this list. After driving (and fixing!) Rabbits
>for years, I'm thinking about moving to a Toyota. I hadn't considered
>Japanese cars before because I'm 6'2", 200#, and the ones I'd tried
>just didn't fit like my Rabbit did. Then I tried an MR2...
Heh, the MR-2's have great space, belive it or not. I found them
rather comfortable (1987 & 1991) with lots of leg room.
>These are great little cars! I'll get used to no back seat, I promise!
Heh, whats a Back seat ? =)
>Then, I found www.mr2.com and this list. This is great! I never knew there
>was such a following for this little car.
Heh, Fear This =) There's quite a following for imports !
>So, here's my question: I have a chance to pick up a Mk I cheap. It has
>120k miles, and almost every panel is crinkly. The interior is pretty
>ratty, too. But, she was religious about servicing the car, and it runs
>great. I could pick it up for a project car and park the Rabbit outside.
Good project car, depends on what ya wanna do...
>I would want to re-body it, though. Does anyone know of a kit car for
>the MR2? I'd be really interested in one that comes with its own frame.
>I have visions of a Toyota sports racer for the street. A real summertime-
>only car. I picked up a copy of Kit Car, but, other than 100 different
>Cobra kits, the only ads were for Fiero re-bodies. Any help here....
I guess this is the reason why i responded.
It is possible to do the Lamborghini Kit on a MR-2, you can try contact
the Kit Car magazine dealer, they had a special on it sometime ago.
Something about Fieros being hard to find and the MR-2 having a better
platform in which to do it with.
Heck, I was ready to send my dang 8k for the bodykit =)
Get back to me, I haven't seen it since they first published it, proably
a no go anymore =(
Toyota's just aren't popular, although i'm sure they would do it if you
paid someone enough money to or bought the kit.
I belive the MR-2 is a better platform, i've ridden in and inspected the
creation of a Fiero model Lambo replica. Got one for sale at the moment
in the paper for 8k ha ha ha ...
>Joe Gaffney
>jgaffney@wco.com
Get back to me also =)
-Allen T "Koji" Kam
(*NOTE*) Can't "3 wheel" a Toyota, like Rabbits do, and the parts cost
slightly more =) Oh, don't break transmissions as much either !!
-Allen T "Koji" Kam
*-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-*
| Allen T "Koji" Kam |
| Live Life... koji@mael.soet.Hawaii.edu |
| Taste Death... koji@ohana.com |
| Speed is Pure !!!!! |
| Don't let up till you see RED !! 1987 Toyota Corolla FX-16 GTS |
| Advan Racing / HKS / Jacobs / SSR / Toyota Racing Development / Yokohama |
| How SERIOUS do YOU wanna GET ??!?!?!! Sum times ya GADA pay the Price.... |
| V-8's are a Blast...but i kinna gotta have to save GAS !!! |
| Love is the only ting dat has 2 be earned... |
| Eberry ting else can be hacked ! - Reflex the Kismet Thief of Hearts |
| Setting the Standards..... -Benchmark Racing |
*-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-*
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From: Mark Sink - Imonics Corporation
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 10:18:35 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: MR2 Kit Cars?
There is a kit for the MKI to turn it into a BMW M1. Pictures are available at
www.mr2.com. In the FTP area.
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From: "Scott, Dan"
To: ToyMods
Subject: Sort of a test
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 95 09:32:00 PST
Since I have not heard a peep from the list for a while, this message is a
feeler into cyberspace.
I have a turbo Celica and lately I have been experiencing a kind of a
hesitation when going to WOT. The turbo comes on and the boost builds OK but
then it feels like the boost drops. The meter stays on full boost. It feels
like it does when you floor it with the A/C on. Kind of like a turbo defeat
option. Any suggestions?
Thanks
Dan Scott
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From: Casey7970@aol.com
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 16:55:11 -0500
To: DScott@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Boost drop out
In a message dated 95-11-02 13:25:09 EST, you write:
>I have a turbo Celica and lately I have been experiencing a kind of a
>hesitation when going to WOT. The turbo comes on and the boost builds OK but
>then it feels like the boost drops. The meter stays on full boost. It feels
>like it does when you floor it with the A/C on. Kind of like a turbo defeat
>option. Any suggestions?
Drops out at about 6k rpms on a 3S-GTE? (That's what engine you have if my
memory is correct.)
Same problem: 91 MR2 Turbo
I am by no means an expert, but here is my best guess:
As you lay into the throttle the boost continues to build with rpm's until
somewhere around 10-11 psi. and 6k rpm's (not sure of the exact figure).
This is the maximum allowable boost that the wastegate will allow the
compressor to produce. Unfortunately this affects the seat of the pants rush
feeling by happening about 1k rpms short of redline, thus flattening the
boost curve. Although it feels like you have lost power, you are more than
likely just maxed out on boost pressure. And the rate of horsepower increase
has dropped to zero. You are however getting the maximum hp your enigine is
capable of at about 6000-6500 rpms.
The solution: Increase the boost pressure by switching out the
wastegate/boost limiter.
As to how to do this and what to replace it with, there are probably other
people on this list that can better answer this.
OTOH: If this is a new problem for this car, I'll have to give you the deer
in the headlights look.
Anyway, there's my $.02. (and like the real thing probably not worth much =
)
Kip Anderson
91 MR2 Turbo
Casey7970@aol.com
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 17:36:22 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Admin Blounce, resent
Dear Joe,
Welcome to the mods list! To h*lp you with your question, I know of
Erebuni in Brooklyn, NY. They claim to manufacture over 1500 body kits for
japanese cars. You can find them in Turbo magazine or similar magazines.
If I come across their number and address, I shall forward it to you.
Aly
'85 MR2, with all options
Looking for a little more power
the best handling
and the most cost effective mods
abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
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From: "Scott, Dan"
To: ToyMods
Subject: Me/Mine/Mods
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 95 15:13:00 PST
Name : Dan Scott
Location :Vancouver B.C.
Model : 1988 Celica 4WD Turbo
Engine :3S-GTE
Mods : Not much so far just: K&N filter, Magnecor plug wires, and
Redline transmission, differential and engine oils
email :DScott@ea.com
I am re-subscribing after I got bumped off the list for some reason. I don't
think it was anything I said. ; ) Future mods will be the suspension (TRD)
and 15" wheels/rubber.
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: The cat
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 02:00:25 +0200 (EET)
> >I've done this on my '86 4Runner(22RE) and found that it
> >does nada/zip/zilch for performance.
>
> I'll have to agree with Rey here, especially if you don't do any
> "heavy" mods, such as upgrade the cam, etc. I once completely
> disconnected my exhaust at the cat and took the pickup out for
> some testing. I figured that top-end testing would be about
> the best/most consistent way of going. I tried it with everything
> hooked up, with just the breather open, with just the exhaust open,
> and with both the breather and exhaust open. Result: Nothing, really.
> I think that with both the breather and exhaust open, I got like
> 1 more mph at top speed. (Matti can give us a guesstimate of how many
> hp this was.) Trust me, there was no boost off the line whatsoever.
Maybe 3hp...
> Your results may be different if you try this in a turbo/super charged
> car, but for a NA car, I wouldn't expect much difference.
I disconnected my exhaust right beside the gearbox, and don't think
I gained anything either, at least not peak hp. The testing
was not at our regular test straight, so the comparisons aren't
that accurate. There MAY have been a slight increase in power on 2nd gear,
bringing it even with 3rd gear results. We may test this againg in near
future, weather permitting (3" of snow today, time to put on winter
tyres). Also, the Truth (tm) on K&N cone vs. stock airbox+FIAAM.
Stay tuned...
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: geoff@softy.softwords.bc.ca
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 95 16:02:43 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: MR2 Kit Cars?
Most MR2 body kits are listed at: (pictures, addresses)
http://mr2.com/AeroKits.html
I'll be revising this page soon, but basically, they are all listed.
Geoff
'91 MR2 turbo, 155,000km
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From: EXPORTER@delphi.com
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 1995 21:14:36 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Will a 3-TC carb fit 2-TC engine
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>The 32/36 DGV is a great carb and may be
>the best choice for replacement of the stock
>carb, but don't expect a 30% increase in power.
>You will get a small but noticable gain in power
>from the DGV, but will also get much better
>throttle response with the mechanical secondary
>on the DGV. Also, it is FAR better to modify the
>stock intake manifold to accept the DGV than to
>use an addapter plate!
>Craig
30% horse power is not a far fetched estimate of increased
horse power for the 2-TC engine by adding a Weber
32 /36 DGV down draft carburetor.
The 2-TC is rated at 102 horse at 6,000 rpm. 30% is only
about 32 hp.
You can get as much as about 15 horse power from just
changing to a electric fan instead of the stock one that
runs off a belt from the crank pulley.
I have messed with the 2-TC Asian carb by making the
secondary open more synchronized with the primary
butterfly and plugging all the octopus like
emission vacuum hoses and alike.
But I'll take the Weber any time or ever better yet
a 38 / 38 DGAS a synchronous carb
(both barrels open at the same time).
It is simple and it makes this motor scream when jetted
properly. (and gain more respect on the street) with
more usable power in the high rpm
.
The adaptor works well and by theory gives the fuel / air
mixture more velocity due to height, you can modify the
intake manifold depending on where you want your
power band but that is another story.
Rick Dormoi / T & R Auto / exporter@delphi.com
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From: EXPORTER@delphi.com
Date: Thu, 02 Nov 1995 22:08:58 -0500 (EST)
Subject: RE:22-RTE Head Games
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>Look for an older model 20-R head without a mechanical
>fuel pump that bolts on the front of the head. You will
>have to run a different electric fuel pump because the
>one for the fuel injection is going to be too high a
>pressure for carburetors which only needs about
>4 to 8 lbs. max. Compared to your stock EFI pump which
>puts out about 80 lbs..
Isn't there a few different 20-R heads that differ between years?
Gary Hong
-----------------------------------
Reply :
Yes Gary,
In fact some may vary between months
you probably want a head from some ware around
75 to 79 that ran an electric pump from the gas tank
make sure it has all of the provisions for bolts you
need. To run your power steering pump A.C.
Compressor etc.. sometimes you can make a simple
bracket or drill and tap. whatever it takes to hook all
that garb up the 85 GTS has under the hood.
If you do find a head that has a mechanical pump on
front. Remove the pump (two bolts) and remove the
cam that makes it work its only bolted to the end of
the over head cam where the distributor drive is.
Then you must make a plate to cover and seal the huge
square hole where the pump used to bolt on. Or maybe
weld it , but make sure to check the head after, for warping
from the intense heat.
Rick Dormoi / T & R Auto / exporter@delphi.com
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:14:30 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: hi
K&N claims that their filters work wet when a conventional paper filter
won't.
FWIW.
Chris
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:39:10 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Brake pads
Aly asked me to forward this request for inf* to the entire list. I
recommended Stillen Sport Rotors and Metal Master brake pads if
cold performance wasn't too critical, and if his racing division
would allow it. Anyone else?
