^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^ ^^^
^^^ _______ ^^^
^^^ ,' - _ ^^^
^^^ ________,'__________>>> - _ ^ ^^^
^^^ , ' | ^^^
^^^ ~I~ I~I \ / I~I ~I~ .~. _ I\/I I~I I~\ <~ ^^^
^^^ I I_I | I_I I I~I I I I_I I_/ _> ^^^
^^^ `---\__/----------------\__/----' ^^^
^^^ ^^^
^^^ P O S T I N G S Jan 1996 ^^^
^^^ --------------------------- ^^^
^^^ ^^^
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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 1996 10:51:18 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: 'tis the season...(administrivia)
...for my email box to get jammed with bounces. If you suddenly notice
that your subscription to toyota-mods ever gets disconnected, it may be
because mail to your subscribed address was bouncing. Every time that
mail goes out to a bad address, I get a bounced mail message. Over the
Christmas break, this seems to be a more significant problem as machines
are taken off-line and accounts go away. This means that if TM had 5
bad email addresses, I get 6x the normal amount of TM email. Actually,
if we get a problem where an email loop occurs, this can be more like
60x! (This has happened, trust me.)
When I get an address that is bouncing, I'll usually let it bounce for
a couple of days, to see if the problem will be corrected. After that,
however, for my sanity and the health of my email in-box, I am forced to
unsubscribe the guilty address.
I am about to unsubscribe several members after I send out this email.
If you get unsubscribed and still want to be a member of TM, please get
the problem resolved and sign back up. Let me know how I can be of
assistance in the matter.
Happy New Year!
Chris
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Mon, 1 Jan 1996 13:12:33 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: WTB: 4AGZE motor
> I was investigating turbo kits from Greddy for AE92 Corolla's but with
>no luck. The gave me the excuse that the brake booster on the Left Hand Drive
>Corollas get in the way of the turbo assembly. After reasoning with them that
>I could mount a aftermarket booster for such a system they still declined to
>ship me a unit. They will not even ship one upon special request (i.e. for
>racing purposes)... guess I'll have to look at alternative means to do so.
Everybody needs to understand that HKS and GReddy, in theory, refuse to
sell products to individuals, or to resellers who sell to individuals.
They want to only sell to installers. To become an HKS or GReddy
distributor, you're supposed to send them photography of your installation
facility. They would not be very happy with the fact that I sell their
products. ;-)
Chris
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Question about CA emissions
Date: Mon, 01 Jan 1996 14:05:09 EST
From: Kevin Scaldeferri
Well, I just noticed a hole thats starting to form in part of my
exhaust, so I'm thinking about putting in an aftermarket exhaust.
My major concern is this. While I'm in Maryland now, I will probably
find myself in California in about a year and a half. So I need to
know how the CA emissions laws apply to a car that is brought into the
state. Anyone happen to know this?
Also, does anyone have recommendations for exhausts for an 88 Celica
GTS, CA legal or not?
Thanks
Kevin
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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 1996 15:08:50 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
>My major concern is this. While I'm in Maryland now, I will probably
>find myself in California in about a year and a half. So I need to
>know how the CA emissions laws apply to a car that is brought into the
>state. Anyone happen to know this?
Um, I'm open to correction here, but I don't think they care too much
what you do behind the catalytic converter, so long as you don't
exceed any noise standards, and the exhaust exists safely from the
car. This means that pretty much any aftermarket exhaust system
should be ok.
>Also, does anyone have recommendations for exhausts for an 88 Celica
>GTS, CA legal or not?
Well, for the best blend of economy and performance, you could pick up
the DynoMax 17451 system. It consists of a short pipe between the
converter and the muffler, a single inlet/dual outlet muffler with
brushed stainless steel tips, and all the clamps and gaskets you need
to do the job. Retail is $247.76, but if you email cap@cyberauto.com,
I think you'll get a price of roughly half that.
Pace Setter makes a setup for almost exactly the same price. If sound
level is a concern, the Pace Setter may be a little loud for you. Their
tips are chrome, rather than stainless. Part number is 88-1354.
To my knowledge, GReddy and HKS don't make anything for the earlier
Celica's any more, but there may be some other options.
Hope this is helpful!
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: cmyer@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
Date: Mon, 01 Jan 1996 16:30:54 EST
From: Kevin Scaldeferri
>>My major concern is this. While I'm in Maryland now, I will probably
>>find myself in California in about a year and a half. So I need to
>>know how the CA emissions laws apply to a car that is brought into the
>>state. Anyone happen to know this?
>
>Um, I'm open to correction here, but I don't think they care too much
>what you do behind the catalytic converter, so long as you don't
>exceed any noise standards, and the exhaust exists safely from the
>car. This means that pretty much any aftermarket exhaust system
>should be ok.
>
Oops, should have mentioned, the hole is in front of the cat.
Kevin
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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 1996 16:42:15 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
>Oops, should have mentioned, the hole is in front of the cat.
This does change the equation significantly. If it is between the
cat and the exhaust manifold, and if you want to stay emmissions legal,
your only option (that I'm aware of) is to replace the bad section
with a stock piece.
If emmissions aren't a concern, Pace Setter sells a header for the
86-89 Celica (3SFE), 70-1155, which retails for $149.95. It doesn't
have any smog hookups, however. As a matter of fact, I'm not even
sure if it has an O2 Sensor hole. This, as you know, will be a big
problem on an ECU-equipped car. You can, of course, buy a weld-in
kit to install an O2 sensor.
Chris
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From: KipAnderso@aol.com
Date: Mon, 1 Jan 1996 18:55:57 -0500
To: cmyer@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: WTB: 4AGZE motor
In a message dated 96-01-01 14:03:47 EST, you write:
>Everybody needs to understand that HKS and GReddy, in theory, refuse to
>sell products to individuals, or to resellers who sell to individuals.
>They want to only sell to installers. To become an HKS or GReddy
>distributor, you're supposed to send them photography of your installation
>facility. They would not be very happy with the fact that I sell their
>products. ;-)
I think this is actually a very responsible attitude for these companies to
take. All too often people purchase upgrade products with the intent of
installing them while at the same time remaining clueless as to exactly what
the parts do and how they can affect the other systems of the car. Obviously
most people on this list don't fall into that category, but some do. So HKS
and GReddy are trying to keep the headaches to a minimum by specifying
qualified install shops as the only resellers of their equipement. This way,
if something goes wrong, the blame will be less likely to fall upon GReddy or
HKS since they did not render any advice as to the installation or sell the
offending equipement to the individual.
Actually they are probably happy that their products are being sold via
mail-order and over the counter, but they are likely attempting to cover
their butts by refusing to endorse it.
IMHO of course.
Kip Anderson
91 MR2 Turbo
kca@interserv.com
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Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 09:30:05 +0500
From: toyota@patagonia.bellcore.com (Jonathan Hacker (Toyota))
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
> My major concern is this. While I'm in Maryland now, I will probably
> find myself in California in about a year and a half. So I need to
> know how the CA emissions laws apply to a car that is brought into the
> state. Anyone happen to know this?
You will need to have the car inspected and certified that the emission
system has not been modified. They will want to see the EPA emission
label under the hood. To get registered you will have to pay $300
smog impact fee (a tax by any other name) unless the car has a
California EPA emission sticker. Finally, you will then need to get a
smog test and again will need to pass a visual and a tailpipe test.
The smog tests are required every two years thereafter.
To save time, I recommend using AAA if you are a member. They will
do most of the inspections that otherwise will take forever if you
try to go through CA DMV directly. IF the aftermarket parts are CARB
certified you should not have any problems, but the rules are
getting stricter every year.
Jon
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 21:38:22 +1100
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: bilzilla@zeta.org.au (Bill Sherwood)
Subject: Computer engine sims
Hiya,
Does anyone have copies of, or good access to - engine
performance/prediction/estimation software. What I mean is the sort of
software that you give the program all the specs on stuff like piston &
conrod weight, stroke length, etc, and it'll spit out data like piston
feet/sec, est max (critical) rpm, etc. To a certain extent, the more
technical & comprehensive the better. I'm quite happy to pay for the
appropriate software, but if you twist my arm I'll let you give it to me as
a late Christmas present. ;-) (Remember, it's my birthday in only seven
short months!!!)
But seriously, I am after anything (programs, sites, links) that
people know about.
TIA,
Billzilla. Meeoow.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: "Allan Chen"
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 03:36:40 -0800
To: Kevin Scaldeferri ,
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
On Jan 1, 2:05pm, Kevin Scaldeferri wrote:
> Subject: Question about CA emissions
Hi Kevin,
> Well, I just noticed a hole thats starting to form in part of my
> exhaust, so I'm thinking about putting in an aftermarket exhaust.
> Oops, should have mentioned, the hole is in front of the cat.
Is it in front of the flange of the cat (i.e. exhaust manifold side)?
If that is the case... you could probably get C.A.R.B. approved headers.
> My major concern is this. While I'm in Maryland now, I will probably
> find myself in California in about a year and a half. So I need to
> know how the CA emissions laws apply to a car that is brought into the
> state. Anyone happen to know this?
Well, for one...
a) You would have to get a smog inspection ~$20.
b) You would have to register it... warning: you must declare
the value of your car. Recommend giving it low blue book
because the way how they determine your registration fees is
off of a percentage of the car's actual value.
c) I think there is also a out of state registration fee and a
smog fee as well.
> Also, does anyone have recommendations for exhausts for an 88 Celica
> GTS, CA legal or not?
Depending on what you want to do. What are the goals for your car.
Allan
--
*******************************************************************************
Allan Chen
Silicon Graphics Inc. "Mele Kalikimaka a me ka Hau'oli Mau Makahiki Hou"
Mountain View, CA
allanc@sgi.com
*******************************************************************************
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 96 13:39:04 -0800
From: leslie@cadence.com (Leslie C. Fong)
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, coolhand@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
I don't know the exact regulations (who does?), but to bring a US Federal
car into CA for permanent residence, you would have to at least:
Pass the emissions inspection and test, which means it must meet the
strict CA mods regulations but only needs to meet the manufacturer's
(USA) Federal emissions levels. I don't think TEC II's, chromed
headers, and missing converters will do.
Pay for standard CA DMV licensing fees. This will include an
outrageous ANNUAL tax based on the purchased price/"value" of your
car. It's based on a property value of 100% - 10% depreciation for
each year or something absurd like that.
Pay a ONE-TIME fee of $300 for federal cars which are not CA
equipped. This is to provide an economic disincentive for importing
cars which will pollute more in CA, since the manufacturers only
charge "half" that to equip a new car for CA.
IMHO, I'd rather buy a federal car for CA and pay the extra $150, since
it will most likely have better performance, driveability, and fuel
economy than the CA equivalent. Most people find it too inconvenient
to do this. And there's always the possibility some bonehead will
replace or connect up the wrong thing because he's assumed it to be a
CA car. The ecologist in me says that all cars everywhere should be
manufactured to meet the stricter CA specifications, since the air is a
GLOBALLY shared resource. $300 only once is far too cheap a "deal".
$300 each year would get them out of the state quick. But I digress,
since keeping every car in proper tune would probably do more for clean
air than the plumbing diffs.
As far as performance parts goes, I've lived in California all my life
and have never seen the "rules" publicly dispersed anywhere other than
the auto mags. With that in mind, you should be able to do anything
after the cats as long as it doesn't violate noise/safety (common sense)
standards. Any other performance part needs to be CARB (Calif. Air
Resource Board) exemption approved. Of course, if the car MEETS tailpipe
emissions specs and visually APPEARS stock, noone's going to tear apart
your dash and engine to find those well concealed mods you've done,
unless you've angered some agency. That's to stay legit with the
system; I can't say about the other alternatives.
One caveat - last I heard in the news, the analyzers and computerized
testers are getting more advanced all the time. They're even trying
out a roadside detector program. I would make sure you save anything
you've replaced to ensure an easy (and cheap) restoration to a
stock-like condition, if only for the tests.
BTW only certain areas of the state need to regularly pass the biannual
tests, like all the major urban areas.
As for the original query by Kevin (coolhand@eng.umd.edu):
I'd say any quality exhaust that keeps the cat(s) and sensors in place
wouldn't be a problem, epecially if it's the only thing that's changed.
If you're really concerned, about it, you'd need to hear from someone who's
already done it to the same car; there must be plenty around.
Leslie
'87 Supra turbo, targa, 5sp, HKS EAC-T (TEMS), leather, ONLY 178K miles!
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 19:41:19 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: BOUNCE (Original from ckkoh@pc.jaring.my)
(I'm forwarding this. Majordomo yakked on the h*lf on the 3rd line
there. Paul P. told me how to fix this--hopefully I'll get around to
doing that tonight! -- cpm)
>Happy New Year!!!
>
>Can anyone help me with my proposed mod? I am looking for a
>engine upgrade for my 1984 Toyota Starlet 1.3 DX which has
>a RWD 4K engine.
>
>Preferably, a Toyota 1600 cc., 16 valve, Twin Cam engine with
>Electronic Fuel Injection which I can just plonk into the engine bay
>without any fuss. I sure wouldn't want to mess about with engine
>mounts. Would I have to change the gearbox/transmission too? I hope
>I can get away with a straight in and out job without having to dig
>deep into my pockets.
>
>Sure hope someone out there can supply me with the relevant info.
>Would appreciate it very much if you could also furnish me with the
>specs for the replacement engine.
>
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: Raikkonen Timo
To: "Toyota-Mods-mailin'list"
Subject: RE: Computer engine sims
Date: Tue, 02 Jan 96 17:23:00 PST
High!
Let us know how u succeed with this! I'm also interested about those stuff
(free ofcourse?:) - maybe someone else is too :)
-TimoR- (traikkonen@c2000.fi)
----------
From: toyota-mods-owner
To: toyota-mods
Subject: Computer engine sims
Date: 2. 01. 1996 21:38
Hiya,
Does anyone have copies of, or good access to - engine
performance/prediction/estimation software. What I mean is the sort of
software that you give the program all the specs on stuff like piston &
conrod weight, stroke length, etc, and it'll spit out data like piston
feet/sec, est max (critical) rpm, etc. To a certain extent, the more
technical & comprehensive the better. I'm quite happy to pay for the
appropriate software, but if you twist my arm I'll let you give it to me as
a late Christmas present. ;-) (Remember, it's my birthday in only seven
short months!!!)
But seriously, I am after anything (programs, sites, links) that
people know about.
TIA,
Billzilla. Meeoow.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 20:33:51 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: RE: Computer engine sims
Sorry, don't have any info on a freeware program, but Mr. Gasket's
Desktop Dyno is a very reasonably priced product with some nice
features. I have used it rather extensively to get HP and Torque
plots for each of the various performance upgrades for the 22R I've
been writing about lately. While it isn't going to be 100% accurate,
it is very impressive. I think that retail on it is something like
$49.95, but I'd be willing to send anyone in the group who wants it
a copy for jobber price, $35.96, plus shipping. I very much recommend
it.
Chris
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 20:42:05 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: BOUNCE (Original from ckkoh@pc.jaring.my)
(I'm forwarding this. Majordomo yakked on the h*lf on the 3rd line
there. Paul P. told me how to fix this--hopefully I'll get around to
doing that tonight! -- cpm)
>Happy New Year!!!
>
>Can anyone h*lp me with my proposed mod? I am looking for a
>engine upgrade for my 1984 Toyota Starlet 1.3 DX which has
>a RWD 4K engine.
>
>Preferably, a Toyota 1600 cc., 16 valve, Twin Cam engine with
>Electronic Fuel Injection which I can just plonk into the engine bay
>without any fuss. I sure wouldn't want to mess about with engine
>mounts. Would I have to change the gearbox/transmission too? I hope
>I can get away with a straight in and out job without having to dig
>deep into my pockets.
>
>Sure hope someone out there can supply me with the relevant info.
>Would appreciate it very much if you could also furnish me with the
>specs for the replacement engine.
>
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 20:58:52 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: RE: Head Gaskets
This discussion reminds me of something I've been wanting to post ever
since Aaron B. talked about using the thicker head gasket on his Supra.
This will reduce compression, which should, in theory, reduce the
tendancy for detonation, right? Well, except for the fact that you've
also changed the shape of what highly technical engine design folks call
the "squish area". (I'm not kidding!) The squish area is the area
between the top of the piston and the top of the chamber in the head.
Increasing the height of the squish area will lead to (any guesses?)...
DETONATION! I am sorry that I can't find the issue of Circle Track
magazine that dealt with this issue, but I've since verified that with
a very competent engine guru. I don't know the hows or whys, but I
thought that it might be a good thing to be aware of.
Chris
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Date: Tue, 2 Jan 96 20:42:47 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: fgibbins@sirius.uvic.ca (Frank Gibbins)
Subject: multi question post, re 1986 MR2 stuff
Hi there, and Happy New Year to all!
Is it possible, or rather feasible to extract the California emmision system
on a '86 MR2? If so is there any power gain or efficiency benefit? Someone
once told me that the California cars were the least powerful of all due to
the additional emmision equipment. Here in Victoria, B.C., we have no laws
governing emmisions (sad to say, but I'll still take advantage of the fact
that our air is scubbed by the ocean!) so I suppose nobody could jail me for
yanking all the extra stuff out.
If it is possible, where does one begin?
Secondly, I've read the FAQ and there seems to be a lot of contention
surrounding the K&N filters. I saw a bit where someone had done a very
controlled test on some vehicles in a quarry and found a large increase in
the content of wear metals and silicates (sand/dirt) in the test vehicles'
oil as compared to pre K&N oil samples. Has anyone using these filters on
the street encounted similar wear? Maybe this is an extreme case due to the
environment in which the test was conducted. So what's the real story on
street use? I'm kinda scared to use one now.
My third question is: Are there any performance computer chips available
for Mk I MR2s? If so are they effective?
I am also posting for a freind who's considering a turbo upgrade to his NA
89 MR2. How much do these things cost and where do you get them? Remember,
we're in Canada, so driving to California to get them installed might be a
bit extreme.
And finally, it seems, according to my MR2 book, that one can remove the
strut/spring assembly from the vehicle without using a spring compressor.
Although I realize this procedure would require an alignment afterwards, the
fact that the springs aren't under load when removed makes this a feasible
job for the home mechanic. Is this right? Can I plan to tackle this myself?
Any info on any part of this post would be awesome. Thanks.
Frank Gibbins, University of Victoria. Victoria, B.C., Canada.
BMOC...Biochemists and Microbiologists on Campus
Toyota MR2s on the Internet... because on the Information Superhighway,
you can drive as fast as you want.
Try the MR2 Web Page at http://mr2.com.
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Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 04:58:48 -0600 (CST)
From: Chris Hilliard
To: Toyota Mods
Subject: I installed my Weber!!!!!
Hey folks,
I got the Weber progressive on my 2T-C and am ready for a full
report of how it went.
First came removal of the old carb and all of those vacuum lines.
No problem there. I decided to do a little engine cleaning while I had it
tore down. I got it looking really nice and proceeded to trial fit the weber.
Okay, first I put on the adapter and the studs were too long. Hmmmmm, Let me
try putting that old approx. 3/4" spacer back on. Sure enough it fit like
a champ. But I had to make an additional gasket to go between the intake
and old spacer. I had plenty of the gasket material lying around so that
was nothing big.(Why didn't the diagram in the manual show it though?)
Next was the carb studs on the adapter and the carb itself. Boy,
this sucker iis sure sitting up there pretty high.The manual did say check
hood clearence. So I put on the aircleaner and cross my fingers hoping
the hood will close..........Whew! It closed! And not a millimeter to spare!
I thought it was hood scoop time fer sure :)
So I took everything apart and put it back to gether with the gaskets
and torqued it down. So far so good. Now comes the part of setting up the
throttle cable to fit the new linkage. Numero Uno was to cut of the ball-end
(throttle stop) as close to the linkage as possible and feed the end of
the cable into one of those screw-in throttle stops. Now for those of you
who have never seen one of these, you feed your cable through the
side hole of a little brass cylinder (1/4" long?). In the end of this
cylinder is another hole where a small screw fits in and tightens against
your cables' side. This is supposed to keep the cable secure? I have always
hated these things. They always slipped and left me with a dead throttle
when I raced go carts and 80cc motorcross. I dont care how tight you get them
because if you hammer the throttle, that sucker will slip. Needless to
say I will remedy this problem.
Also associated with this is the bracket that holds and allows
adjustment of the cable. The manual that came with the carb say that I can
"bend" the bracket if need be. WRONG! I am the son of a machinist and
have picked up a lot of tricks and mechanical common sense and there is
no way that thing is gonna bend like that. The throttle return spring
mounts to this stock bracket too and so I am out on that also.
The manual doesn't even mention putting on the new spring that was supplied
with the kit.
Alas, I made a new (and somewhat snazzy if I do say so myself) bracket
that takes care of both of those problems.
Next came wiring up the choke and fuel cut-off solenoid. They
both have spade connectors that need the female ends put on the existing
wires. But there was only one in the kit and it takes two to tango here.
I checked the parts list and sure enough there is supposed to be two. No
biggie. I've got millions of those things around the house. Now where
did I put those ........;)
So I got those wired up and I hook up the fuel lines.However,
there is no place for the fuel return line to go. So I plugged it and we are
back on track. (no mention of this in the manual either).
Now the best part. I eliminate ALL of those vaccume lines except for
two!!!! One outlet goes to the vacuum advance on the distributor and the
other to a spot on the intake. Lots of holes to plug. The kit furnished 2
vacuum caps and I thought to pick some up in town the other day. It took
a total of 6.
THE MOMENT OF TRUTH !!!!!
I set the fire exting. to the side of the car and here I go...
......It fires right up after a few backfires (too rich) and settles down
to a rough idle. A little mixture and idle screw tweakin' and she's
idling smoothly at 850 rep'ums (rpm's for you city folk :)
Now, after putting a few tools and the fire exting. in the car
it is test drive time. I take of slowly. There seems to be more power
than before. I drive easily down the road to a vacant little area....
...and PUNCH IT !!!! The cable slipped.....ugh! So, roadside as I am,
I put the cable back on (the engine is idling patiently at 850 rpm's)
and try it again. Whoa!!!!!! That's cooollll !!!!!! When you stick your
foot into that secondary it pulls pretty good. I think the jets are just
a tad big though. The manual said that the carb came set up for a 2T-C 1588
and the 3T-C 1770. So I figure they went with a somewhat happy medium
when they jetted it. The carb pulls great though and really flows better
than my stock set-up. I'd say that there was about a 15% gain as is.
Well,,all in all, everything went together smoothly in about
and hour and a half. The manual is pretty vague but I feel confident that
any novice good have done this conversion.
IT'S HEADER TIME !!!!!!!!!!