Chris
>From: aly abulkheir
>Subject: Re: Brake pads
>To: cmyer@CyberAuto.Com (Christopher Myer)
>Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 21:01:30 -0500 (EST)
>
>Dear Christopher,
> Do you also recommend stock pads for the mk1 MR2? I autocross about
>7 times a year with my '85 MR2 and would just like to have the best braking
>performance. Remember that the braking distance (60-0) for the '91-'95
>model was around 119-107 feet while the '85 was measured in Car and Driver
>in '85 as 138 feet. I am supposing that with the 600 lb lower weight of my
>car I should be able to stop even faster than the mkII with the proper mods.
>Any idea what the best way do acheive this would be? Our choices of course
>would be rotors, pads, brake lines, etc. I am not worried about going into
>street prepared category.
>
> Could you please post this letter to the mods list so that everyone
>can respond as well. I did not get a chance to put the mods address.
>
> Thank you,
> Aly
> '85 MR2 ALL Options
> Looking for a little more power
> and the most cost effective mods
>
>
>PS, I thought that pads would be the first things to change, though I
>understand your point on the compound affecting hot and cold brake
>performance.
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:46:35 -0500
From: mdowe@wchat.on.ca
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Sort of a test+ the cat
>
>Since I have not heard a peep from the list for a while, this message is a
>feeler into cyberspace.
>
>I have a turbo Celica and lately I have been experiencing a kind of a
>hesitation when going to WOT. The turbo comes on and the boost builds OK but
>then it feels like the boost drops. The meter stays on full boost. It feels
>like it does when you floor it with the A/C on. Kind of like a turbo defeat
>option. Any suggestions?
>
Have you noticed any oil consumption recently?
A scenario that I have seen twice before involved the seals failing on the
turbo,(normal boost, no noise) with the oil being deposited on the catalytic
converter. These were turbo Mr. II 's and the converter that was clogged was
the one that bolts to the turbo. This was confirmed by removing the
converter and inspecting the honeycomb. The deposits on the converter should
be easy to see. Warranty was very helpful, replacement of turbo, and
converter solved the problem.
I agree that there is little to be gained by hollowing out a good cat.
converter. If you are suspicious of the converter, remove it and inspect it.
Things that are damaging to converters are:
- driving with one spark plug wire off ( five minutes of hard driving will
cause the converter to glow bright red)
- high oil consumption
- clearing a flooded engine
Mike Dowe
mdowe@wchat.on.ca
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Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 22:55:56 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Out of the closet (so to speak!)
I've gotten a bunch of email from TM group members saying "Oh,
are you in the parts business?", and surprised responses when I've
said, "Yes, but I don't want to seem like I'm spamming the group."
So, based on a lot of feedback, I decided it wouldn't be too excessive
if I just did one quick, informal note about what Cyberspace Automotive
Performance is all about. (It is, after all, the host of this group!)
I formed CAP about a year ago to serve as an outlet to provide inexpensive
performance parts for my 'net-friends, mostly here on TM. Since then,
it has expanded into a complete auto parts business, solely on the 'net,
but the main goal hasn't changed--to provide the best prices on the
performance parts folks need.
In general, I've found that if folks buy stuff from places other than
CAP, they pay too much. Why is that? Truthfully, because I don't charge
enough to make any money! Obviously, that will have to change in the
future, but for now my goal is to make a strong, positive name for the
company on the 'net, and develop a strong customer base. I've purposely
avoided using this group as an advertising medium, but I'm always
disappointed to find out that folks have bought products elsewhere,
costing them money and me an opportunity to increase my volume. On the
otherhand, I don't want anyone to feel like they must buy from CAP or
else not talk about their purchases. I've never chastised anyone for
buying elsewhere, and I never will. I encourage competition if it
brings about better pricing and service.
That's probably about enough about CAP. I'll close by attaching a
list of some of the more common products we sell for MR2's. I'm sure
that a lot of the MR2 owners have already seen this list. I would love
to have a list like this for every car manufactured, but it takes many
hours to put together a list like this (and ensure its accuracy)--I
simply haven't enough time in the day to do it. If anyone ever needs
any pricing information for their Toyota or any other car, just drop
me some email. I'd love to be of assistance.
Chris
(PS: Since the SEMA show, I've found a lot more manufacturers, and
hope to be adding their products as well. Keep in mind that this isn't
an exhaustive list, just a place to start. Enjoy.)
-------------------Begin Attached List------------------------------
Toyota MR2 (85-95)
=====================
(Last Updated: da month yr)
Centerforce Clutches:
84 NA, Centerforce I, CF020523, $242.36
84 NA, Dual Friction, DF523020, $297.59
85-90 NA, Dual Friction, DF542025, $325.81
All Others: Centerforce I, TBA
Eibach Coil Spring Set:
(Email for more info)
Energy Suspension Bushings:
93 Front Control Arm and Strut Rod Bushing Set
8-3110, $28.76
91-93 Rear Control Arm and Strut Rod Bushing Set
8-3111, $30.94
93 Front Sway Bar Bushing Set, 8-5110, $8.21
91-93 Rear Sway Bar Bushing Set, 8-5111, $8.21
Greddy Exhaust System:
85-89 NA, 109005, $370.26
85-89 SC, 109009, $376.99
90-92 NA, 109007, $461.89
90-92 T, 109006, $486.20
Greddy Strut Tower Brace:
85-89, $102.00
Greddy Turbo Timer w/Harness:
Turbo & SC, $132.59
Greddy TVVC (Variable Boost Control):
375514 (SW20), $102.28
Hayden Oil Cooler:
457, $109.53
Hayden Remote Oil Filter Kit:
291, $35.70
HKS Cams & Adjustable Timing Gears:
4AG engine, $297.28 (cams, each), $142.03 (gears, each)
(Various grinds available, email for info)
HKS Exhaust Systems:
Turbo Exhaust
91-92, 2567EC-11328P, $485.86
Sport Exhaust
85-89 NA, 2550EC-11323J, $419.18
90-92 NA, 2550EC-11327P, $483.58
HKS EVC III:
3150EC-90000X, $828.86
3170EC-90000X, (atm), $951.26
HKS Fuel Cut Defencer (FCD):
90+ Turbo, 4015XX-11327P, $98.06
HKS Oversize Supercharger Pulley:
1342XX-11333M, $316.76
HKS Peak Hold Boost Meter (25 in Hg/20 psi):
4380EC-90000X, $261.86
HKS Powerflow Air Filter System:
88-89 SC, 3333EC-11333M, $165.03
91-95 NA, 3333EC-11327P, $181.13
91-95 T, 3333EC-11328P, $165.03
HKS Turbo Timer IV w/Harness:
Turbo Only, $188.60
Jacobs Ignition:
Energy Pak:
Mileage Master, 370406, $246.75
Pro Street, 370506, $269.25
Energy Team:
Mileage Master, 370416, $321.75
Pro Street, 370516, $348.00
Ultra Team:
Mileage Master, 372416, $359.25
Pro Street, 372516, $385.50
K&N Filtercharger Air Filter:
85-86, E-2485, $34.95
87-90, E-2605, $36.95
91-95, 33-2030, $43.95
K&N Filter Care Kit:
99-5050, $7.00
K&N Filtercharger Injection Performance Kit:
90-95 NA, 57-9001, $138.27
90-95 T, 57-9002, TBA
Magnecor KV85 Competition Spark Plug Wires:
85-89 NA, 45115, $53.93
88-89 SC, 45183, $55.00
90-92 T, 45175, $71.61
Pace Setter Header/Exhaust System:
85-89 NA, 88-1373, $121.52
90-93 NA, 88-1412, $135.82
Pacific Auto Accessories Aerodynamic Styling:
(Many products available, email for info)
Splitfire Spark Plugs:
SF329D, $5.45 each
Stillen Sport Rotor Sets:
86-89
Front, TOY1000, $194.19
Rear, TOY1001, $202.31
90-94 NA, 90-91 Turbo
Front, TOY1100, $226.69
Rear, TOY1101, $263.25
92-94 Turbo
Front, TOY1200, $299.00
Rear, TOY1201, $264.06
Stillen/Metal Master Brake Pads:
85-89 (all), and 90 NA
Front, D507M, $40.48
Rear, D551M, $64.13
90-91 Turbo
Front, D489M, $67.48
Rear, D766M, $62.93
91-93 NA
Front, D507M, $40.48
Rear, D766M, $62.93
92-94 Turbo
Front, D789SM, $37.13
Rear, D766M, $62.93
Suspension Technologies Anti-Sway Bar Kit:
85-89
Complete Set, 3-078, $259.56
Front Only, 1-078 (21mm), $148.68
Rear Only, 2-078 (11mm), $148.68
90-92
Complete Set, 3-078A, $267.96
Front Only, 1-078A (24mm), $148.68
Rear Only, 2-078A (22mm), $148.68
Suspension Technologies Sport Lowering Spring Set (-1.3"):
85-89, S-078, $217.56
90-92, S-078A, $217.56
Tokico Premium Performance Gas Strut Cartridge:
85-86
Front, HZ1085, $54.02
Rear, HZ1086, $54.02
87-89
Front, HZ1085, $54.02
Rear, HZ3099, $58.23
90-94 (TBA)
Tokico Illumina Adjustable Gas Strut Cartridge:
85-86
Front, BZ1085, $112.29
Rear, BZ1086, $112.29
87-89
Front, BZ1085, $112.29
Rear, BZ3099, $116.50
90-94
Front, BZ3125, $116.50
Rear, BZ3126, $116.50
Tokico Premium Springs:
85-89, HPS5064 (-1.0"), $195.80
90-94, HPS5065 (-.75"), $210.92
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From: "Scott, Dan"
To: ToyMods
Subject: RE: Boost drop & cat
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 95 06:31:00 PST
>>I have a turbo Celica and lately I have been experiencing a kind of a
>>hesitation when going to WOT. The turbo comes on and the boost builds OK
but
>>then it feels like the boost drops. The meter stays on full boost. It
feels
>Have you noticed any oil consumption recently?
>A scenario that I have seen twice before involved the seals failing on the
>turbo,(normal boost, no noise) with the oil being deposited on the
catalytic
>converter. These were turbo Mr. II 's and the converter that was clogged
was
>Things that are damaging to converters are:
>- driving with one spark plug wire off ( five minutes of hard driving will
>cause the converter to glow bright red)
>- high oil consumption
>- clearing a flooded engine
First of all thanks to everyone that replied to my e-mail. It turns out I
fell off the list so I re-subscribed. I received a number of responses sent
direct to me and they were all good suggestions. I will be looking into each
of them this weekend. In response to Dave's suggestion that maybe the turbo
is spewing on the cat. Would I not notice some kind of exhaust smoke? I
can't see anything from the rearview, so I will get someone to follow and
check. Thanks again for the help, if anyone sent their suggestions to the
list yesterday I didn't get them.
Thanks
Dan Scott
'88 Celica 4WD turbo 148,000 Kms (new K&N and Magnecor wires from CAP,
thanks Chris you saved me $60)
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From: Mark Sink - Imonics Corporation
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 09:55:30 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: The cat
>I disconnected my exhaust right beside the gearbox, and don't think
>I gained anything either, at least not peak hp. The testing
>was not at our regular test straight, so the comparisons aren't
>that accurate. There MAY have been a slight increase in power on 2nd gear,
>bringing it even with 3rd gear results.
How can you get a power increase in only one gear from an exhaust mod? Power
comes from the engine :) if you got an increase in 2nd, but no others,
it must have been in some rpm range that the other gears were not in. Right?
This is one of those cases where it's more in your head I think. I'm not bashing
here, I think my car is faster after being waxed. I've had people tell me theirs is
faster after an oil change (possible in extreme cases, like draining SLUDGE, and replacing
with light-weight synthetic. But you get my point. If the increase was there for 2nd,
it should be there for all gears.
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Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 10:23:12 -0600 (CST)
From: Chris Hilliard
To: Toyota Mods
Subject: Points of Interest
Hey folks,
I picked up the December issue of Sport Compact Car
magazine and it had a couple interesting things in it:
#1 A 255hp Celica GT four
#2 A drag racing report that has pictures of both a Supra and
a Starlet doing some serious burnouts!
Why did they kill the article by putting those Mazda RX-2 and RX-3
cars in there? Just kidding. It seemed pretty wierd to see a
Starlet smokin' the over,but then again, I haven't looked in to Chris'
garage lately either :)
****************************************************************
* |\/\/\/| ___________________
* | | / \
* | | ____________ / Catch this airhead \____
* | (0)(0) / \ / at \
* C _) / \/ cxh6989@jackson.freenet.org |
* | ,___| < AYE CARUMBA!!! \ /
* | / \ / \ "I didn't do it, /
* /====\ \____________/ \ Nobody saw me, ------------
*/ \ \ You can't prove a thing!!! /
***************************************\____________________________/
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Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 13:25:11 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: rogers@golddisk.com (Roger Smith)
Subject: Re: Points of interest...
Chris,
I always appreciate references like this. thanks...
> I picked up the December issue of Sport Compact Car
>magazine and it had a couple interesting things in it:
>
> #1 A 255hp Celica GT four
> #2 A drag racing report that has pictures of both a Supra and
> a Starlet doing some serious burnouts!
>
> Why did they kill the article by putting those Mazda RX-2 and RX-3
> cars in there? Just kidding. It seemed pretty wierd to see a
> Starlet smokin' the over,but then again, I haven't looked in to Chris'
> garage lately either :)
Careful 'bout those comments of smoking starlets! There just might be one
hiding in your neighbourhood 8-)
>
On the topic of "points of interest", has any one ordered Toyota's free CD
rom? It supposedly has a description of all of their cars world wide?
--Including info on their racing program.
Roger Smith
84 Starlet 4AGE
------
Roger Smith
Macintosh Project Lead
Gold Disk Inc.
Internet: rogers@golddisk.com
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: Will a 3-TC carb fit 2-TC engine
To: EXPORTER@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 20:39:01 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> >The 32/36 DGV is a great carb and may be
> >the best choice for replacement of the stock
> >carb, but don't expect a 30% increase in power.
> >You will get a small but noticable gain in power
> >from the DGV, but will also get much better
> >throttle response with the mechanical secondary
> >on the DGV. Also, it is FAR better to modify the
> >stock intake manifold to accept the DGV than to
> >use an addapter plate!
>
> >Craig
> 30% horse power is not a far fetched estimate of increased
> horse power for the 2-TC engine by adding a Weber
> 32 /36 DGV down draft carburetor.
>
> The 2-TC is rated at 102 horse at 6,000 rpm. 30% is only
> about 32 hp.
That's ye olde brute horsepower, right? I remember seeing that 100+ hp
advertised in the 70's magazines. But 75hp DIN or SAE net is closer to
truth, around 5600-5800rpm depending on version. You can get around
15-20hp extra with propely jetted sidedrafts.
> You can get as much as about 15 horse power from just
> changing to a electric fan instead of the stock one that
> runs off a belt from the crank pulley.
I've seen in some book 3-5% mentioned as loss for a non-viscous
one, less for viscous. I might test that one too, actually.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 15:05:11 -0600 (CST)
From: Scott the Samurai
To: Chris Hilliard
Cc: Toyota Mods
Subject: Re: Points of Interest
Hey!
Is some kind soul out there going to post that Celica article out one the
web somewhere??? :) And if yes, where???
Thanks, I could use a AWD Celica right about now, right Fred? ;)
I hate the first snowfall!! ;)
Scott Y. Amano e-mail: umamano0@cc.umanitoba.ca
Faculty of Management, University of Manitoba, Canada
"If I am obsessive it is in a positive way. I have a strong natural push
but it is not unhealthy, not a disease." -Ayrton Senna da Silva 1960-1994
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From: Gary Hong
To: cxh6989@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Points of Interest
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 95 17:31:12 PST
From: Chris Hilliard
>
> Hey folks,
> I picked up the December issue of Sport Compact Car
>magazine and it had a couple interesting things in it:
>
> #1 A 255hp Celica GT four
What year Celica?
Gary
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: The cat
To: msink@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Mark Sink - Imonics Corporation)
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 04:18:38 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
> >I disconnected my exhaust right beside the gearbox, and don't think
> >I gained anything either, at least not peak hp. The testing
> >was not at our regular test straight, so the comparisons aren't
> >that accurate. There MAY have been a slight increase in power on 2nd gear,
> >bringing it even with 3rd gear results.
>
> How can you get a power increase in only one gear from an exhaust mod? Power
> comes from the engine :)
I didn't make myself quite clear, not exclusively on one gear but on
lower gears 2nd and 1st. A turbocharged vehicle doesn't usually
have enough time in lowest gears to reach steady-state operating
point due to turbo lag. Therefore one gets less power in low gears
while accelerating than one would if the vehicle was held at the
same rpm. This is true even after taking into count the inertial
losses of the flywheel and rest of the drivetrain.
Most turbo owners with aftermarket boost meters probably can see this
themselves, you get less boost in 2nd gear than you do in 3rd. And
even less in 1st. 3rd, 4th and 5th are at least in my case closer
to each other. When I didn't have any boost control and was running
stock pressures, I had 0.45bar on 1st, 0.6-0.65bar on 2nd, 0.7-0.75bar on3rd,
0.75-0.8bar on 4th & 5th. Now it's more difficult to say exactly what
pressure (0.85-1.2) I'm running due to the boost spiking at midrange.
This spiking doesn't happen on 1st and not really on 2nd either,
on 3rd gear it's already 0.1-0.2bar (4000-4500rpm vs 6000rpm),
on 4th and 5th it's 0.2-0.25bar. This might be undesirable on cars
with boost fuel cut, but as I don't have one I'm just happy for
the extra power in midrange.
> if you got an increase in 2nd, but no others,
> it must have been in some rpm range that the other gears were not in. Right?
No, wrong theory. I dropped right below 5000rpm for both 2nd and 3rd.
> This is one of those cases where it's more in your head I think.
Nope. I didn't say there definately was an increase in 2nd gear power,
but that reducing backpressure might help there (and also on 1st gear,
I just usually don't test anything on 1st as wheelspin used to come
into play there). All the more exact testing we do is done using
RevTest, see
http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124775/prog.html
for more information. We'll do more testing on effects of backpressure
in my car when weather allows, this time the same day, at exactly the
same place.
I had 3.5psi of backpressure at the oxygen sensor mounting point,
about 8 inches after the turbine outlet when I was running 0.75bar.
> I'm not bashing here, I think my car is faster after being waxed.
Actually it IS faster after being washed and waxed, but I doubt you could
notice that. Roughness (dirt) of vehicle surface does contribute to
aerodynamic drag. It's usually negligible though.
> I've had people tell me theirs is
> faster after an oil change (possible in extreme cases, like draining
> SLUDGE, and replacing with light-weight synthetic. But you get my point.
Yes, scepticism is always good when talking about possible power
gains through modifications. Many people just do the mods and
live happily everafter that everything they've done has actually
gained power. Don't believe the hype...
> If the increase was there for 2nd, it should be there for all gears.
It's possible this was due to the test straight being not
exactly level (though it seemed like it would be).
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: Points of Interest
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 04:38:32 +0200 (EET)
> From: Chris Hilliard
> >
> > Hey folks,
> > I picked up the December issue of Sport Compact Car
> >magazine and it had a couple interesting things in it:
> >
> > #1 A 255hp Celica GT four
>
> What year Celica?
95 or 94, I'd guess. At least the 95 one has stock 255hp (JIS net).
FInnish models get advertised 242hp (DIN), but dyno tests have
given 255-270hp... 5.9 (or 6.1?) seconds 0-100km/h and 14 even at
1/4 mile if I remember correctly.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 22:39:25 -0800
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: jdewolf1@ix.netcom.com (jason dewolfe)
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: Jason Dewolfe
Location: Englewood, Colorado
Vehicle: 1991 Aquamarine pearl MR2 turbo.
Mods:Chrome ATS six-spoke. Yokahama AVS Intermediate 205/50/15 215/45/15.
Audio: Pioneer head unit, Coustic xm-3 crossover, EQL equalizer, Rockford
Fosgate Punch 30, Punch 45, and Punch 150 amplifiers, Two Rockford Fosgate
Punch 12" subs, Fosgate 4" mids (2), Coustic 5 1/4" mids (2), Fosgate 1"
tweets (2), and yes it all fit, barely.
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Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 22:48:22 -0800 (PST)
From: "KeNdRiCk W."
To: jason dewolfe
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: me/mine/mods
hey! a MR2 owner! have you also joined the MR2 mailing list?
check out the MR2 website if you haven't already! it's
http://mr2.com look for my car in there!
> Name: Jason Dewolfe
> Location: Englewood, Colorado
> Vehicle: 1991 Aquamarine pearl MR2 turbo.
> Mods:Chrome ATS six-spoke. Yokahama AVS Intermediate 205/50/15 215/45/15.
> Audio: Pioneer head unit, Coustic xm-3 crossover, EQL equalizer, Rockford
> Fosgate Punch 30, Punch 45, and Punch 150 amplifiers, Two Rockford Fosgate
> Punch 12" subs, Fosgate 4" mids (2), Coustic 5 1/4" mids (2), Fosgate 1"
> tweets (2), and yes it all fit, barely.
>
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From: EXPORTER@delphi.com
Date: Sat, 04 Nov 1995 07:46:03 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Weber down draft carbs
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
To let you in on a little secret.
Believe it on not , I am not a walking, talking
Dyno. But I do know the difference between
a little and a lot and the right Weber down draft
carburetor will give you a lot of power depending on
which DGV series model you choose.
I have installed these carbs on a lot of different
makes of 4 cylinders and all with good results.
It is one of the most cost effective modifications
you can get . You can not get as much power
from just a header or just a cam in comparison.
And I am not comparing them to side draft
models, just cost wise.
the carbs range from 200.00 to 300.00
witch is not a bad price compared to other mods.
Some of the carbs can be set up to be emissions
legal, even in California !
Rick Dormoi / T & R Auto / exporter@delphi.com
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Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 17:57:15 -0600 (CST)
From: Craig A Terlau
To: Christopher Myer
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Brake pads
I agree, I think that the Repco metal-master brake pads work great, are
fairly fade-resistant amd are easy on the rotors. They are my number one
choice pad for stock brake applications.
Craig.
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Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 09:45:28 -0600 (CST)
From: Chris Hilliard
To: Gary Hong
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Points of Interest
I dont have the article in fornt of me but I believe it is a '95.