Chris Hilliard
cxh6989@jackson.freenet.org
****************************************************************
* |\/\/\/| ___________________
* | | / \
* | | ____________ / Catch this airhead \____
* | (0)(0) / \ / at \
* C _) / \/ cxh6989@jackson.freenet.org |
* | ,___| < AYE CARUMBA!!! \ /
* | / \ / \ "I didn't do it, /
* /====\ \____________/ \ Nobody saw me, ------------
*/ \ \ You can't prove a thing!!! /
***************************************\____________________________/
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Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 05:08:49 -0600 (CST)
From: Chris Hilliard
To: Toyota Mods
Subject: Re: I installed my Weber!!!!!
Whoa!!!!!! Did I do all of those typo's? Maybe if I get a little
more sleep and some coffee.......
i ARE not illiterate !
^^^
;)
****************************************************************
* |\/\/\/| ___________________
* | | / \
* | | ____________ / Catch this airhead \____
* | (0)(0) / \ / at \
* C _) / \/ cxh6989@jackson.freenet.org |
* | ,___| < AYE CARUMBA!!! \ /
* | / \ / \ "I didn't do it, /
* /====\ \____________/ \ Nobody saw me, ------------
*/ \ \ You can't prove a thing!!! /
***************************************\____________________________/
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Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 06:59:09 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: RE: Head Gaskets
>Yeah, but there are several mods about the same engine with different
>pistons. How about in these cases? Heads, gaskets & blocks are the
>same only the 'squish area' is different in each case, but still they all
>are
>or were on the productionline - also turbo & nonturbo engines.
>
>I'm not quite sure that it's so sharply designed and that there aren't
>SOME PLAY in that 'squish area'. Recarding to what I said above I'm
>a bit 'skeptic' about that, but what I know... :)
I don't pretend to understand it, but when you hear it from someone like
Randy Dorton, who's been building Winston Cup and NHRA engines for 30
years (probably one of the most respected SB Chevy engine builders in the
world), you better count on it. It doesn't really make sense to me,
either. I figure it must have something to do with flame fronts or
hidden areas in the chamber or something. I'll try to find out more
about this.
Chris
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To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 10:20:45 EST
From: Kevin Scaldeferri
Allen Chen wrote:
>On Jan 1, 2:05pm, Kevin Scaldeferri wrote:
>> Subject: Question about CA emissions
>
>Hi Kevin,
>
>> Well, I just noticed a hole thats starting to form in part of my
>> exhaust, so I'm thinking about putting in an aftermarket exhaust.
>> Oops, should have mentioned, the hole is in front of the cat.
>
>Is it in front of the flange of the cat (i.e. exhaust manifold side)?
>If that is the case... you could probably get C.A.R.B. approved headers.
>
Do you happen to know what CARB approved headers are availible for an
88 Celica?
>
>> Also, does anyone have recommendations for exhausts for an 88 Celica
>> GTS, CA legal or not?
>
>Depending on what you want to do. What are the goals for your car.
>
I'm not looking to do anything drastic. Specifically, I'd rather not
change the appearance of the car much (including sound). At the
moment, I'd just like to get a bit more performance out of it. I have
thought about getting into autocross, but there doesn't seem to be
much of that going on around here.
Kevin
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From: Raikkonen Timo
To: "Toyota-Mods-mailin'list"
Subject: RE: Head Gaskets
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 96 12:04:00 PST
High there!
Chris wrote:
This discussion reminds me of something I've been wanting to post ever
since Aaron B. talked about using the thicker head gasket on his Supra.
This will reduce compression, which should, in theory, reduce the
tendancy for detonation, right? Well, except for the fact that you've
also changed the shape of what highly technical engine design folks call
the "squish area". (I'm not kidding!) The squish area is the area
between the top of the piston and the top of the chamber in the head.
Increasing the height of the squish area will lead to (any guesses?)...
DETONATION! I am sorry that I can't find the issue of Circle Track
magazine that dealt with this issue, but I've since verified that with
a very competent engine guru. I don't know the hows or whys, but I
thought that it might be a good thing to be aware of.
Chris
Me:
Yeah, but there are several mods about the same engine with different
pistons. How about in these cases? Heads, gaskets & blocks are the
same only the 'squish area' is different in each case, but still they all
are
or were on the productionline - also turbo & nonturbo engines.
I'm not quite sure that it's so sharply designed and that there aren't
SOME PLAY in that 'squish area'. Recarding to what I said above I'm
a bit 'skeptic' about that, but what I know... :)
-Timo-
PS. Which one is totally in the woods 4AG-ZE or 4A-GE - same heads,
but different 'squish area' (=different pistons)!? :)
PPS. Correct me if I'm the one that is in the woods :)
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Date: Thu, 4 Jan 1996 10:33:48 +1100 (EST)
From: Justin Simpson
To: Bill Sherwood
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Computer engine sims
Bill, if you have access to the internet there is a pretty good site that
has a range of programs for working out all sorts of variables from
optimum diff ratio to horsepower specs. site address is
http://devserve.cebaf.gov/~bowling/auto.html
hope this is of some use.
seeya
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
Justen Simpson simpson@lake.canberra.edu.au
CRC for Freshwater Ecology, Uni of Canberra, Australia
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
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Date: Wed, 3 Jan 96 17:21:50 PST
From: wg%rm763a@riem.com (Wayne R. Graves)
Subject: 20R pistons and rings ?
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Can someone tell me if its posible to purchase a single
piston or a single set of piston rings for a 20R(1975 hi-lux)
or do you have to buy a whole set ? While doing a value job
I discovered one piston had a couple of dings in it and it
appears that the rings on that piston may be be leaking oil.
The truck isn't worth the cost of the value job let alone a
whole set of pistons, any suggestions ?
Thanks
Wayne
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Date: Thu, 4 Jan 1996 22:45:35 +1300
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Mark Forder
Subject: me/mine/mods
Hi there,
I've just subscribed to the Toyota-Mods mailing list, first list I've ever
subscribed to, but looks like its going to give me a lot of information I'm
after for performance mods to my MR2. I have had for 4 years a 1984
(ex-japan) MR2, 4A-GE engine. Mods done to it are: Performance exhaust (no
particular brand, something "special" from me local exhaust agent),
free-flow air filter, gas shocks, and a "cold air" pipe setup to duct cold
air from the ventilation duct thru to the engine intake.
I live in Auckland, New Zealand, as such we don't get a huge amount of
"support"/"products" here for our Toyotas. We can't even buy a new Turbo
MR2!! We do have a lot of "imports", ie 2nd hand ex-Japan, so that is one
option of getting hold of one though.
I'm looking for ideas and products etc for enhancing the performance of my
car, and also keen to help with any problems others have. Also I'm keen to
see how/what products I can possibly source.
Mark Forder
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From: "Vodicka, Roger"
To: "'toyota-mods'"
Subject: Fuel Pressure Regulators
Date: Thu, 04 Jan 96 12:02:00 CST
I wonder if anyone could enlighten me on how the fuel pressure regulator
system works on the '86 Celica (3S-GELC). The fuel pressure regulator seems
to
consist of a yellow plastic screw which sits near the TVIS unit. I would
like to know
how the fuel pressure affects performance. I have played around with the
screw and
noticed that the driveability/fuel consumption/power can change dramatically
with a few
turns.
I don't have a fuel pressure gauge to calibrate the fuel pressure. I might
have to make a
pressure testing unit for the job. Does anyone know the type of threads
used on the fuel line banjo bolts?
The other thing I have noticed is that I have a two colours of fuel injector
plug. I have two
white plugs and two pink plugs. Is this normal? (I think they are type 3
or 4 according to
Matti Kalalahti's injector data - 13.8 ohm)
Thanks in advance.
Roger Vodicka
(Melbourne, AUSTRALIA)
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Date: Thu, 4 Jan 96 13:19:45 EST
From: chris@lexis-nexis.com (Chris Schrimsher)
To: Toyota-Mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Seat Heaters on current generation Supra
I have US spec '93.5 Supra and have been looking into the prospect of
installing seat heaters in. I know they are an option for the Canadian
spec Supra and they are shown in the Toyota Repair Manual.
Right now I am seeking knowledge and advice from the list in an effort to
see if this is worth pursuing.
The big question is, is the wiring harness already in place? If so, it would
just be a matter of installing the switch and the heaters and plugging them in.
I could be wrong considering I have no knowledge of auto electronics.
Every time my butt hits that cold leather I think about this.
So, has anyone ever worked with seat heaters?
Chris
'93.5 NA Supra
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From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan"
To: "'Christopher Myer'" ,
Subject: RE: Computer engine sims
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 1996 15:40:52 +-800
What does it do? i.e. What are the inputs it wants and what does it tell you?
And while we're on this subject, what's a good way of getting a reading of a car's power / torque w/o a dyno?
----------
From: Christopher Myer[SMTP:cmyer@CyberAuto.Com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 1996 9:33 AM
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: RE: Computer engine sims
Sorry, don't have any info on a freeware program, but Mr. Gasket's
Desktop Dyno is a very reasonably priced product with some nice
features. I have used it rather extensively to get HP and Torque
plots for each of the various performance upgrades for the 22R I've
been writing about lately. While it isn't going to be 100% accurate,
it is very impressive. I think that retail on it is something like
$49.95, but I'd be willing to send anyone in the group who wants it
a copy for jobber price, $35.96, plus shipping. I very much recommend
it.
Chris
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 96 13:20:32 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject:me\mine\mods
Mark,
Didnt NZ get the 4AG-Z? I think it did, hence why dont you buy one of those
or use an ex-Japan rear cut from a later AW-11? If you stay with the 4A-G
its time to add CAMS. Leave the ECU alone add 264 inlet 256 exhaust.
Bruce
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 96 15:06:40 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 4AG-Z
Mark,
Well the 'Z' was the Supercharger and I remember reading the Australian
'Wheels' mag with a review of the MR-2 in 1987 in NZ with a 4AG-Z. Your
engine is the 86KW (at 95 RON) original 4A-G IE normal asperation. It is
well known throughout the world with mods as long as your arm as many of the
readers of this forum well know. Boosting power to around 140BHP is done
primarily with the CAMS as I stated. Over this number requires injector, ECU
and finally bottom end changes. The MR-2 has a close ratio box with 4.3 drive
ratio, it really doesnt need much else other than suspention work and power
increase. The supercharger gives torque, something you will really feel in
the seat of the pants, its great for the street but not for track racing.
Bruce Connelly
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Date: Fri, 5 Jan 96 15:28:30 EST
From: "Marc H. Bremmer"
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Looking for DCOE manifold for 22R
Hey toyota people..
I am looking for a dual 40 DCOE manifold for a 22R (4x4PU) does anyone have
one or know where to get one. Pierce has them but they are $300 or so.. If
Icafind a used one or you know where to get one for $200 or less let me know
marc
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Date: Fri, 05 Jan 1996 14:14:00 -0800 (PST)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: RE: Looking for DCOE manifold for 22R
To: "toyota-mods@cyberauto.com"
A 20R dual DCOE manifold will also work / bolt up to any 22R head. The
ports in the 20R manifold are round, the ports in the 22R head are square.
Not ideal, but it will work. I am running this configuration in my Celica.
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
----------
From: toyota-mods-owner
To: toyota-mods
Subject: Looking for DCOE manifold for 22R
Date: Friday, January 05, 1996 3:28PM
Hey toyota people..
I am looking for a dual 40 DCOE manifold for a 22R (4x4PU) does anyone
have
one or know where to get one. Pierce has them but they are $300 or so.. If
Icafind a used one or you know where to get one for $200 or less let me know
marc
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From: "Allan Chen"
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 17:03:34 -0800
To: Kevin Scaldeferri ,
Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
On Jan 3, 10:20am, Kevin Scaldeferri wrote:
> Subject: Re: Question about CA emissions
Kevin,
> Do you happen to know what CARB approved headers are availible for an
> 88 Celica?