I would run scared if I saw it on the street. It's one of those cars that
your mother warned you about..........;)
****************************************************************
* |\/\/\/| ___________________
* | | / \
* | | ____________ / Catch this airhead \____
* | (0)(0) / \ / at \
* C _) / \/ cxh6989@jackson.freenet.org |
* | ,___| < AYE CARUMBA!!! \ /
* | / \ / \ "I didn't do it, /
* /====\ \____________/ \ Nobody saw me, ------------
*/ \ \ You can't prove a thing!!! /
***************************************\____________________________/
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Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 13:49:42 -0600
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: mbedford@indiana.edu (Monte Bedford)
Subject: Re: Points of Interest
Concerning the Celica GT-Four (turbo, all wheel drive) in Sport Compact
Car magazine,
An actual year is not specified, but they are referring to the latest
equipment. It's not exported but it can be gotten new in Japan for $42k.
This magazine's test results:
0-100kph 5.8 s.
1/4 mile 13.5 s.
some of the features:
16 in. wheels, front spiral fin rotors with aluminum 4-piston calipers, ABS
with g-sensor, tandem brake booster, larger turbo compressor and
intercooler, etc. etc.
Monte
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Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 23:29:44 -0600
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: toy4x4@ro.com (Jack Alford)
Subject: me/mine/mods
Hello All !!!
Name : Jack Alford
Location : Decatur, AL, USA
Model : 1986 4x4 Xcab Pickup w/22R
Mods : K&N Air filter, Jacobs plug wires ...
email : toy4x4@ro.com
I'm looking for some tips on pepping up my 22R - Right now, I'm
considering a 32/36 Weber Carb and a header for starters ...
any opinions on my choices ??
I've got catalogs from Downey, NWOR, and LC Engineering are their
any other sources for hi-po Toyota engine parts that I don't know of ??
Any and all advice appreciated ...
thanks
- jack ==> toy4x4@ro.com - Decatur, AL
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From: Gary Hong
To: toy4x4@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: me/mine/mods
Cc: toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 95 3:54:21 PST
From: Jack Alford
>
>Hello All !!!
>
>Name : Jack Alford
>Location : Decatur, AL, USA
>Model : 1986 4x4 Xcab Pickup w/22R
>Mods : K&N Air filter, Jacobs plug wires ...
>email : toy4x4@ro.com
>
>I'm looking for some tips on pepping up my 22R - Right now, I'm
>considering a 32/36 Weber Carb and a header for starters ...
>any opinions on my choices ??
>
>I've got catalogs from Downey, NWOR, and LC Engineering are their
>any other sources for hi-po Toyota engine parts that I don't know of ??
>
>Any and all advice appreciated ...
>
>thanks
>
> - jack ==> toy4x4@ro.com - Decatur, AL
Let me know how it goes Jack. Tonight, my 22R carbed/auto celica was beaten
by a late 80's corolla sedan. I beat it going downhill, but on straights and
slight inclines forget it! I never won a race in my Celica. I think a Tercel
(manual) will beat me.
But that's cool, my Celica is running better than it ever did in the last
8 (of 14) year of its life. With all the work I've done to the car, it'll
easily last over 200k. No power, but its dependable! No show, just all go :).
Gary
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Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 11:53:22 -0500
From: roy@lorien.oit.gatech.edu (Roy J. Mongiovi)
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Mods for a '92 Celica GT-S
I've asked this before, but I'm still in the dark so I'll ask again....
I'd like to improve the low end power of my '92 Celica GT-S (5SFE engine).
Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be a lot available for this car. If
anyone has any suggestions, I'd like to hear them.
I sent off to Toysport, and this is what I got:
1990-1993 Toyota Celica GTS
Toysport Upgraded Performance
Stage 1 - Trust Exhaust System $401.00
Toysport/Ultraflow Exhaust System $320.00
Stage 2 - K & N Cone Air Filter with Piping $130.00
Stage 3 - Throttle Body Bored Out $350.00
Stage 4 - Extrade Hone Intake Manifold $450.00
No explanations, no expected results, (no money from me, either).
Would anyone be willing to explain what these steps involve, and
what kind of results might be expected from each? Thanks.
Roy
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From: Mark Sink - Imonics Corporation
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 12:31:58 -0500
To: roy@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Mods for a '92 Celica GT-S
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
> I've asked this before, but I'm still in the dark so I'll ask again....
>
> I'd like to improve the low end power of my '92 Celica GT-S (5SFE engine).
> Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be a lot available for this car. If
> anyone has any suggestions, I'd like to hear them.
>
> I sent off to Toysport, and this is what I got:
>
> 1990-1993 Toyota Celica GTS
>
> Toysport Upgraded Performance
>
> Stage 1 - Trust Exhaust System $401.00
> Toysport/Ultraflow Exhaust System $320.00
>
> Stage 2 - K & N Cone Air Filter with Piping $130.00
The above 2 steps should really be one.
>
> Stage 3 - Throttle Body Bored Out $350.00
For better Low End? I wouldn't think so. Guys? And for $350, there
are better things you could do with the money.
> Stage 4 - Extrade Hone Intake Manifold $450.00
Again, for Low End? You want better low end. Extrude Honing is like the
last step to take. I don't think you should consider doing this yet. There
are better and more efficient ways of getting more air into the engine that
spending $450 smoothing out ports. This step might come AFTER turbo charging,
after CAMS, after ignition. Your engine is not taking in enough air to make this
step worth while. Is this a turbo charged engine?
> No explanations, no expected results, (no money from me, either).
You got back more than I did. I talked to the owner about a turbo kit for
the 4AGE.. He said he was working on one, and asked me to send him what I wanted.
I was very detailed, even included a power curve of what I was looking for. I was
willing to spend upwards of $4-$5000. I never even got a reply. All this took place
while waiting for a "custom" clutch he was supposed to make for me. 3 MONTHS, and countless
phone calls later, I get nothing like what I had orders. I ordered a 4 puck disc, and got
a CF DF disc. He also sent me a look-a-like CF pressure plate, not the 1800 lb plate he
said I'd get. He said I'd have it in 2 weeks. 3 months later I get something I could have
ordered from anyone, and had in a week. My car sat idle for 3 months because of him.
If I were you, I'd take my money and go somewhere else.
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Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 23:13:56 +0000
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: tvaughan@ux.accesscom.net (Tyson Vaughan)
Subject: low-tech G-meter
I'm proud to say that I've made the first modification to my otherwise
stock 1988 MR2 NA: a low-tech G-meter. It cost all of a couple bucks.
It's a basket that hangs from my rear-view mirror and is supposed to smell
like something (Drakkar Noir, I think), but that's not what I use it for.
No! I noticed that the shape of the basket is uncannily similar to that of
a plumb. And then I noticed that by doing some quick trigonometrical
calculations in my head, I could determine lateral G's based on how far
from the perpindicular the basket swings during acceleration and cornering!
Theoretically, anyway. :)
____________________________________________________________________________
Tyson Vaughan memetic engineer
tvaughan@ux.accesscom.net graphic designer
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From: "Pete M. Wilson"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 22:30:03 -5
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: Pete M. Wilson
Location: Danville, VA
Model: 1989 MR-2 Supercharged Automatic, T-Tops, Power
Locks/Windows/Mirrors, A/C, White w/Blue interior, Leather Steering Wheel,
No decal on hood, w/Sears/Michelin 185/60HR14 tires
Mileage: 98500
Engine: 4A-GZE (from memory)
Mods:
Engine: HKS Oversize Pulley, pulled air filter box and installed
Dragster K&N Filter Charger on straight pipe, HKS
Exhaust System, Jacobs Energy Team
Stereo: Pioneer Cassette/CD-Controller, Pioneer 6 CD Changer, 6
Pioneer speakers (incl 2 6x9 in custom boxes behind
seats), Pioneer 4 channel amp, Bazooka 6inch Sub Tube
w/Alpine Amp, Yamaha DSP Unit, custom lighted off switch for
power antenna
Other: Alpine Security System, ESP Radar add-on to Security
w/remote control of door locks, horn/dome/parking lights control
Amateur Radio license plate, really tall amateur radio antenna (!)
I did have some driving lights (JC Whitney Dual Fog/Driving) but an animal
took one out (and my spoiler). I've bought some PIAA lights (also Dual
Fog/Driving) to replace them, but haven't installed them yet.
I am (somewhat) interested in a nitrous add-on to my car. Theoretically, I
should have around 180HP now, but my VC-200 gives me around 6.5-7 sec 0-60
times. I would like to push that down to a solid 6 or so. I haven't done
anything to my car lately, but would like to next year, if I have any
budget left. I tried to find someplace on the east coast to do a NOS
progressive controller installation, but wasn't too impressed with anyone
I've found.
Pete M. Wilson wilsonpm@ns.gamewood.net
Programmer/Analyst
National Computer Solutions (804) 791-8088 FAX: (804) 791-1351
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From: "Pete M. Wilson"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 22:45:34 -5
Subject: Re: me/mine/mods
Oops!!
Forget to mention I have replaced all the bushings with TRD bushings, and
replaced the springs/struts with the Race Springs from TRD (lowered car an
inch or so, NO dive on braking when put in (a little bit now)).
Pete M. Wilson wilsonpm@ns.gamewood.net
Programmer/Analyst
National Computer Solutions (804) 791-8088 FAX: (804) 791-1351
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From: "Pete M. Wilson"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 22:50:59 -5
Subject: Trip Computers
I have an add-on Trip Computer/Cruise Control package that I got from JC
Whitney. The Trip Computer was made by The Zemco Group. I can no longer
get in touch with them, and JC doesn't carry anything comparable.
Unfortunately, the computer has a problem when my car gets warmed in the
sun now (a few years later), and forgets all its calibration settings.
Does anyone have any complex/high-end Trip Computer suggestions? Or, does
anyone know how to reach the Zemco group?
The Trip Computer has Fuel In Tank/Used, Distance Gone on Tank/Left to Go,
Time on Trip/Left To Go, Distance Left to Go, Instantaneous Speed/MPG, MPG
on Trip, and some other functions. I would like a more powerful one, but
couldn't find one before.
Thanks!
Pete M. Wilson wilsonpm@ns.gamewood.net
Programmer/Analyst
National Computer Solutions (804) 791-8088 FAX: (804) 791-1351
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Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 22:57:18 -0500 (EST)
From: "Sherwin P."
To: Toyota Mods List
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name : Sherwin Porciuncula
Location : Maryland (DC metro area)
Model : 1985 Corolla GTS, 3dr. cpe., 5 spd.
Engine : 4AGE stock
Mods : No real mods. (open K&N filter) and some experimentation
email : villa@wam.umd.edu
project : Street legal mods. - improve suspension, intake and exhaust
work and see how it goes from there.
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Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 00:36:40 -0800 (PST)
From: Phillip Dang
To: The Toyota Mods Mailing List
Subject: advancing timing beyond spec
Hey everyone,
I've been lurking for sometime. Finally, I have a question for you
experts.
I posted to rec.autos.tech & asked the same question. What happens if I
advance my timing x number of degrees beyond spec without any pinging?
My car does not have a knock sensor.
Is it possible to advance too much, even if no pinging occurs? I was able
to set the timing up to 20 degress BTDC (no way did I try driving it).
One person said I could break a piston... or more exactly:
> Yes it can damage your engine. 1) you do not ALWAYS hear preignition
> or detonation 2) It can make it harder to start. 3) The computer is
> PROBABLY putting it back where it belongs anyway once you connect
> [stuff deleted]
> Let me put it this way ... if you break a piston, yeah, too much
> advance was a bad idea.
Your thoughts?
Phil
ez049105@rocky.ucdavis.edu 87 Celica ST, auto, 3S-FE, 95K miles
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From: Gary Hong
To: ptdang@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: advancing timing beyond spec
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 95 9:21:37 PST
From: Phillip Dang
>
>Hey everyone,
>
>I've been lurking for sometime. Finally, I have a question for you
>experts.
>
>I posted to rec.autos.tech & asked the same question. What happens if I
>advance my timing x number of degrees beyond spec without any pinging?
>My car does not have a knock sensor.
You should only advance it a few degree.
>Is it possible to advance too much, even if no pinging occurs? I was able
>to set the timing up to 20 degress BTDC (no way did I try driving it).
I've heard of a few people who have done this. IMO, I wouldn't advance it
that much!
The jury is out on this but maybe Matti or Chris or Koji can help me out on
this.
Advancing will help low end. Will retarding the timing help top end?
Since no one seems to know this answer, I'm going to do an experiment to
figure this out in the next few weeks. If you mods guru know anything about
this, please enlighten me.
Gary
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From: "Scott, Dan"
To: ToyMods
Subject: Sort of a Test part 2
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 95 10:43:00 PST
Thanks to everyone for their suggestions and assistance. I am now back on
the l*st. It turns out that our mail server is so old that they are finding
it hard to get replacement tubes for the CPU : ) . My apologies to Chris
for returning the posts unanswered, perhaps they will upgrade the system
soon.
I had a close look at my car this weekend and made a few discoveries. First,
the hoses that go to and from the turbo and intercooler are kind of old and
are splitting. I will need to replace the airbox to turbo inlet connector
since it disintegrated in my hands. While I was hurling a few choice words
at it I noticed that there was a bit of oil near the turbo inlet. On this
car ('88 Celica turbo) the PCV hose connects just before this piece so some
oil is to be expected. Any one have a feel for how much oil I should see?
There was enough to wet my fingers but it didn't drip out of the pipe or
anything. I gave the turbo a quick inspection and there is a bit of slop in
the up/down (radially) direction and none in the in/out (axially). Do I need
to rebuild the turbo? Can it be rebuilt or does it have to be replaced? It
sounds like either case is not going to be cheap. Once again any
comments/suggestions are appreciated.
Thanks a lot
Dan Scott
'88 Celica 4WD turbo 147,000 Kms (92k miles)
PS. Thanks again to Chris at CAP for the great deal and good service
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From: acram@dsurgery.surgery.uiowa.edu
To: wilsonpm@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: TRD bushings
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 95 12:44:59 CST
I have been thinking about the bushings myself. Did you notice
any difference after installation or were all the suspension
changes done at one time. If sequential, which of the engine or
suspension changes do you feel gave you the most bang for the
buck? I just added Toxico Illumina 5X adjustables and though they
aren't cheap I can really feel the difference.
Al Cram 88 MR2 SC, 85 MR2 NA
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From: "Pete M. Wilson"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 19:09:59 -5
Subject: Re: TRD bushings
I'm afraid all my suspension changes were done at once. If I was trying to
economize, I think I would want the Oversized SC Pulley first (very
noticeable difference) and the racing springs second.
With the springs, there was no dive at all when braking normally. However,
the ride is MUCH harsher and steering wheel kick-back on turns (like bumpy
exit ramps) is very noticeable.
I have standard Toyota struts around the springs.
I also tried the TRD brake pads, but was later told they were eating my
rotors. They worked wonderfully for a few months, then fell off to almost
no braking, and I had to have them replaced.
Pete M. Wilson wilsonpm@ns.gamewood.net
Programmer/Analyst
National Computer Solutions (804) 791-8088 FAX: (804) 791-1351
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From: "Pete M. Wilson"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 19:38:58 -5
Subject: My Stereo Set-up
For Tyson and anyone else who might be interested, here's how my stereo
gear is setup (it wasn't designed, it grew!):
In the dash, where the stock 2 DIN radio/cassette went, I have on top a
Pioneer Cassettte/Tuner/CD Controller with the cool, "James Bond,"
cassette unit - hidden behind the control panel. Beneath that is the
Yamaha DSP control unit. Behind them in the dash, is the Pioneer 4 channel amp.
Beneath the driver's seat is the Yamaha DSP unit, which has a sub-woofer
output. Behind it, almost to the back, is the Alpine amplifier, and
setting above that is the Bazooka sub-woofer (tilted slightly, facing
center of car).
Beneath the passenger's set is the Alpine security unit, the ESP radar
unit, and the relays for the lights/doors. Behind the passenger's seat is
the Pioneer CD changer, mounted vertically so I can change CD packs from
the driver's seat. The microwave sensor is under the transmission
tunnel/gas tank covering.
Behind both seats on the firewall are two custom, carpeted, wedge shaped
boxes holding Pioneer 6x9 speakers. The seats touch these boxes when all
the way back, but that's ok for me because I like my staging from the
front.
Above these, in the rear pillars, in the stock tweeter locations, are some tiny Pioneer speakers with caps
to limit there frequency response.
In the dash, I have the Pioneer TS-1060 (?) speakers in the stock
locations.
Pete M. Wilson wilsonpm@ns.gamewood.net
Programmer/Analyst
National Computer Solutions (804) 791-8088 FAX: (804) 791-1351
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Project stop smoke / 280hp (Re: Sort of a Test part 2)
To: DScott@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Scott Dan)
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 02:46:34 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> I had a close look at my car this weekend and made a few discoveries. First,
> the hoses that go to and from the turbo and intercooler are kind of old and
> are splitting. I will need to replace the airbox to turbo inlet connector
> since it disintegrated in my hands. While I was hurling a few choice words
Replace all those intake hoses. Now.
> at it I noticed that there was a bit of oil near the turbo inlet. On this
> car ('88 Celica turbo) the PCV hose connects just before this piece so some
> oil is to be expected. Any one have a feel for how much oil I should see?
> There was enough to wet my fingers but it didn't drip out of the pipe or
> anything.
Same here, even before thee clouds of smoke apperared.
> I gave the turbo a quick inspection and there is a bit of slop in
> the up/down (radially) direction and none in the in/out (axially). Do I need
> to rebuild the turbo?
Depends on how much slop there is. Most important is that the wheels
will not rub into the housings. Radial clearance should be in
the .05-.15mm range, axial 0.02-0.08. I don't have the exact values
for Toyota turbochargers, but these are typical values.
You'll know when you NEED to rebuild the turbo :(
> Can it be rebuilt or does it have to be replaced? It
> sounds like either case is not going to be cheap. Once again any
> comments/suggestions are appreciated.
Toyota sells only the replacement cartridge or complete turbo.
The cartridge is about $1050 here, whole turbo ~$2000.
Some complanies do repair Toyota turbos, but most only replace
bearings, if you have damaged the turbine or compressor wheels,
your're out of luck there. I was quoted $500 for replacing the bearings,
but I'm not going to waste more money on this puny CT20. Instead
I'm looking for a larger turbo, that suits my future power needs:
260-280hp with about 1.3-1.7 bar (19-25 psi) boost. Naturally I'll add
an intercooler at the same time ($400, custom made all aluminum,
550*300mm). This CT20 I have now is the same unit used in 22R-TE
turbo truck. Apparently in the latest turbo magazine is an article
about replacing this with a different one. Unfortuntely, this issue
hasn't arrived yet to Finland. If somebody has this article, I'd
appreciate getting the essential details. I have quite a tight
schedule on this project, exam season is approaching, as is yearly
vehicle inspection (including emission test which I have NO CHANCE
of passing with a blue cloud covering the next few blocks around me.
First I had thoughts of CT26 as a replacement, now I'm leaning
more towards Garrett, possibly T03, 0.63 turbine housing and
T04B S-4 compressor.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: looit@cs_srv1.mh.dpi.qld.gov.au
Subject: Re: advancing timing beyond spec
To: garyh@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Gary Hong)
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 11:35:03 +1000 (EST)
Cc: ptdang@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>
> >Is it possible to advance too much, even if no pinging occurs? I was able
> >to set the timing up to 20 degress BTDC (no way did I try driving it).
>
> I've heard of a few people who have done this. IMO, I wouldn't advance it
> that much!
>
On my 4AGE, I have mine set to 20BTDC, just have to ensure only premium fuel
(it pings sometimes on some loads of fuel) is used. I also have a different
pressure regulator.
Bear in mind this is in Australia, where premium unleaded is 96octane, I think
some places use this as standard
TEd
--
#############################################################################
SSSS X X TTTTTT CCCCC
S S X X TT C ted@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C looit@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C
S S X X TT C
SSSS X X TT CCCCC "TALK TO ME" or ...
# Coma?? Coma doesn't hurt, I fall into a coma all the time...zzzzzzz....!!! #
^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^
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From: Starlet16v@aol.com
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:52:27 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: Radley Ricketts
Location: Poughkeepsie, New York
Model: (2) 1982 Toyota Starlets
Engine: 4kc
Mods: no real ones yet(turbo muffler, American racing Wheels 13x6)
email: starlet16v@aol.com
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Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 21:03:48 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Aly's Projected Upgrades
Aly sent me this list of projected upgrades and asked me to both
comment on it and forward it to the list for others to comment on.
>> Here's my current plan:
>
> Stock hp 112
> K&N Universal air filter 5 117
> Crane HI-6 Ignition Amp 5 122
> TRD Header 5-8 130
> HKS or Trust Exhaust 6-10 138
> HKS Clutch (or similar quality)
> Eibach Progressive Springs
> TRD Bushings
>
> Then when that's done:
> HKS Camshafts and Gears 8-10 146
> Then if there's some money around:
> HKS Stroker Kit 32 180
> And while were at it:
> Extrude hone head and intake 25 205
> Valve Job (w/vlv shim adj.) 10 215
> With this I suppose I'll need:
> Sport Injection Manifold ? ?
> Upgraded Injectors
> Haltech E5 ECU (or similar) ? ?
Sounds like a good plan. I'd be really careful about the Extrude Honing.
I am not convinced that it does that much good, especially for the money.
Make sure you get some hard before/after dyno readings, and hopefully a
commitment from whomever you buy if from on expected performance increase.
I am just not convinced that by pushing an abrasive liquid through the
ports that it will cut out the appropriate metal. Think of a curvy
river that you've seen. When a river goes around a 90 degree bend, it
tends to wash out the part that I've shown here:
---------|
-------| |<----The part is where the force of the flow hits
| |
Resulting in:
---------\
-------| | <---Note the place where an edy would form, actually
| / <---causing a drag on the incoming flow.
| |
(Sorry, bad ascii art.)
I would think that you would instead want something more like this:
--------\
-------\ |
| |
You can take off the inside of a curve with a die grinder. I don't
know how efficient extrude honing would be on this.
Don't forget that Energy Suspension makes bushings for the MR2 car that
are quite a bit cheaper, and of excellent quality. As a matter of fact,
something is going on at TRD, and I wonder if they're about to either
sell out or go under. Maybe Koji can get a scoop on this. Something
is about to happen, I know that. I confirmed that much. No big
surprise on this end, only disappointment if they do go away.