There are many manufacturers... You may want to compare prices between
TRD and Doug Thorley. Give Chris Myers a jingle... email him at:
cmyer@cyberauto.com
He might be able to swing you a good deal on a header set.
> I'm not looking to do anything drastic. Specifically, I'd rather not
> change the appearance of the car much (including sound). At the
> moment, I'd just like to get a bit more performance out of it.
If you wish to just squeeze out a little more ponies, then a new air
cleaner system (i.e. K&N, etc...) as well as a less restrictive exhaust is
system is more to your likings.
> I have thought about getting into autocross, but there doesn't seem to be
> much of that going on around here.
You would be surprised... look at your local chapter of SCCA or the
nearest race track. Who knows maybe there is also alot of local clubs that may
also hold ralleys in parking lots. Just ask around... especially your local
speed shops.
If you are planning to autocross my best recommendation are to get
springs, shocks, and tires. These minimal components will provide you with the
best results on a road course but there is no sustitute for driving skills so
develope them while the car is stock. Learn what your car's threshold is like
and maximize the understanding of it's limits are like. It will only add to
your skills when your car recieves it's modifications... then you have another
level to strive for. I still believe that it's better to have the skills to
prepare for the inevitable vs. trying to avoid something at the last minute.
Another alternative is to get a rental car... I find that it's alot
more fun taking a rental car and pushing it since the threshold is alot lower.
It's easier to slide hot into a corner as well as drift under throttle. Just
make sure you have insurance (that takes away all liability from you... usually
it's an additional $10/day) on that puppy when you rent it *grin*.
And as a note of caution... do these experimentations on a closed
course. I would not like to hear some accident or police stories anytime in
the near future.
Allan
--
*******************************************************************************
Allan Chen
Silicon Graphics Inc.
Mountain View, CA
allanc@sgi.com
*******************************************************************************
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From: ckkoh@pop.jaring.my
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 1996 00:33:18 +0000
Subject: Toyota Starlet
Thanks Peter Mejak for your info. Looks like I'll be in for a rough
ride if I were to opt for an EFI engine. Since, I'm looking for an
economical and easy upgrade path, I'll change my specs.
So, any of you guys know of a Toyota 1.6 Litre, Twin Cam, 16 Valve
normally aspirated, RWD engine I could transplant into my 1984 Toyota
Starlet 1.3 DX with the minimum of fuss?
I sure would appreciate it if the good samaritan could also tell me
from which model/year the engine came from, better still, the engine
specs.
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To: ckkoh@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, peterm@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 96 08:28:29 +1100
From: Peter Mejak
Hi CK,
The 2TG that I mentioned also came as a twin sidedraft carby version. It's a
1600, TwinCam, 8-Valve engine. In fact, as far as I know, it started out in
carb format & was only later available in EFI. Probably only available in
Japanese-spec vehicles.
A good web page for Toyota Engines is Matti's page :-
http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
That's his home page. Engines specifically :-
http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/dataBySubject/GasolineEngines.html
Pictures :-
http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/dataBySubject/EnginePix.html
Looks like Matti's been at work re-vamping it lately.
As I mentioned in my last msg, I'm not sure how easy/hard it would be to drop
into a Startlet -- we didn't get these in Australia. Someone in the US can
probably help more with this.
Hope this helps,
Cheers,
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 08:46:08 +1000 (EST)
From: Paul Pyyvaara
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
On Mon, 8 Jan 1996, Peter Mejak wrote:
> The 2TG that I mentioned also came as a twin sidedraft carby version. It's a
> 1600, TwinCam, 8-Valve engine. In fact, as far as I know, it started out in
> carb format & was only later available in EFI. Probably only available in
> Japanese-spec vehicles.
Hmmm...I think the 4AG would be a better option as it is 16 valve and
lighter with more power (only thing you can't do is bore and stroke it to
two litre like the 2T-G). Should be easy enough to get an after-market
twin carb manifold - have seen them before...
I have heard of some stories of starlets with 4AG - should be possible
(anything is possible with enough engineering ;)
Cheers,
Paul.
--
Paul Pyyvaara - paulp@dstc.edu.au
Research Scientist - Distributed Systems Technology Centre
B O N D U N I V E R S I T Y, QLD, 4229, AUSTRALIA
Phone:(+61 7 55 953 324) Fax:(+61 7 55 953 320)
WWW : http://www.dstc.Bond.edu.au/~paulp/
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To: Paul Pyyvaara
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 96 10:29:36 +1100
From: Peter Mejak
On Mon, 8 Jan 1996, Peter Mejak wrote:
> The 2TG that I mentioned also came as a twin sidedraft carby version. It's a
> 1600, TwinCam, 8-Valve engine. In fact, as far as I know, it started out in
> carb format & was only later available in EFI. Probably only available in
> Japanese-spec vehicles.
Hmmm...I think the 4AG would be a better option as it is 16 valve and
lighter with more power (only thing you can't do is bore and stroke it to
two litre like the 2T-G). Should be easy enough to get an after-market
twin carb manifold - have seen them before...
I have heard of some stories of starlets with 4AG - should be possible
(anything is possible with enough engineering ;)
Only problem is, he doesn't want to modify engine mounts. Since I've
heard a 2TG is an easy swap into a K series Corolla (also K series
engine standard, mounts need to be slotted apparently), I suggested
that....
Agreed though, a 4AGE would be a better swap & has been done before.
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 09:40:41 +1000 (EST)
From: Paul Pyyvaara
To: Peter Mejak
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
On Mon, 8 Jan 1996, Peter Mejak wrote:
> Only problem is, he doesn't want to modify engine mounts. Since I've
> heard a 2TG is an easy swap into a K series Corolla (also K series
> engine standard, mounts need to be slotted apparently), I suggested
> that....
I have a KE-25 Corolla with 2T-G and we had to make engine mounts (still
used the original 2-T(G) rubber part).
I don't think you can slot the mounts on a KE-30 series
Corolla - best bet is to use the standard rubber section (between the
mount and the cross-member) and fabricate the section between the block
and the rubber.
Cheers,
Paul.
--
Paul Pyyvaara - paulp@dstc.edu.au
Research Scientist - Distributed Systems Technology Centre
B O N D U N I V E R S I T Y, QLD, 4229, AUSTRALIA
Phone:(+61 7 55 953 324) Fax:(+61 7 55 953 320)
WWW : http://www.dstc.Bond.edu.au/~paulp/
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To: Paul Pyyvaara
Cc: Peter Mejak ,
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
Date: Mon, 08 Jan 96 10:54:44 +1100
From: Peter Mejak
On Mon, 8 Jan 1996, Peter Mejak wrote:
> Only problem is, he doesn't want to modify engine mounts. Since I've
> heard a 2TG is an easy swap into a K series Corolla (also K series
> engine standard, mounts need to be slotted apparently), I suggested
> that....
I have a KE-25 Corolla with 2T-G and we had to make engine mounts (still
used the original 2-T(G) rubber part).
I don't think you can slot the mounts on a KE-30 series
Corolla - best bet is to use the standard rubber section (between the
mount and the cross-member) and fabricate the section between the block
and the rubber.
I'm pretty much going by hear-say rather than experience. I've been
told everything from "it's a bolt-in fit", to "slot the engine mounts"
to "engine mounts need to be changed". Mostly I've heard that it's
bolt-in or slotting is required. Haven't bothered to find out what the
"real deal" is as I'm not going for a 2TG. If the above is true, then
KC may be out of luck ......
Hoping that someone with more knowledge of Starlets will jump in here.
Cheers,
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 08:44:05 -0500
From: "ROGERS"
To: Peter Mejak ,
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re[2]: Toyota Starlet
I have an 84 Starlet with a 4AGE here in Toronto. I have personally witnessed
starlets with 2TG's, 13B's,3SGE's and a 3TGTE. No matter which engine you put in
it, you will have to modify the engine mounts somewhat. The engine mounts in my
starlet are (If I recall -- its been over 4 years since its'd been in there) a
hybrid of corolla and the original starlets (4KE engine). Minor welding was
involved. The drive shaft had to be cut, and a new hole made in the tunnel in
the car to accomodate the corolla gear box which sits a bit further back in the
car.
I just returned from my homeland Barbados on the weekend (If you are a starlet
die hard, take a trip there sometime during the race season (Feb - August) and
attend one of the many special events.
On the subject of 4AGE VS 2TG VS other engines for modifying, consider this. The
4AGE is a "been there done that type" of project. I.e TRD has done alot with
this engine, and the formula for getting performance out of it is known in
various racing circles. Plus parts from various sources are available.
While the 2TG has great potential, I suspect getting parts for it will prove to
be difficult in the long run. (I think the 2TG uses a chain drive vs belts, and
as a result you will not be able to play with cam timing as easlily as with the
4AGE)
As for displacement consider the results of 3 starlets during a special event:
Car Engine 1/4 Mile Time
Starlet 4AGE (Atlantic spec -- using carbs) 12.3
Starlet 4AGZE (Converted to turbo) 13.1
Starlet 3SGE (fully modified,6 speed sequential gearbox) 12.5
Reply to:
rogers@golddisk.com
_______________________________________________________________________________
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
From: Peter Mejak at Internet
Date: 1/8/96 12:30 PM
On Mon, 8 Jan 1996, Peter Mejak wrote:
> The 2TG that I mentioned also came as a twin sidedraft carby version. It's a
> 1600, TwinCam, 8-Valve engine. In fact, as far as I know, it started out in
> carb format & was only later available in EFI. Probably only available in
> Japanese-spec vehicles.
Hmmm...I think the 4AG would be a better option as it is 16 valve and
lighter with more power (only thing you can't do is bore and stroke it to
two litre like the 2T-G). Should be easy enough to get an after-market
twin carb manifold - have seen them before...
I have heard of some stories of starlets with 4AG - should be possible
(anything is possible with enough engineering ;)
Only problem is, he doesn't want to modify engine mounts. Since I've
heard a 2TG is an easy swap into a K series Corolla (also K series
engine standard, mounts need to be slotted apparently), I suggested
that....
Agreed though, a 4AGE would be a better swap & has been done before.
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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To: toyota-mods
From: "john.limcangco"
Date: 8 Jan 96 10:55:52
Subject: Restoring wheels.
Hi!
I've purchased a used set of Volk Racing (Ray Engineering) 3-piece mag wheels
-- cheap! Its in bad shape right now, but I think it will be a great project
to work on.
Its supposed to have a shiny polished outer lip but now its a dull aluminum
color. I've tried some metal polish on a small spot and I was able to get the
part to shine like chrome :-) The 'center' or 'face' has a wire wheel look
(similar to BBS but without the big center 'nut'), it's gold in color. The
inside wheel lips also has some spots of corrosion.... I think I can sand that
down, and paint it.
The outer lip of one wheel has some nicks and scratches... nothing deep...
would it be safe to have a machine shop turn it in a lathe?
Now for some real work, I'll need to remove the hex-screws that hold the center
part of the wheel, polish the lip(s), and repaint the centers.
What is the best way to bring the shine out of the lip? Using metal polish and
some elbow grease seems too much work. When I get it nice and shiny, should I
spray it with some clear paint to protect it? If so, what paint should I use
(acrylic, enamel, lacquer)? Someone told me that car wax should be good
enough... True?
I assume I can use some kind of silicone sealant to seal the two wheel halves
when I put them back together... How much torque should I turn the hex-screws
when I put them back?