Enough from me on this. Anyone else?
Chris
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Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 21:03:51 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Rotor Warping
I've received some information from Stillen on how to keep your rotors
from warping, and thought a few of the tidbits would be worth passing
along.
Never use an impact wrench to tighten wheel lugs. Use a torque wrench
and tighten progressively to 75-85 ft-lbs.
Always warm up and cool down your brakes when using them in competition.
Do NOT leave your foot on the brake pedal when you come to a stop. This
will trap heat into one spot on the rotor, causing it to warp. I've
been practicing this lately, and it takes some getting used to. Of
course, if you are on an incline this is more difficult. You may want to
use the parking brake if you are going to be stopped at a light for a
while, since the rear brakes usually take less of the stress when
braking and should be cooler. If you have a car with automatic trans-
mission, you may have to put it in park or neutral in order to take your
foor off the brake. Sometime, when I just can't take my foot off the
brake, I position myself so that I can inch either forward or back,
allowing the rotor to move slightly underneath the brake pads.
Another note: When your brakes are depressed, your brake fluid cannot
circulate at all, making overheating more possible.
Hope this is helpful!
Chris
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Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 21:03:56 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: advancing timing beyond spec
>One person said I could break a piston... or more exactly:
>> Yes it can damage your engine. 1) you do not ALWAYS hear preignition
>> or detonation 2) It can make it harder to start. 3) The computer is
>> PROBABLY putting it back where it belongs anyway once you connect
>> [stuff deleted]
>> Let me put it this way ... if you break a piston, yeah, too much
>> advance was a bad idea.
I'd say this guy is basically right, if a bit over cautious. All 3 state-
ments can be true in context.
On the other hand, if you don't have a computer, if you run a good grade
of gas, and if you don't care how it starts, this shouldn't be a problem.
On the race car, I was running something like 45 degrees of advance at
5000 rpm. Never knocked a bit, and I never had a bit of problem with
the engine, even though I was turning this bone stock 2xR (well, the
bottom end was stock) 5800 rpm. BTW, the engine had over 120 K miles on
it when I bought it to race it. Since then, it has outlived two race
cars, and I am about to rebuild it and put it in the truck.
Not much help, but maybe interesting!
Chris
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 13:43:44 +1000 (EST)
From: Paul Pyyvaara
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Aly's Projected Upgrades
On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, Christopher Myer wrote:
> Sounds like a good plan. I'd be really careful about the Extrude Honing.
> I am not convinced that it does that much good, especially for the money.
> Make sure you get some hard before/after dyno readings, and hopefully a
> commitment from whomever you buy if from on expected performance increase.
> I am just not convinced that by pushing an abrasive liquid through the
> ports that it will cut out the appropriate metal. Think of a curvy
> river that you've seen. When a river goes around a 90 degree bend, it
> tends to wash out the part that I've shown here:
One of the latest issues of Fast Fours and Rotaries (Australia/NZ mag) had
a test done using Extrude Honing on a Nissan Pulsar ET Turbo - with quite
good results. I will see if I can dig up the improved performance figures.
Apparently this technique has been used for a number of years in other
applications for increased flow but has only recently been introduced
into the automotive market (at least here in Australia)
Cheers,
Paul.
--
Paul Pyyvaara - paulp@dstc.edu.au
Research Scientist - Distributed Systems Technology Centre
B O N D U N I V E R S I T Y, QLD, 4229, AUSTRALIA
Phone:(+61 7 55 953 324) Fax:(+61 7 55 953 320)
WWW : http://www.dstc.Bond.edu.au/~paulp/
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Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 23:18:58 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: mjb174@psu.edu (Marlin Bailor)
Subject: TRD
TRD is having a sale on selected older models (mk1, etc) parts til Dec 22nd
or til supplies run out. (According to the print out they sent me) There
were some reasonable prices. Except I have no idea what I would be getting
since they only sent me a price list.
Street spring set $129 MR2 mk1
Race spring set ~$95 MR2 mk1
Struts ~$30 fr ~$45 rr MR2 mk1
+ much more
Anybody know how TRD struts compare to Tokico Illuminas?
>From what I understand TRD is going to quit carrying these parts.
Anybody heard?
Marlin Bailor
'85 MR2 NA 98K miles
Stock, but not for long
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Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 23:27:42 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: mjb174@psu.edu (Marlin Bailor)
Subject: Starter
I've been having problems with my starter when the engine and air is cold.
The starter won't disengage after the engine starts even if I turn the key
to off, it still turns the motor. The only way to make it stop is to turn
the key on and off several times. My friends '86 NA also does this
occasionally. Anybody had any experience with this?
Any help would be appreciated. Thank you in advance.
Marlin Bailor
'85 MR2 NA
Stock, but not for long
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 00:13:29 -0600 (CST)
From: Craig A Terlau
To: Phillip Dang
Cc: The Toyota Mods Mailing List
Subject: Re: advancing timing beyond spec
I have modified the distributor on my Starlet to disable all advance
mechanisms (vaccum and centrifugal). I locked it down so that timing
advance is independant of rpm's. This improved bottom end response
dramaticaly! I set my timing to the point that it starts to ping, then
back it off a little. Of course, the amount of advance you can use is
dependant on the type of fuel you are using, your compression ratio and
other factors. Still, maxing out the advance just short of pinging is
vital to tuning for power. With premium pump gas I have my timing set at
38 deg before TDC. With race gas, I can advance far beyond that. From what
I have read, this is the best way to set your timing. There is a great
book called: "Design and Tuning of Competition Engines" that addresses
this subject in detail. If your engine is not pinging, don't worry about
dammaging it. If your car is very loud...you have to listen carefully
for the ping. Rotor phasing is also critical, make sure that the
duration of the sparking between the rotor and cap occurs while the rotor
is aligned with the electrodes on the cap. You can check this by drilling
a large hole in an old distributor cap and looking in there with a timing
light while the engine is runing. I also modified my distributor to
allow for adjustment of the rotor phasing.
Craig.
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From: Gary Hong
To: cmyer@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: advancing timing beyond spec
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 1:23:04 PST
>On the other hand, if you don't have a computer, if you run a good grade
>of gas, and if you don't care how it starts, this shouldn't be a problem.
>On the race car, I was running something like 45 degrees of advance at
>5000 rpm. Never knocked a bit, and I never had a bit of problem with
>the engine, even though I was turning this bone stock 2xR (well, the
>bottom end was stock) 5800 rpm. BTW, the engine had over 120 K miles on
>it when I bought it to race it. Since then, it has outlived two race
>cars, and I am about to rebuild it and put it in the truck.
>
>Not much help, but maybe interesting!
>
>Chris
Chris,
Should I even try advancing my timing 45 degrees?! Man, that is alot of advance!
This weekend, I plan to drive up to the East Bay with the timing set +5 degree.
I'll then retard it 5 degree and see if it affects top end.
Gary
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 08:36:36 -0500 (EST)
From: Jeffrey T Paugh
To: Toyota-Mods
Subject: Stereo Systems
I've seen a few messages on here from people who have installed
aftermarket sound systems in their MR2's. I'd like to share mine with you.
1985 MR2 NA Mint
Red/Black Trim
First point, stay with certain brands, forget that bull that one company
makes a better 6x9 and another makes a better 6.5"! A speaker good
speaker manufacturer makes good speakers. I use JBL's top of the line
series, GTCxxxx. Same goes for amps, and equipment (head units,
changers, etc.) Anyway, here it is...
Clairion (Equipment)
Carver (Amps)
JBL (Speakers)
2 - JBL GTC 4" 2-ways in the dash (5-120W RMS)
2 - JBL GTC 5.2" 2 ways for rear (90W RMS)
2 - JBL 3/4" Tweets (mounted in front 50W RMS)
2 - JBL 10" PROCOMP SUBS (300W RMS)
1 - Carver KLW Audio 75W RMSx4 (on the front and rear 2-ways)
1 - Carver KLW Audio 25W RMSx2 (On the tweets)
1 - Carver KLW Audio 100W RMSx2 (On the Subs)
1 - Carver 3-Way XOver
1 - Clairion Head unit (I forget the model number right now...)
It's that $600-700 one that clairion put out this year...
(I got it on sale though! :) )
1 - Clairion 7100 DSP/Surround/9-Band EQ (Controls from radio display)
1 - Clairion 18 Disc Changer
Now, it sounds great, but there is a problem with trunk room...THERE IS NONE!
after the six little black boxes I put in my trunk, what's left? 3 Amps,
a Xover, EQ/DSP, and a huge changer!
There was a previous message a day or two ago about one guys system, he
got all his amps in the people compartment! (My hats off to you sir!)
That's it, Catch ya' all later,
Jeff Paugh
85' Red MR2
P.S. I have the box dim. for anyone who wants to put 10's behind their
seats and make them sound Excellent!!!!! They work on almost every 10"!
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From: Starlet16v@aol.com
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 12:32:06 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Starlets....Starlets
I am new to computers and being online. I have very limited knowledge of
computers but I love Toyotas. Where can I get (13x7) 4 spoke American Racing
Wheels?? I have been told that they are not made anymore and I want a set
for my Starlet. I live in Poughkeepsie Ny and I would like to know where I
can go (anywhere close) to get a 2-1/2" exhaust. Are there Starlet owners
out there who can give me suggestions as to where to start and what kinds of
mods to do? Any help is great no matter how trivial. What kind of carb can I
replace the stock one with(engine: 4KC)? Thankx for any help.
Radley Ricketts
email starlet16v@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 18:32:50 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Aly's Projected Upgrades
>One of the latest issues of Fast Fours and Rotaries (Australia/NZ mag) had
>a test done using Extrude Honing on a Nissan Pulsar ET Turbo - with quite
>good results. I will see if I can dig up the improved performance figures.
Please do try to find that info. I'm sure it is very enlightening.
>Apparently this technique has been used for a number of years in other
>applications for increased flow but has only recently been introduced
>into the automotive market (at least here in Australia)
I should be more careful when I write. I'm sure that extrude honing
will open things up, I'm just not convinced that it will open things
up more or even as much as any of us equipped with a die grinder and
some patience. For the money, I don't know if it's worth it.
Standard Abrasives sells an excellent little port and polish kit for
around $25. You'll need an air powered rotary tool (a drill would work,
but would get heavy in a hurry) to use it. $25 and a little time, voila,
you've got yourself a port job. Ok, if you're dealing with a VERY
expensive head (3SGT, etc.) you may want to be careful/get assistance,
but if you're like the majority of us and are dealing with 2/3T's, 2xR's,
etc, you can just get another of these in the junkyard if you screw one
up.
BTW, I was given a 3T motor today. Anybody need one? I don't have a
purpose for it, but though that it might come in handy someday.
Final note. Please be REALLY careful when getting your tech info from
magazine articles. When read with a careful eye, you'll see that these
are just extensions of the paid advertising. One article that comes to
mind is the one on 'Nology wires in Turbo and HT. Man, they kicked out
a bunch of numbers, but the testing was so unscientific that you could
have put ANY set of decent spiral core wires out there and seen similar
results. REMEMBER! The editors aren't going to tell the truth about
the advertisers product if the truth isn't pretty! PERIOD! It just
ain't going to happen! This isn't to say that you shouldn't read
automotive magazine articles, but just remember who is paying the tab.
The consumer is the smallest contributor to that equation.
Chris
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From: Koji Kam
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 13:43:19 -1000
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: TRD Etc...
Um, Just Tried Calling TRD Again -boggle-
New Number is 714-444-1188 Main Line
Parts Number 714-444-1188
Strange thing, talkign with the receptionist...
Seems Rj and Steve opening up their own shop
(I hope his name was steve)
Anyone can get confirmed with this ?
-Koji
Fax machine is out of paper so UGH try again tommorow.
-Koji
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From: Koji Kam
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 14:04:21 -1000
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: TRD End of Year Sale
Apparently they are clearing out of the inventory, and the guy answering
the phone is clueless.
They have nothing new, and nothing from TRD Japan.
Oh about TRD Japan, apparently can order some parts from TRD Japan through
Greddy, I got this guys card, and we are going to work something out, that is
if you have the TRD Japan Catalog (which i don't have a current one)
I'd call TRD USA 714-444-3161 ask them to FAX you a complete listing
for all the parts, apparently it isn't much.
Going out to buy fax paper now -sigh-
-Koji
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From: geoff@softy.softwords.bc.ca
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 16:17:08 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: TRD Etc...
> Um, Just Tried Calling TRD Again -boggle-
> New Number is 714-444-1188 Main Line
> Parts Number 714-444-1188
You meant "Parts Number : (714) 444-3161" right Koji? :-)
(Main line is correct)
Geoff
'91t, 155,800km
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From: RamziM2@aol.com
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 21:14:42 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: HKS Powerflo
>I've never seen a Power Flow kit for the 85-87 MR2, but the 88-89 kit puts
>the filter in the trunk.. I'm using a large size Power Flow (from my RX-7),
>a piece of 4 inch "hose" and an adapter piece that bolts up to the air flow
>meter, and YES, when it rains, it drenches the air filter.. I usually put a
>plastic bag over the opening if I know it raining.. how does everyone else
>put a filter on their 85-87 MR2 ? I'd like to know..
toysport in LA has an adapter to install the Power Flow to the 85-87 MR2
Ramzi
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From: aly abulkheir
Subject: Re:Stereo Systems
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 21:28:17 -0500 (EST)
Greetings Everyone,
Regarding Jeffrey's post regarding his well thought out sound
system, I would like to share what I have done regarding my sound system. I
agree about the idea of staying with certain known brands and it will work
if you are going for good general sound, but if you are going for all out
clarity and balance (i.e., if you have become a crazed audiophile like me)
you may find that just because one speaker manufacturer makes a great 6 1/2
doesn't mean that they make "the best" tweeter or 3 1/2, or that they make
one at all, as you will see with my installation. This sound system was
developed through listening sessions, months of reading, experimenting,
asking questions, etc. It evolved from a bare bones system in my first car
(a '75 Dodge Dart) to a more serious system in my second car (an '88
Mitsubishi Colt) with pounding bass, to what it is today in my "now and
forever" car (my '85 MR2, red with All options) over a period of 5 years.
Here it is:
Components first:
Yamaha YCT-925 Head Unit (tuner and cassette)
Sony CDX-A15 10 disc changer (behind driver's seat, I'm short)
a/d/s/ 642ix electronic crossover
MB Quart 200.71 two way passive crossovers (pair)
(2) a/d/s/ PS5.2 amplifiers (probably the best amp they ever made)
a/d/s/ s6.2i 6 1/2" bass speakers (in bottom of doors)(also known as 420
speaker)
MB Quart 100 KN-S 4" coaxials (in factory dash location)
Infinity 32K 3 1/2" speakers (in upper-rear location)
One amp runs the 6 1/2s in the doors from 32Hz to 3000Hz with 40Wx2.
The other amp runs the 4s in the dash and the 3 1/2s in parallel.
Surprisingly the front/rear balance is perfect running off one amp.
(this amp is crossed over from 130Hz up)
The front bottom of the doors was cut for a larger speaker, then thin sheet
metal was cut, riveted and silicone sealed to the bottom front doors. This
was covered with Dynamat for less resonation, then the hole was cut for the
6 1/2" bass speaker. Surprisingly, Toyota cut the bottom of the window at
a 45 degree angle so it just misses the large magnet of this speaker (I was
overjoyed, in a Mercedes 500SL, spacers were needed to mount this speaker,
and in an NSX (Audio Coupe's install in Car Stereo Review), it worked
because the Acura door panels are already spaced away from the doors.
The bass is clear and powerful, without being boomy.
I replaced the factoy door carpeting (thin felt over plastic) with sonically
transparent carpeting available from any good car audio shop for $10. This
carpeting looks exactly like the factory carpeting, but lets the sound
through.
In the dash, the MB Quart 4s fit right in after you cut off two of the
mounting tabs so that it looks like the factory speaker. The 4 and the
tweeter have separate power leads for bi-amplification if desired. I
upgraded the crossovers to the Quart competition crossovers designed for
these speakers and it cleared up the sound of the speaker noticeably.
Polyester insulation (available at any fabric store) was used behind the
speaker to provide a cleaner enclosure.
In the upper rear (where you see holes in the '88/'89 MR2) I installed
Infinity's 32K 3 1/2" dual cone speaker. I was skeptical at first with a
dual cone, but after listening to it, I found the speaker to be clear with
no harshness normally associated with dual cones. The cone in the center is
not very deep anyway, so it may qualify as a mid-high speaker. I tried
putting a 4" in there, but it is a very tight squeeze. For those of you
wondering, the holes for these speakers are not there. You must remove the
plastic panel and cut out a hole for the speaker. Try to get a speaker with
a paper template for mounting, the Infinity included one. Polyester
insulation was used behind this speaker too.
Luckily, Sony makes the CD changers for Yamaha, so the Sony changer connects
right to the very clear Yamaha tuner. This Head unit is no longer in
production, since Yamaha left car audio, but it sounds incredible if you can
get your hands on one.
The amps and crossovers are mounted in the trunk against the front wall.
They run cool, even though the engine compartment is right on the other
side. Wires run to the right around the engine compartment. Taking the
cooling vent on the right side of the car out temporarily is necessary to
mount the wires, and drilling a 1" diameter hole is all that's necessary to
route the wires into the passenger compartment and to the speakers.
The installation is very stealth, in that you can't see the speakers if you
look in. Every speaker is hidden by factory cloth, grille, or custom cloth.
I am glad I did the entire install myself. It really sounds better that way
when you can tune it yourself and make it sound the way you want it. It is
frustrating at times when you can't get the sound right, but when you
finally get it right, you find it was well worth the effort.
If you are someone who truly enjoys listening to music, and you have a MK1
MR2, this sound setup will be well worth your while. If anyone has any
questions regarding more detail of how each speaker or other components were
mounted or decided upon, please feel free to email me.
-Aly
'85 MR2,Red with All options
(yes, even the black spoiler)
Looking for some more power
the best handling
and the most cost effective mods
abulkh34@matrix.newpaltz.edu
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 18:45:55 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Brett Fraser
Subject: Re: The cat
At 11:16 PM 11/1/95 PST, you wrote:
>>
>>Well, in California you need to pass a *visual* inspection as well. Your
>>car can pass with flying colors but if the smog tech sees that you have no
>>cat, then he, by law, is supposed to fail you.
>
>>% Aric Shen
>
>Yeah, but who says we have to actually take the cat out? :) We can gut
>the thing out!
>
>Gary
>
I was talking to a fellow about 2 weeks ago about MR2's and what he did was just
arrange it so he could install/uninstall the cat at will .. he could just
swap a chunk of pipe in and had no probs at all..
Brett (Yeesh .. couldnt get any email for 2 weeks and now I get to sift thru
180
pieces .. eek)
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 19:17:32 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Brett Fraser
Subject: Re: Stereo Systems
At 08:36 AM 11/8/95 -0500, you wrote:
>There was a previous message a day or two ago about one guys system, he
>got all his amps in the people compartment! (My hats off to you sir!)
>
>That's it, Catch ya' all later,
>
> Jeff Paugh
> 85' Red MR2
>P.S. I have the box dim. for anyone who wants to put 10's behind their
>seats and make them sound Excellent!!!!! They work on almost every 10"!
>
etc ..
My roomies 87 MR2 has a decent little system that him and I figured out ..
Took that tape storage rack on the firewall 'tween the seats outta there and
built a box for the 2 6's from a MBQuart QM328.1cs set, put the fours in the
stock
front locations and the tweeters are still kinda iffy.. we figure mounting
them ON
the grilles for the front spkrs .. should be ok .. then he had a 12" Orion XTR
installed in the bottom of the front trunk, just mounted a piece of 3/4" MDF
across
the bottom about 6-9" above the bottom and mounted the woofer facing up to
the hood,
sound travels thru the AC port to the cab and sounds just wonderful ..
mounted the
one amp (big Kenwood KAC943) behind the passenger on the firewall ..looks
and sounds
real hot..
Brett (ARRRGh he screams as he realizes once again that hitting reply just
replies
to the single person not the list and then has to resend it to the list..)
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 23:11:32 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Extrude Hone Process
I'm no extrude hone genius. I really don't have any experience with
it at all. I'm just quoting what some very experienced folks in the
industry (Smokey Yunick, amoung them) have said about this process.
I have no doubt that the abrasive flow is exactly the same flow that
the air would take. That's the problem. When air flows through a
curve, it bangs against the _outside_ of walls, and creates eddies
along the inside. The abrasive flow of the extrude hone process will
follow the exact same path, cutting out more metal at the outside of
the curve. This is simple fluid dynamics. A river flowing downhill
does not create for itself a nice straight path, whereby it would
flow the maximum amount of water. Instead, it tends to get
more and more crooked, until the point at which it can no longer
flow the amount of water coming downhill and it overflows it's banks.
I also have no doubt that the extrude hone process will improve
performance. My question is twofold: By how much, and is the cost
worth the gain. It's fine and well for the Extrude Hone folks to
quote performance gains, but I'd only be convinced after seeing two
heads of the same type, one having been EH'd, and the other ported by
an experienced professional, placed on a flow bench and measured.
Anything else, whether it be my random babblings, Smokey Yunick's
rantings, or EH's advertisements, is just so much hot air.
Having said that, let me do a quick quote of Smokey from Circle Track
magazine, where he responds in his "Track Tech" column to a fellow
who questions him on how to port a head. I'll try to cut to the chase,
pardon the elipses (it's way past my bedtime.) I don't have time to
proof read this, I'll just jam it in and let everyone figure it out on
their own.
"...Joe, cylinder-head porting, especially when you start off with iron
production junk, takes 10 years to get close to knowing what the hell you
are doing. On top of the fact that the starting piece is trash, you usually
have race-restraining power and cost rules that handicap it even further.
My point here is that htere is a big difference in how you do the work. For
example, on a head for maximum performance, we use a 3 to 4 and valve job
with distinct throat shapes. A saturday night special has next tonothing
rules. We put the valve seat OD of a skinny valve seat and forget 3 andgles
and bore straight down into the throat area. On a 350 cubic inch engine you
can expect a 30 to 40 hp gain with a good port job on iron heads but, if you
want to get serious and go for broke, you can spend $10,000 and get 75 hp.