This is my first time to work with 3-piece aluminum wheels... I apologize for
the barrage of questions. If anyone has similar experience, I'd like to hear
from you.
Thanks and regards,
John Limcangco
Manila, Philippines
79 Cressida 18RG
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 96 11:58:50 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Thin Gaskets for 4A-G
Folks,
Well I didnt get a response to my 10.3 bottom end on a TVIS motor question,
and I'm finding it a bit hard to get one anyway. Now lets try to get the
ratio up another way. How thick is a 4AG-STD gasket? Is it 1.4mm? Is the
steel one still available at .8mm. If the STD C/R is 9.4 putting this one
in gets me at least 9.9:1 without decking the head. Has anyone tried it?
What is the price in the US Chris?
Bruce Connelly
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 10:46:33 -0600
To: toyota-mods
From: Jack Alford
Subject: Re: Restoring wheels.
>I've purchased a used set of Volk Racing (Ray Engineering) 3-piece mag wheels
>-- cheap! Its in bad shape right now, but I think it will be a great project
>to work on.
>Its supposed to have a shiny polished outer lip but now its a dull aluminum
>color. I've tried some metal polish on a small spot and I was able to get the
>part to shine like chrome :-) The 'center' or 'face' has a wire wheel look
>(similar to BBS but without the big center 'nut'), it's gold in color. The
>inside wheel lips also has some spots of corrosion.... I think I can sand that
>down, and paint it.
If you've got an air comp. get a $20 die grinder, put a little polishing
wheel in it, slap some polishing compound on the rim and polish to
your hearts content, not exactly a fast method, but MUCH quicker than
by hand ...
>
>The outer lip of one wheel has some nicks and scratches... nothing deep...
>would it be safe to have a machine shop turn it in a lathe?
Use that same die grinder with a small sanding wheel in it, be careful, but
just hit the nicks a little to smoooth them out, then use the buffing
wheel to polish it back smooth ...
- jack alford ==> toy4x4@ro.com --> Decatur, AL
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 19:09:00 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: BOUNCE (Original from Bruce Connelly)
Here are some excellent comments from Bruce, bounced because of the
h*lp in the first line. Paul told me how to fix this, and hopefully
I'll have an opportunity to do so very soon. Also, I'm going to be
turning the administration of the list over to Paul as well. He has
quite a bit of Majordomo experience, which will be a welcome relief.
Thanks, Paul!
Chris
>Guys,
>I cant help but comment on the 4AG - 2TG dicussion. I have fiddled with both
>engines over the years and feel you will go the 4AG route but if you want power
>and power and at a cheap price the 2TG will blow the doors of the 4A-G!!!!! I
>know because Ive built both. The 2TG has much going for it, mainly because its
>older and the crank is so much stronger and the block allows almost 2 litres
>and the shims are under the buckets.To get 210 BHP from a 2TG its easy. And the
>engine will last for years. Insert 300 degree CAMS, TRD 10:5 pistons, exhaust,
>45mm DCOE and stronger RODs and bolts. Options, Datsun 260 exhaust valves, and
>heavy clutch. And this motor has torque, something the 4AG will never have. In
>racing my KE20 has NEVER been passed by a 4A-G of any description. To get
>near this in a 4AG you will have to sell your house to afford the steel crank,
>rods, 12:1 pistons, oil pump,CAMS, seats, valve springs, and heaps of head
>work. The 2TG pistons are easily available and up to 190 BHP is available
>with only CARBS, pistons and CAMS.
>Having said this my road car is a modified 4A-G, well have you seen the gas
>bill on DCOE's!
>Bruce Connelly
--
Christopher P. Myer
Cyberspace Automotive Performance
www.cyberauto.com
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 19:15:24 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Testing, testing
help, help, help!
(If you're getting this it means it is not bouncing. This is good! It
also means that you can put help in your email now!)
Chris
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Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 11:21:52 +1100 (EST)
From: Justin Simpson
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 18rg for sale
For anyone looking for an 18rg or if you know someone after one, I have
one for sale producing a dynoed 200 hp. Mods include full head port (44
mm) manifold match, TRD cams, Comp Nissan valve springs, balanced bottom
end, 10.5:1 comp ratio (runs on pump super), twin 45 mm DCOE Webbers, TRD
ram tubes, finer filters, extractors, 2.5 inch side system, regraphed dizzi,
high pressure oil pump, lightened flywheel, bosch ignition, Basically the
whole box and dice for the bargain basement price of $1300 ono (hate to
think what it has cost me). If you are close enough I'll even fit it for
you.
Seeya
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
Justen Simpson simpson@lake.canberra.edu.au
CRC for Freshwater Ecology, Uni of Canberra, Australia
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
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Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 21:23:42 -0600
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: pstiles@skyenet.net (Paul A Stiles)
Subject: me/mine/mods
Name: Paul A Stiles
Location: South Bend, Indiana USA
Model: MR2
Engine: 4A-GE
Mods: none - yet
email: pstiles@skyenet.net
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From: RamziM2@aol.com
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 22:48:47 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: HKS Powerflo
>I've never seen a Power Flow kit for the 85-87 MR2, but the 88-89 kit puts
>the filter in the trunk.. I'm using a large size Power Flow (from my RX-7),
>a piece of 4 inch "hose" and an adapter piece that bolts up to the air flow
>meter, and YES, when it rains, it drenches the air filter.. I usually put a
>plastic bag over the opening if I know it raining.. how does everyone else
>put a filter on their 85-87 MR2 ? I'd like to know..
toysport in LA has an adapter to install the Power Flow to the 85-87 MR2
Ramzi
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Date: Mon, 08 Jan 1996 22:33:00 -0800 (PST)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: More Toyota engine pictures
To: Matti Kalalahti
Cc: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)" ,
Matti,
I am sending you the following additional images. Hope to see them on your
WWW page soon. Keep up the good work. More to come....
9r.jpg 9R engine in Toyota 1600 GT
10r.jpg 10R (8RG) engine in Corona Mark II Hardtop 1900 GSS
2tg_2.jpg 2TG engine in 1970 Celica 1600 GT
2000gt.jpg 1967 model 2000 GT
3m.jpg 3M engine in 2000 GT
3m_2.jpg 3M power curve
3m_3.jpg 3M stats
5mgeu.jpg 5MGEU engine
5mgeu_2.jpg 5MGEU power curve and stats
6mgeu.jpg 6MGEU engine
6mgeu_2.jpg 6MGEU power curve and stats
7mgteu.jpg 7MGTEU engine
7mgteu_2.jpg 7MGTEU power curve and stats
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
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Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 17:40:17 +1100
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: bilzilla@zeta.org.au (Bill Sherwood)
Subject: 4A-G Vs 2T-G. First of many, I feel.....
Oh-oh - I can feel a HUGE debate coming up!!!
My 2c worth on the debate 4A-G Vs 2T-G, and why. But first to address Bruce
Connelly's comments.
>>Guys,
>>I cant help but comment on the 4AG - 2TG dicussion. I have fiddled with both
>>engines over the years and feel you will go the 4AG route but if you want
power
>>and power and at a cheap price the 2TG will blow the doors of the 4A-G!!!!!
I'm not a petrol head who goes drag racing everything in sight, but I run
against some fairly quick 4 cylinders and the only ones that can knock off a
good 4A-G (I rate mine as only fair) have turbos or superchargers. I have
never been beaten in a drag by a 2T-G, and I do not expect to. (Maybe if
it's been modified to 2 litres and had a lot of other mods.)
>>I know because Ive built both.
Me too. I had a 2T-G in 1984, and I had many years of good service from it.
At the end of 1994 I fitted my AE-86 with a 4A-GE and would not consider
anything else, except perhaps a 4A-GZE or 3S-G. :) The 2T-G had 10.5:1
compression and 280 deg cams, and was good for about 140hp. A proffessional
engine builder (Jimmy Bertram who used to own GP Cars in Brisbane) built up
a rather good 2 litre 2T-G for Greg Whittiker, who used to be a top rally
driver in Queensland in the mid 80's. The best they could get was 172 hp at
the wheels on a reliable chassis dyno. That would make the engine about 205
- 220 hp. That is about 106 - 114 hp/litre, which is getting near the
practical limit for a two valve engine. Yes, they are a twin cam, but only
by name - the combustion chamber shape is remarkably similar to the push-rod
2T. This means the only practical advantage they have is the actuation of
the valve gear, which is of course classic twin cam bucket & shim. This
arrangement will allow higher rpm's than the push-rod version, but with any
reasonable valve gear a push rod engine will run to 8000+ rpm. (The 3K in my
racing car will run quite happily at 8600 rpm, and also puts out about 105
hp/litre.)
The most power I have seen out of a 4A-G (Still 1600cc) is a genuine
220 hp. Before you start, yes, the Japanese chappie in question had
basically spent a shitload on it, but 220 hp is 220 hp. Performing similar
mods (done properly) on both a 4A-G and a 2T-G will end up with the 4A-G
definitely having more hp, but similar torque. The 4A-G will also quite
happily run to over 8000 rpm in near-standard form, while the 2T-G will do
that exactly twice - one on the way up (Bang!) and once on the way down to
zero rpm. A similarly prepared 2T-G will rev to only about 7000 odd safely.
>>The 2TG has much going for it, mainly because its
>>older and the crank is so much stronger and the block allows almost 2 litres
>>and the shims are under the buckets.
Old age is a plus? Sorry, can't figure that one out.
The crank is stonger? The only people who seem to break 4A-G cranks are
racers who run bags of rev (9500+) or those rather ignorant of correct
engine preparation. As I've said, the standard 4A-G is quite safe at 8000
rpm. Even the ones with the supposedly 'weak' crank, like mine.
The block allows almost 2 litres. Yup, but there are problems. Due to
manufacturing inconsistancies each block is slighly different, and although
every 2T-G block can take 89mm piston, you are running a risk with 90mm's.
The bores become too porous & crack, I've heard. The 4A-G is also fairly
limited in its ability to be over-bored. The shims are under the buckets,
which _is_ better, but far from critical. The only disadvantage of having
the shims on top is you are limited with the size of the cam lobe. But, as I
have said before, for road & rally use there is just no need for big cams.
280 deg & 0.330" lift is plenty. BTW, kits are available for 4A-G's to move
the shim under the bucket.
>>To get 210 BHP from a 2TG its easy. And the engine will last for years. Insert
>>300 degree CAMS, TRD 10:5 pistons, exhaust, 45mm DCOE and stronger RODs and
>>bolts. Options, Datsun 260 exhaust valves, and heavy clutch.
I'm sorry, but you've been misled - there is no way on earth that those mods
will give you 210hp from a 1600cc 2-valve. (If the TRD 10.5:1 pistons are
bigger then 85mm (88.5), then accept my apologies over the 1600cc statement,
although it doesn't change if the engine is 1722cc) An otherwise standard
two valve engine will just not produce 131hp/litre with those mods. As I
have said before, my 2T-G had similar mods to what you have described and
was about 140hp - 88hp/litre, a more realistic figure. (My 2T-G had the
'220' head, which was the 'small valve'. I believe the '222', the '260' &
'261' heads are better, but certainly not 48% better.)
>>And this motor has torque, something the 4AG will never have.
Again, quite untrue. Another racing friend of mine, John Burton, built up a
4A-G with a small port head, aftermarket injection, good extractors, and
other not terribly expensive mods. The engine was reliably & consistantly
dynoed at 184 hp, and 125 ft/lbs (170 nm) torque. A 2 litre 2T-G will easily
give that much torque, but the 1600 won't be significantly better in my
experience, if at all.