The port shapes and sizes and the valves sizes are as sensitve to power and
driving as the camshaft. So no one head design does it all.
You want to learn cylinder head porting? Build your own flow bench and find
a big fat book to read and learn. The first book you need is on fluid
dynamics. You need to understand the natural physics of gas flow, which
deals in both liquid and gas-flow behavior. you will find that both are
extremely sensitve to temperature and pressure. The ideal port is a no turn
more than 9 degrees, no shrouding of the valve. So a flat head,
no-combustion chamber takes care of shrouding and stands the port up to 9
degrees or until you hit the valve spring pockets. This is assuming we are
talking overhead valve. ... I don't want to discourage learning, but you
pretty much want to know as much as a college graduate, but you still want
to self0teach yourself without going to college. It can't be done! Not in
a timely or sensible way. Go to school, school, and get on the job training
with someone who has mastered the topic in general. Fifteen years ago there
were maybe two engineers in Detroit who knew anything about airflow, not I
think that there are four or five. I point this out because it is very
difficult. Actually, that single task is a full-time life's work...."
(Ok, back to me) Does everyone see what this guy, who's probably the
most respected engine builder of all time, has to say about head porting?
It is pure physics, and it depends heavily on the application, on the
rules, on the head being ported. Somehow, I just don't see how those
EH folks can just bypass all of these facts and say that those abrasive
molecules "just know" where to go. Does anything I'm saying make sense
to anyone else?
I'm about to get started hand-porting a 20R head for my truck. Believe
me, I don't kid myself about knowing what it takes to port a head. But
I do think that I can do a decent job for just the cost of the grinders
and a few hours time. As would an EH job. I guess I just don't think
that it would be several hundred dollars better. (But I've been very
wrong before, and will be again! I certainly wish I had a Stage VII+ HKS
Supra, and the bucks to do an extrude hone and check it out!)
Chris
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Date: Wed, 08 Nov 1995 23:24:15 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: mjb174@psu.edu (Marlin Bailor)
Subject: TRD struts
In TRD's close out price list they have a strut set for 85-86 MR2 for
$150.52, which is a heck of a buy. Sounds to cheap to me. When Illuminas
sell for ~$112 each. Anybody have experience with these(TRD) struts.
Marlin, 85 MR2
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Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 20:24:36 -0800 (PST)
From: Phillip Dang
To: The Toyota Mods Mailing List
Subject: summary: advancing timing beyond spec
Hi everyone,
Thanks for the responses so far. I feel less hesitant to advance the
the timing beyond 15 degrees BTDC. I had it all 12 degrees BTDC during
the summer, and now that winter is coming, I don't expect problems
running at 15 degrees BTDC.
Kostas asked why I need to advance (it beyond factory spec) the timing.
Well, my Celica isn't more than 115hp, so every little bit of hp or
torque helps. I'm not interested in out-running anyone; I just like to
drive more spirited than most drivers.
Below, I've included the replies thus far:
Bye,
Phil
ez049105@rocky 87 Celica ST, auto, 3S-FE, 95K miles
From: "john.limcangco"
I set my timing to the manufacturer's suggested timing. Then I take it for a
drive. When I floor it and it does not 'ping', then I advance it some more. I
do this is in 3 degree increments. When I do get to a point where it 'pings'
under hard acceleration, then I back it off just a little bit.
I've seen my timing to around 38 degrees at 3000 rpm. (Due to the centrifugal
advance that kicks in at RPMs above idle).
So far no broken pistons. =)
My car does not have a computer....
John Limcangco
Manila, Philippines
79 Cressida 18R-G
From: Kostas Chryssos
Do you have a particular reason to do so???
It is logical that if you ignite the mixture before the piston reaches the
top travel, you are contradicting the motion of the piston. The piston
caries the inertia of the whole car via the gearbox, minus the presure cycle
of the particular firing at a reduced compresion. The pistons inertia will
keep the piston going forward, overiding the firing presure, but you will
get a progresive reduction of power bringing the engine to a stop. Pining is
caused from detonation of the mixture due to ubnormal firing conditions,
lean mixture, premature firing etc. Things do get much worse if you drive
the car and you can damage the engine easily . So if you have no particular
reason to do so, dont.
___________ ________________ ________
__ ___/__ | / /__< /___ __ )___ __/
_____ \ __ | / / __ / __ __ |__ /
____/ / __ |/ / _ / _ /_/ / _ /
/____/ _____/ /_/ /_____/ /_/
(Kostas G. D. Chryssos Ph.D.)
30,Ikarias str. Glyfada GR16675, Athens, Hellas
Tel: xx-301 9628212, Fax: xx-301 9628539
From: looit@cs_srv1.mh.dpi.qld.gov.au
On my 4AGE, I have mine set to 20BTDC, just have to ensure only premium fuel
(it pings sometimes on some loads of fuel) is used. I also have a different
pressure regulator.
Bear in mind this is in Australia, where premium unleaded is 96octane, I think
some places use this as standard
TEd
--
#############################################################################
SSSS X X TTTTTT CCCCC
S S X X TT C ted@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C looit@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C
S S X X TT C
SSSS X X TT CCCCC "TALK TO ME" or ...
# Coma?? Coma doesn't hurt, I fall into a coma all the time...zzzzzzz....!!! #
^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^
From: Christopher Myer
[stuff about pistons breaking due to super advanced timing]
I'd say this guy is basically right, if a bit over cautious. All 3 state-
ments can be true in context.
On the other hand, if you don't have a computer, if you run a good grade
of gas, and if you don't care how it starts, this shouldn't be a problem.
On the race car, I was running something like 45 degrees of advance at
5000 rpm. Never knocked a bit, and I never had a bit of problem with
the engine, even though I was turning this bone stock 2xR (well, the
bottom end was stock) 5800 rpm. BTW, the engine had over 120 K miles on
it when I bought it to race it. Since then, it has outlived two race
cars, and I am about to rebuild it and put it in the truck.
Not much help, but maybe interesting!
Chris
From: Craig A Terlau
I have modified the distributor on my Starlet to disable all advance
mechanisms (vaccum and centrifugal). I locked it down so that timing
advance is independant of rpm's. This improved bottom end response
dramaticaly! I set my timing to the point that it starts to ping, then
back it off a little. Of course, the amount of advance you can use is
dependant on the type of fuel you are using, your compression ratio and
other factors. Still, maxing out the advance just short of pinging is
vital to tuning for power. With premium pump gas I have my timing set at
38 deg before TDC. With race gas, I can advance far beyond that. From what
I have read, this is the best way to set your timing. There is a great
book called: "Design and Tuning of Competition Engines" that addresses
this subject in detail. If your engine is not pinging, don't worry about
dammaging it. If your car is very loud...you have to listen carefully
for the ping. Rotor phasing is also critical, make sure that the
duration of the sparking between the rotor and cap occurs while the rotor
is aligned with the electrodes on the cap. You can check this by drilling
a large hole in an old distributor cap and looking in there with a timing
light while the engine is runing. I also modified my distributor to
allow for adjustment of the rotor phasing.
Craig.
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From: Starlet16v@aol.com
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 23:54:55 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: starlet
Anyone;
I was just wandering how hard is it to put the 4AGE into a Starlet. What
kind of modifications have to be done? Do you need to modify the bell housing
or just replace the gearbox alltogether? If I have to replace the gearbox,
what should I replace it with? I was going through the toyota-mods info
server and I saw a yellow Starlet with a wide body kit. Are any kits like
that available in the US? My car was hit a couple days ago and I searching
for parts. Man, I need a door and a fender baaaad. Someone help me. Are
Starlets good race cars? Is there any way to import some from say another
country? Say England, Japan or Jamaica??? I had a system in my car until it
was mangled. I had a Panasonic head going to a three way x-over and then to
three amps. I had four twelves in a band-pass box(actually two boxes
stacked). The twelves were power by a JBL GT400, and mid was powered by JBL
GT50. My highs were powered by a Pioneer(can't remember #), but it was 25
watts per chan. rms. My friends were so impressed I am know burdened with
doing all their installations. But I took all out and I want my car to
perform. Anybody races Starlets? What class do they race in?
Please help me I want to hear sidedraft suck in air and my dynomax super
turbo rumble. Are sidedrafts expensive? Can I get them used? I am broke,
but I am willing to spend every penny on a Starlet. Thanks for any info.
Radley
email starlet16v@aol.com .
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From: RamziM2@aol.com
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 00:45:38 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: RE: TRD
For anyone who plans to order the TRD race springs,
I was told the TRD race springs for the MR2 are actually rally springs and
that TRD no longer sells the race springs because the race springs are too
stiff for the street. and he said if i want to buy the original race springs
i should have called earlier. Sounds complicated but thats what the guy
said.
"So maybe I should imagine that my Eibach springs are race springs because
Eibach springs are too soft for raceing".
++ramzi
86 MR2
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Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 00:32:41 -0700 (MST)
To: Koji Kam ,
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: TRD Etc...
At 01:43 PM 11/8/95 -1000, Koji Kam wrote:
>
>Um, Just Tried Calling TRD Again -boggle-
>
>New Number is 714-444-1188 Main Line
>Parts Number 714-444-1188
>
>Strange thing, talkign with the receptionist...
>
>Seems Rj and Steve opening up their own shop
>
>(I hope his name was steve)
>
>Anyone can get confirmed with this ?
>
>-Koji
>
>Fax machine is out of paper so UGH try again tommorow.
>
>-Koji
>
RJ "owns" SMC Products.. him and Steve I guess.. even though I don't know
who the hell Steve is :). He is doing short shift kits and steel braided
brake lines.. little things like that..
% Aric Shen
% Speedline Racing Concepts
% 1987 RX-7 Turbo & 1986 MR2
% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
& check out: http://www.webcom.com/~dynamic
% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
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Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 03:30:38 -1000
From: Allen T "Koji" Kam
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: RE: TRD
Cc: shafted@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>From shafted@primenet.com Wed Nov 8 21:32:20 1995
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 00:32:41 -0700 (MST)
From: Aric Shen
Subject: Re: TRD Etc...
At 01:43 PM 11/8/95 -1000, Koji Kam wrote:
>RJ "owns" SMC Products.. him and Steve I guess.. even though I don't know
>who the hell Steve is :). He is doing short shift kits and steel braided
>brake lines.. little things like that..
Ah, thats kewl, got an address or location area ?
The receptionist at TRD (who i've talked to for years but dunno her name)
said he stops by now and then...
Of course i'm totally out of the up to date scene =(
>% Aric Shen
>% Speedline Racing Concepts
>% 1987 RX-7 Turbo & 1986 MR2
>% e-mail : shafted @ primenet.com
>% home page: http://www.primenet.com/~shafted
>& check out: http://www.webcom.com/~dynamic
>% "Life begins at 9000 RPM"
BTW, been meaning to commend you on your web pages and such.
Also choice of vehicles.
Personally, I would like a T2 and a SC MR-2
Right now i'm stuck with a silly FWD FX-16
I agree about the "American Muscle Cars" heh, Dad's got um all,
thats why i'm into imports =(
OH, Try ask Ted Koseki who the babe is on your Page you dunno the name,
I can't think of it at the moment, but then again, it is 3:32am =)
-Allen T "Koji" Kam
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Date: Thu