I am the first to agree that the low rpm torque of the 4A-G is relatively
poor, but once in the higher rpm's it shows it's true colours. If you put
them side by side with a Cosworth BDA, they look remarkably similar - a
purpose built race engine, not a push rod engine with tassles. As a
practical example, when running my AE-86 hard, going into 2nd from 1st the
wheels will spin for a bit, not just 'chirp'. It has a LSD and 205mm wide
tyres, so it isn't affected by lack of traction. Lots of fun around
roundabouts - even better in the wet. It is also quite possible to hold an
power oversteer drift in 3rd.
>>In racing my KE20 has NEVER been passed by a 4A-G of any description.
As I said in my previous submissions, Toyota has done most of the hard work
- people (racers included) don't recognise a good thing and quite often make
it worse. Race a properly built 4A-G - I have no doubt that your Corolla is
quick, but you _will_ be in for an unpleasant shock. (No, not mine. It's
only a warmed up road car.)
>>To get near this in a 4AG you will have to sell your house to afford the
>>steel crank, rods, 12:1 pistons, oil pump,CAMS, seats, valve springs,
>>and heaps of head work.
As I said previously - you don't need the super crank, just build the engine
properly.
The standard rods are ok up to 8000 rpm. (Isn't that enough????)
12:1 compression on Aus fuel? 10.5:1 is about as far as you can go on Aus
super juice. On Avgas (Piston aircraft fuel) it is possible to run 12.8:1 ok.
Oil pump, seats, valve springs? Why, why, why? They're just fine standard
for road use. For racing I'd put some shims (washers) in the oil pump to
boost the pressure, and the standard valve springs are good enough for 8500
rpm, so how far were you planning on going?
Heaps of head work? Only for the ignorant. As I've said, the head is rather
similar to a Cosworth BDA, the only work they need is a clean up around the
valves, and the valves themselves can benefit from some attention. I can't
tell you exactly what has to be done as it's a bit of a secret, sorry. One
thing I can tell you is for road use, a useful increase in power can be had
by REDUCING the size of the valves!
>>190 BHP is available with only CARBS, pistons and CAMS.
I'm sorry, but that is just plain rubbish. Where on earth did you come up
with that?
>>Having said this my road car is a modified 4A-G, well have you seen the gas
>>bill on DCOE's!
I too have noticed that you get poor fuel economy if you drive then around
at the sort of revs they are capable of. If you drive sensably, like I do
(well, _most_ of the time :) you can easily get 30 mpg 'round town and 40
mpg on the highway. They are almost identical figures the my 2T-G. There are
three things involved in burning fuel - 1. Horsepower=Fuel. Not easy to
avoid, to get power, ya gotta burn fuel. 2. Poor state of tune. By either
lack of maintenance or poor selection of engine parts so that, ie, the cams
are too big for the head, etc. 3. A heavy bloody foot!
Summary- I haven't got anything against 2T-G's, but they are old technology.
If you compare them with a 4A-G (also becoming a bit aged) they look
decidedly primitive. They also work quite well. If you have one in you car I
certainly wouldn't change it for a 4A-G, because of the expense of doing so
Vs modifying what you've already got. From a clean slate - if you've got a
limited budget, then I'd go for the 4A-G because of the greater reliabilty
and ease of servicing. The only differences between the two engines when
puchasing parts is in the valve gear. The 4A-G has twice as many parts, of
course, but only the cams need replacing. (same as the 2T-G)
With a big budget, there is no question - 4A-G. The quality of the parts
available and the amount of air the head can flow makes the question
redundant. You do need the 1800cc crank and flash inlet manifold, but it
will be a better engine than any 2T-G in every way, without qualification.
As I have said in an earlier paragraph, the 4A-G is a good copy of a
full race engine, while the 2T-G is a old push rod design with tassles - the
kind your parents would approve of.
(Not) Looking forward to the onslaught,
Billzilla.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
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Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 07:34:38 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Re: Thin Gaskets for 4A-G
>Now lets try to get the
>ratio up another way. How thick is a 4AG-STD gasket? Is it 1.4mm? Is the
>steel one still available at .8mm.
HKS has 4AG head gaskets available in 0.7, 1.0, 2.0, and 3.0mm. List cost
is $96, $96, $149, and $191 respectively (less 10% from CAP.) TRD _used_
to have 4AG head gaskets in 0.5, 0.8, 1.1, and 1.2mm. The first two are
steel, the third one is carbon, and it doesn't say what the last one is.
Prices _were_ $37, $38, $61.50, and $44 respectively (less 10% if they're
made anymore.) Ok, I see from an old TRD catalog that the 1.2mm is
asbestos. Sorry, I can't find anything that indicates the OEM product's
thickness.
Chris
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Tue, 9 Jan 96 14:22:01 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Bounced
To the list,
Since I didnt get a response to my head gasket note did it get bounced?
Chris do you have a price for the Gasket?
Bruce Connelly
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From: ckkoh@pop.jaring.my
To: mbedford@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 22:07:10 +0000
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Monte,
Thanks for the info. I will consider putting in the 4AGE if I can
find one in decent condition here in Malaysia.
Great to kow that someone's keeping all the clippings on Starlets.
Will contact you if I need them. Thanks for the offer.
C.K.Koh
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Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 09:35:34 +1100 (EST)
From: Justin Simpson
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: hks manifold
Chris, this one is for you but if anyone else knows feel free to but in.
In Oz HKS had (past tense) a turbo kit for the 18rg using twin blow thru
Solex's. Do you know if this kit is still available anywhere and if so do
you know if the exhaust maniflod is for a split pulse turbo. The reason
i'm asking is that i can across a picture of this kit (in an RA 28) in
some old photos and the manifold looked like a good bit of gear for my
present project ie good flow characteristics and placed the turbo in a
good position. Obviously if i can purchase a suitable cast iron manifold
it will save me the trouble of having to make one.
Thanks in advance.
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
Justen Simpson simpson@lake.canberra.edu.au
CRC for Freshwater Ecology, Uni of Canberra, Australia
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
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Date: Tue, 9 Jan 96 16:09:12 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Brett Fraser
Subject: Toasted Celica's: The Final Chapter
Welp its official, the insurance agent wrote off me darlin today ..
For the vehicle and personal damages I get 5000$ CDN + lost wages (couple
hundred bucks)
cant complain .. thats what i wanted to sell it for .. and now when
i return from travelling and do a ton of work to an 85 GTS Coupe itll be the
only one like it in town .. (or perhaps an 87 All-Trac Turbo .. they didnt make
those in coupes tho did they? (kinda dumb))
Brett
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Date: Tue, 09 Jan 1996 17:14:00 -0800 (PST)
From: Adrienne Mora
Subject: HKS Powerflow for SC MR2
To: Toyota Mods
So, where does this fit in my car? Does it fit in the standard place? Is
there another alternative for air flow than having the air coming in the the
drivers side (passenger for US), going around the back of the boot, going
thru the air filter, and then back over to the SCer?
Thanks
Ade
adem@wairc.govt.nz
New Zealand
'86 SC T-Top MR2 ..... M1STR 2
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From: Raikkonen Timo
To: "Toyota-Mods-mailin'list"
Subject: Re: Toyota Starlet
Date: Tue, 09 Jan 96 18:03:00 PST
High there!
Maybe I could be help here...or my friend :) He has done some mods to
his Starlet - it's daily driven in summers but not yerly inspectioned with
that engine...life is so hard here...
I could ask some details from him about his installation - 4A-GE in his
Starlet '81 or '82. He also get wild and turboed the engine - 0.5 bar with
170 hp :), limited slip differential, Bilstein suspension, 15" alloy rims,
TRD, wided (metal) wheelbases etc. Without turbo (with natural
aspirated 4A-GE) Starlet ran 1/4 mile 15.1 sek.
There is also another nice Starlet here in Finland with 2T-G-engine, but
that one I have only seen once, and don't know who owns it, but maybe
I could find out...?
-Timo- (traikkonen@c2000.fi)
- - - - - - -
....Hoping that someone with more knowledge of Starlets will jump in
here.
Cheers,
Peter.
======================================================
Peter Mejak, HP Response Centre, Melbourne, Australia
peterm@aus.hp.com
======================================================
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Date: Tue, 9 Jan 1996 22:24:04 -0600
To: toyota-mods@cyberauto.com
From: mbedford@indiana.edu (Monte Bedford)
Subject: December (etc.) posts and major threads
Greetings,
I have archived all December posts and sorted them into all *major* threads
(my opinion as to what is major and important). So, I have a file for each
major thread (mostly just December, some from August). Also have indexed
December's posts sorted by thread--listing *ALL* threads--in Chronlogical
order. Still continuing to do this as I go along (the ONLY way) but have
not had a chance to sort through Sept., Oct., and Nov. to extract out the
major threads. I intend to do it in time.
No, I haven't written a program to do this--copy and paste on a MAC.
If you want me to send any of the following stuff, please let me know.
Will do it personal e-mail.
*Aug. '95 all posts--from when I joined
*Sept.--all
*Oct. (etc.)
*Nov.
*Dec.
*Index of ALL threads in December--well, maybe I'll just include this below. v
*Tell me the name of a **major** thread in December and I'll send you the file.
Monte
________________________________
Table of Threads for toyota-mods posts_9512, in chronological order:
**Please note that all articles are archived and tabled in order as sent by
Majordomo. For a variety of reasons, some numerical dates, on occasion,
may seem to be out of numerical order, but by no more than one day. If you
have any questions, or would like the ongoing file for a particular thread,
please contact me, Monte Bedford, at . Thank you**
2T->3T hi-perf. tuning? 12/1 (2x), 12/5, /6 (3x), /7
Me/Mine/Mods
85 MR2/4AGE 12/2
88 Altrac/3S-GTE 12/2
84 Corolla AE-86 ("Sprinter")/4AGE 12/10
81 Corolla KE-55S/3T-GTE turbo 12/10
80 Corolla KE-55S/4K 12/10
74 Corolla KE-35/3K 12/10
Sports 1300/3K 12/10
95 Paseo/5EFE 12/11
88 MR2/4A-GZE 12/11
77 Celica (RA23) 12/11
79 Celica Sunchaser/20R 12/11
85 Celica GTS Convertible/22RE 12/11
94 MR2 12/13
89 Tercel DX/3E 12/18
91 MR2 NA/5F-SE 12/24
92 MR2 NA/5F-SE 12/28
84 Starlet 1.3 DX/4K 12/30
83 Sprinter (Corolla Levin) AE86/4A-GEU 12/31
80 Corolla KE55/4K-C 12/31
Kill me now/Aaron's woes/7MGTE short block 12/3, /4 (8x), /5
Magazine-old Corolla 12/4
Injectors for turbo 18RG 12/5 (2x), /13, /14
Mr. Celica meet Mr. Blackice... 12/5 (3x)
Archiving 2T/3T 12/5 (2x)
TRD Alternatives/The Changing TRD/Does TRD Japan have.../TRD Japan Stuff
12/5, /6 (2x), /7 (3x)
86 MR2 light/stumble 12/5, /6
22R w/ 20R ( and head article) 12/5 (3x), /6 (7x), /7
84? Tercel w/3Ak-83J 12/5, /6
2XR rebuild 12/5
20 valve MR2 20/6 (2x), /7 (2x)
Adjustable cam timing gears/DOHC adjustable timing gears--2 or 1?/Timing
Gears/WHO OWNS: Adjustable cam timing gears../Twin Cam variable gears &
timing of/Cam timing
12/6 (3x), /7 (3x), /10, /11, /12 (4x), /13, /15, /16, /17, /18
Ignition Amps 12/6, /7, /8 (2x)
2TC with Jacobs Ignition 12/8
Having a Starter Problem 88 Turbo Altrac 12/8 (3x)
AC and Power Steering with an 18RG 12/11
Sprinter brakes (bill) 12/12
87 MR2 high miles? 12/11, /12
83 Celica with IRS 12/12 (3x)
Mufflers 12/12 (2x), /13
Carbs and Headers for the 2T-C 12/14, /15, /16, /20
Injector flow rate (long post)/ Injectors--the data 12/14 (2x), /15, /19
Spark plugs 12/5, /17, /18 (2x), /19, /20, /28 (2x)
Re: Mods to intake manifold [4AGE] 12/17
Celica Sunchaser 12/16
Starter/Starter on a MK1 12/16 (3x), /17 (4x)
Suspension Techniques 12/17 ( 2x)
100KW motor 12/18
Suspension Techniques 12/17 (2x)
Need carb source 12/17 (2x)
'85 MR2 Suspension 12/18
Header Care/Exhaust theory + a little practice/Trivia question ...
12/18 (2x), /19 (5x), /20 (12x), /21 (6x), /23 (6x), /24 (2x)
Max Torque 12/19
Sounds of Winter driving 12/20
Is it possible? 12/19 (2x), /20
Carb info 12/20, /21 (3x), /22 (2x), /26
Head gaskets 12/23
MR-2 parts 12/26
WTB: 4AGZE motor/RE: turbo for 4AG motor 12/27, /29, /31 (2x)
Need folks to ask local scrapyards for .. 12/28
Ignore that--wrote off Celica tonite 12/28, /29 (2x)
Christmas present 12/29 (3x)
Infoquest 12/29 (2x)
Ok, Im probably jumping the gun here but .. 12/29
We're on the road again! 12/29, /30
Re: Superchargers for 4AGE 12/30
FCD and TVVC Install Complete! 12/31
Cusco sticker on motor 12/31 (2x)
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Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 15:03:27 +1000 (EST)
From: Paul Pyyvaara
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: RE: Head Gaskets (fwd)
Don't think this one made it to the list...
Paul.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 16:11:00 -0800 (PST)
From: Adrienne Mora
To: toyota-mods-owner
Subject: RE: Head Gaskets
Bruce
> How much does it cost to get two of the .5mm's to Australia? I'll take
> .7 if I can. My TRD book only lists .8 steel for the 4A-G and 1.4
asbestos,
> that why I think 1.4 is STD. But if you can get .5 that great should be
good
> for 5 or so HP.
I'm rebuilding a 4AGE (basically stock) for a kit car and would like to know
of the advantages of these head gaskets you are talking about. What
advantages are there? What other easy mods are there?
Thanks heaps
Ade
adem@wairc.govt.nz
New Zealand
'86 SC T-Top MR2
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From: MR24AGZ@aol.com
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 03:11:11 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: HKS Twin charger kit for mr2 sc
Hi,
Does anyone out there know if there is any 'HKS twin charger kit' available?
I was told by HKS this kit has been discontinued, or no longer available in
U.S. If someone knows there is a new or used twin charger kit (stage II or
stage III) out there....please let me know.
Thanks very much,
Kin
MR24AGZ@aol.com
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From: Gary Hong
To: john.limcangco@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, sv1bt@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: Restoring wheels.
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 96 0:47:51 PST
From: "john.limcangco"
>
>OK, I'm in the polishing and cleaning stage -- without taking the wheel
>apart. I polished the the lip of one wheel with rubbing compound, followed by
>polishing compound, then metal polish.... by hand... looks great but took quite
>some time and I think I rubbed my fingers to the bone! I have to get me a die
>grinder like Jack Alford suggested.... =)
>
>Short of repainting the centers, what's the best way to clean stubbort brake
>dust and grime off the wire-like 'spokes'? I realize that I still have to
>remove all the soot before I paint them anyway.... I've tried soap, a
>commercial spray-on wheel cleaner, kerosene, K&N filter cleaner/solvent (!)...
>The dirt just won't budge... I can get some off... but not all. It seems like
>the wheel's previous owner mounted the wheels and _never_ bothered to clean
>it.... If there is someone out there that has a magic conconction that works,
>I'd like to hear about it before I use sandpaper (!)....
>
>Getting deperate,
>
>John Limcangco
John,
Try Quick Silver Wheel cleaner. Enough acid to eat through the brake dust
and grime and then some :).
Actually, I have a bottle may try it on my AL rims on my GTS rims (just one
for kicks).
Gary
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To: "kostas g. d. chryssos "
Cc: toyota-mods
From: "john.limcangco"
Date: 10 Jan 96 8:55:39
Subject: Re: Restoring wheels.
OK, I'm in the polishing and cleaning stage -- without taking the wheel
apart. I polished the the lip of one wheel with rubbing compound, followed by
polishing compound, then metal polish.... by hand... looks great but took quite
some time and I think I rubbed my fingers to the bone! I have to get me a die
grinder like Jack Alford suggested.... =)
Short of repainting the centers, what's the best way to clean stubbort brake
dust and grime off the wire-like 'spokes'? I realize that I still have to
remove all the soot before I paint them anyway.... I've tried soap, a
commercial spray-on wheel cleaner, kerosene, K&N filter cleaner/solvent (!)...
The dirt just won't budge... I can get some off... but not all. It seems like
the wheel's previous owner mounted the wheels and _never_ bothered to clean
it.... If there is someone out there that has a magic conconction that works,
I'd like to hear about it before I use sandpaper (!)....
Getting deperate,
John Limcangco
Manila, Philippines
79 Cressida 18RG
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
To: john limcangco
cc:
From: sv1bt @ compulink.gr ("Kostas G. D. Chryssos ") @ internet
Date: 01/09/96 10:29 PM
Subject: Re: Restoring wheels.
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
>Now for some real work, I'll need to remove the hex-screws that hold the
center
>part of the wheel, polish the lip(s), and repaint the centers.
>
John hi,
I strongly recommend NOT to take the wheels apart by removing the hex-screws.
If you do so you require special balancing procedures and equipment to put
it back together properly. The 3-piece stuff is for marketing purposes
only...do not take for granted that the wheels come apart and put together
so easily. You will end up with totally un-usable worst dangerous to use wheels.
Tru to do all polishing and cleaning as is. Rebalance them after you finish
and put tires on.
___________ ________________ ________
__ ___/__ | / /__< /___ __ )___ __/
_____ \ __ | / / __ / __ __ |__ /
____/ / __ |/ / _ / _ /_/ / _ /
/____/ _____/ /_/ /_____/ /_/
(Kostas G. D. Chryssos Ph.D.)
30,Ikarias str. Glyfada GR16675, Athens, Hellas
Tel: xx-301 9628212, Fax: xx-301 9628539
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 96 11:26:41 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 4AG v's 2TG
Guys,
Its nice to see there is some life in this forum, the problem is I cant
easly respond to your notes from this mainframe interface, If you write to
BCONNELLY@VNET.IBM.COM I can respond like you guys do.
Now for the facts.
1. The 2TG should only be considered at 1920CC or bigger the TRD pistons at
10.5 are this capacity.
2. The asertion was that you couldnt get parts, not true the pistons were
available in volume I have imported more than 5 sets since 1990.
3. I have dynoed all configurations.
4. The 3TG tubo block is safe to 90mm, not so all the early blocks
5. The 2tg at 1600cc is worthless, I've tried up to 13:1 pistons 4AG is better
6. The weakness of the 2TG, is the rod and bolt. They WILL tear through the eye
eyes at more than 8000 IF you use a 3T crank. They WILL NOT if you use at
2T. I have some examples, they usually exit at the engine number.
7. The t series has many easily available grinds (EX ALFA) no need for billets
8. The inlet manifold on the 2TG will crack in time, expecially if you hollow
it out. (as I do). Be ready with the MIG
9. The 2TG valves will mushroom and hammer into the seats if you dont use
harder than standard.
Now thats all the things about the 2T/3TG, you see while its not as modern as
the 4AG but its that capacity upgrade that makes up for it and the overbore is
inexpensive to get. The most common thing is to use a 2TG head on a 3TG turbo
block. If we are locked to 1600CC then, as you say 4 valves beats 2 but in
Victoria it is the under 2 litre sports sedan races I built the engines for
and last time I looked my engine still held the lap record at Philip Island
despite the new FJ20's.
Bruce Connelly
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 96 12:16:14 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Head Gaskets
Chris,
How much does it cost to get two of the .5mm's to Australia? I'll take
.7 if I can. My TRD book only lists .8 steel for the 4A-G and 1.4 asbestos,
that why I think 1.4 is STD. But if you can get .5 that great should be good
for 5 or so HP.
Bruce Connelly
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Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 09:22:20 +1100 (EST)
From: Justin Simpson
To: Bill Sherwood
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: 4AG v's 2TG. Not.
Just thought i would add my 2 cents worth. Obviously physical engine size
may be a restriction in some cases (corolla ?) but where it will fit ie
TA 22 why build a highly stressed 2lt 2tg when an 18rg is a dead easy
conversion. Immediate benefits of 2lt capacity (1968 cc) in standard
form, 47 mm inlet valves 40.5 mm exhausts, plenty of meat if any porting
is required, more torque than any 2tg will produce (for the same dollars
spent), and a bullet proof drive train to back it up (they stick the
steel case five speed behind V8's. In Canberra we have just finished two
18rg's into TA 22 conversions and it is pretty straight forward (the
shifter even came out of the original hole in the trans tunnel. Food for
thought anyway.
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
Justen Simpson simpson@lake.canberra.edu.au
CRC for Freshwater Ecology, Uni of Canberra, Australia
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
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Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 20:11:36 -0500
From: mdowe@wchat.on.ca
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: : 3TG v's 18RG Availability
The biggest problem for the 18RG in Australia these days is
>that the 3TG turbo is numerous at the wreakers and 18RG's are hard to find.
>Perhaps one of you out there should buy the one in Canberra if you have an
>RAXX. Is it any better in the US?
>Bruce
>
We do not have many 18R G or 3T G engines over here(Canada). Very Few
A 4A G is possible but difficult to find at the wreckers.
This brings to mind something that members of the list may be able to help
with. As we have not had the 4A G engine available since 1991 , or the 3S G
since about 1990. We are stuck with sports cars with boring motors. My
Paseo has a 5E FE and gets 45+ MPG (Imperial Gal.). This is great, but I
want power. The lack of parts for this motor is driving me crazy. I have
been trying to find info on the 4E FE and 4E FTE motors, hoping to
interchange some cams, or get an exhaust manifold suited to a turbo.
Anyone who knows of a way to order parts for these engines, or used
engines/spares, please post, or mail me.
What transmission or transaxle will a 3T bolt to?
Mike Dowe
mdowe@wchat.on.ca
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Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 11:12:29 +1000 (EST)
From: Paul Pyyvaara
To: bconnelly@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: 2TG v's 4AG
On Thu, 11 Jan 1996 bconnelly@VNET.IBM.COM wrote:
> 5. Oh you may all wonder why I'm still not racing these things and have retired
> to an AE-86 and 4A-G. I've run into the greatest performance barrier......
> marriage...and the wife said....heed this point well all you would be
> Toyota modifiers.
Hehehe - I did the opposite - asked my wife if she wanted to go racing :)
She is hooked and enjoys blasting around in small club events...
Paul.
--
Paul Pyyvaara - paulp@dstc.edu.au
Research Scientist - Distributed Systems Technology Centre
B O N D U N I V E R S I T Y, QLD, 4229, AUSTRALIA
Phone:(+61 7 55 953 324) Fax:(+61 7 55 953 320)
WWW : http://www.dstc.Bond.edu.au/~paulp/
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Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 19:38:00 -0800 (PST)
From: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)"
Subject: RE: More Toyota engine pictures
To: Matti Kalalahti
Cc: "Zublin, Bryan (SD-MS)" ,
Matti,
More pictures on the way:
9r_2.jpg 9R power curve and stats
10r_2.jpg 10R engine in vehicle
10r_3.jpg 10R power curve and stats
18rg_2.jpg 18RG and 18RGU stats
18rgeu_2.jpg 18RGEU power curve and stats
2tg_3.jpg 2TG power curve and stats
2tgeu_3.jpg 2TGEU (up to year 1978) power curve and stats
2tgeu_4.jpg 2TGEU (after year 1978) stats
Bryan Zublin
bzublin@gi.com
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Date: Wed, 10 Jan 1996 21:39:06 -0700
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: di88429@goodnet.com (James Collins)
Subject: 2TG and general questions
okay a couple more questions,
1. if i had a cold air box running to outside air how would i keep water
from rain entering it? admittedly in arizona this would probably not be too
much of a problem but just wondering.
2. how much heavier is a mid 70's corolla than a k-series starlet? no need
to be exact, estimations would be cool.
3. how would you turbocharge something with dual sidedraft carbs, i.e. how
would you make sure the same amount of boost would go into each cylinder?
4. for you people in australia as you have more access to 2TG stuff, how
available is stuff to rebuild the head, mostly like valves, valve springs,
belts, cam gears and around how much?
5. i've been thinking about buying either a mid 70's corolla with a 2TC and
putting on a 2TG head which i already have with dual carbs and cams, or
buying starlet and shoehorning either a 4AG or 2TG into it i'm leaning to
getting a corolla but i wanted some input from members of the group.
6. to bill sherwood and bruce connelly what modifications to a 2TG would you
recommend doing first? my goal is to have a fast streeter with some
autocrossing possibilities in the future.
thanks,
james
********************************************
* James Collins *
* University of Arizona *
* E-mail: di88429@goodnet.com *
* collinsj@ccit.arizona.edu *
********************************************
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 10:51:06 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 3TG v's 18RG
To the list,
Now that I've passified the 4A-G owners you 18RG guys start up! Well I havent
ever really built any 18RG's just rebuilt them. Many people claim they are
bullet proof in the bottom end, but my experience has been otherwise. They
seem to blow bottom ends and have oil starvation problems. To fix this some
went dry sump. One of the happiest times in my life was when I passed Steve
Howard in his 18RG fibre glass TA22 with no expense sparred 18RG in my ROAD
going TA22 with 190BHP 2TG despite his claim (back by dyno record) that he had
as much at the wheels than I did at the f/wheel. I remember we lapped Calder
at 1:11 and 1:12's in those days. I can only speak from my experience these
engines at this time did not deliver, the 3TG's did.
However some of you out there may not have seen these bottom end issues or
have solved them. The biggest problem for the 18RG in Australia these days is
that the 3TG turbo is numerous at the wreakers and 18RG's are hard to find.
Perhaps one of you out there should buy the one in Canberra if you have an
RAXX. Is it any better in the US?
Bruce
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 11:18:06 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 2TG v's 4AG
Matti Kalalahti and others,
I'm still having trouble with the replys if you want to carry this conversation
on priviatlt try auibmbmc@ibmmail.com, I things will be better there.
For those that have asked including Matti Kalalahti.
1. Tried 2T 3T rods + shot peened + linished no good at high RPM
2. Tried 3T Turbo, the eye is in a different place, you have to drill holes
in the bearings. There are stronger and dont usually take out the serial
number but stretch and let the bearing rotate. Oh well at least you get
back to the pits with a rattle rather than being towed.
3. I've tried the 222 and other heads but always chucked the Turbo ones
in the rubbish (didnt need them as the heads never wore out. Yes there were
small and large valves but the main difference was the ribbing in the Yam
head.
4. Cant remember the torque (it was 1980 to 1990 after all!)
5. Oh you may all wonder why I'm still not racing these things and have retired
to an AE-86 and 4A-G. I've run into the greatest performance barrier......
marriage...and the wife said....heed this point well all you would be
Toyota modifiers.
Bruce
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Date: Thu, 11 Jan 96 12:01:42 EST
From: chris@lexis-nexis.com (Chris Schrimsher)
To: supras@cyberspace.cyberauto.com, toyota-l@cyberspace.cyberauto.com,
Subject: Seat Heaters on current generation Supra
I posted this last week but have no replies. I'll try once more.
Is there any opinion on seat heaters? What about you folks up north?
I have US spec '93.5 Supra and have been looking into the prospect of
installing seat heaters in. I know they are an option for the Canadian
spec Supra and they are shown in the Toyota Repair Manual.
Right now I am seeking knowledge and advice from the list in an effort to
see if this is worth pursuing.
The big question is, is the wiring harness already in place? If so, it would
just be a matter of installing the switch and the heaters and plugging them in.
I could be wrong considering I have no knowledge of auto electronics.
Every time my butt hits that cold leather I think about this.
So, has anyone ever worked with seat heaters?
Chris
'93.5 NA Supra
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From: looit@cs_srv1.mh.dpi.qld.gov.au
Subject: Re: 2TG v's 4AG
To: paulp@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Paul Pyyvaara)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 07:37:35 +1000 (EST)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
>
> Hehehe - I did the opposite - asked my wife if she wanted to go racing :)
> She is hooked and enjoys blasting around in small club events...
>
I see the problem here now, correct me if I'm wrong but Bruce cannot race
because his wife won't let him, and Paul cannot race because his wife won't let
him (have the car)!! 8-)
Anyway, its simple enough then, don't buy a race car or don't get married.
That is why I just bought a MX5 (91 BRG) and it will make its racing (if you
can call a hillclimb that) debut this year sometime hopefully. Then it is off
to Targa Tasmania in 1997 (I hope) to join my Uncle's (Schnitzer BMW) two car
team of a Porsche GT1 (new model) and Nissan (X1 I think). They are going there
to win, I am going there to have fun and finish.
don't worry, the 4AGE is still in the garage (I drove that today actually and
that motor and the clutch after the MX5 meant I stalled twice on takeoffs) and
yes, the 4AGE is still a fair bit more powerful than the MX5 (though the mods
are starting).
TEd
(who has to change his .sig now to reflect the second baby, and see..no wife!!
wife != racing, wife != racing, wife != racing, wife != racing, wife != racing,
I'll get that into my head soon....doh!!)
--
#############################################################################
SSSS X X TTTTTT CCCCC
S S X X TT C ted@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C looit@dpi.qld.gov.au
SSSS XX ---- TT C
S S X X TT C
SSSS X X TT CCCCC "TALK TO ME" or ...
# Coma?? Coma doesn't hurt, I fall into a coma all the time...zzzzzzz....!!! #
^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: : 3TG v's 18RG Availability
To: mdowe@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 01:53:59 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> What transmission or transaxle will a 3T bolt to?
T-series engines are all longitudionally mounted, so
transmissions = RWD only. Any W5* (W55, W58, W50 and similar),
T50, T40. The W series ones last better with high-power
engines (150hp+), W58 reportedly being ok above 300hp and
W50 being used with V8's.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: 2TG and general questions
To: di88429@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (James Collins)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 02:04:38 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> 1. if i had a cold air box running to outside air how would i keep water
> from rain entering it? admittedly in arizona this would probably not be too
> much of a problem but just wondering.
Rain shouldn't be a problem, but the splashed water from deep pools
maybe. Try to avoid any large holes allowing such splashes to get
sraight to the filter, and avoid such pools if possible!
> 2. how much heavier is a mid 70's corolla than a k-series starlet? no need
> to be exact, estimations would be cool.
You should look at my WWW pages...
KE10 750kg
KE20 780kg
KE30 870kg
KE70 850kg
I'll let those with Starlets come up with the rest...
I *think* a Starlet would be in the 600-750kg neighborhood.
> 3. how would you turbocharge something with dual sidedraft carbs, i.e. how
> would you make sure the same amount of boost would go into each cylinder?
That shouldn't be a problem. Just construct the piping as symmetrically
as possible.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 18:41:05 -0600
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: fjo@escape.ca (Fred Oberbuchner)
Subject: H*LP wanted from supercharged MR2 owners!!!
H*LP!!!
I am trying to wade through the confusion in my head and not having much luck!
CAP/Chris has been helpful enough to source a S/C from an 88 MR2 (4AGZE) for
my Corolla GTS (4AGE) but now I am confused on how this install will go.
What I need to find is someone who has a supercharged MR2 and could email me
photo's or email/fax me sections of the shop manual which show how the
supercharger is attached to the motor. The questions I have are several:
1) does the 4AGE have the correct mounting holes for the supercharger
2) is the intake manifold on the 4AGZE the same as on the 4AGE
3) where is the throttle body in relation to the supercharger/intake
runners/head
4) is there a "blow-off valve" and if so, where is it located
5) are the injectors different from the 4AGE (anyone got the part#'s on 4AGZE)
6) is there still the TVIS or has it been deleted due to the s/c
7) it would be helpful if someone could describe the order in which air
passes through the various components to help my stupidity (ie: air filter
-> s/c -> blow-off valve -> throttle body -> intake runners -> TVIS -> head)
8) any S/C MR2 owners want to make themselves available for lots of dumb
questions via email?
Any and all help is appreciated!
Thanks,
Fred
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: 2TG
To: bconnelly@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 03:30:16 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> As for the transmition I have to correct one thing the T50 IS good for more
> than 150BHP (much more). In fact we still have the standard one at 205BHP, in
> fact one of the reasons we chose the 2TG was the light T50 against the R
> series heavy ones.Now it IS true they dont last as long but if you buy a good
> used one or replace all the bearings, they usually last a season or two.
> With the A series there is less torque hence the T50 lasts longer (its not
> quite the same as the earlier unit).
I was thinking about modified 3T-GTEU's with 250-350Nm with respect to T50
longevity. They won't last too well in that use. Rebuild every year
is not good in my books if the stock 3T-GTEU gearbox (similar to W55?)
seems to last several years ;)
These alloy case W5* boxes are lighter than W50.
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 22:23:00 -0600 (CST)
From: Craig A Terlau
To: James Collins
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: Re: 2TG and general questions
From the SCCA IT specs:
71-74 Corolla 1.6/SR5 1950 pounds
75-79 Corolla 1.6/SR5 2100 pounds
81-83 Starlet 1.3 1670 pounds
84-85 Corolla GTS 1.6 2030 pounds
85-86 MR2 1.6 2190 pounds
Craig.
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: done; a non-engine mod, for a change
To: btptan@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Benjamin T.P. Tan)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:40:13 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> There I was trying to decide which lights come on for what (bad ASCII =
> art coming up)
>
> Left
> +----+---+----+---+---+
> | | | | | |
> | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 |
> | | | | | |
> +----+---+----+---+---+
> Org Rd Rd Rd Wt
>
> Ok #1 goes to the indicator and #5 is the reverse light, now for 2 3 4. =
> Which is/are the brake light(s) and which is the rear light..
>
> Finally decided on 3 for the light and 2+4 for the brakes. I've yet to =
> figure out if this is the norm. Anyone?
Having exactly similar taillights:
2 is for light, 3 brakes, 4 fogs. (I'm not 100% sure which way 2/3 were).
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: Matti Kalalahti
Subject: Re: H*LP wanted from supercharged MR2 owners!!!
To: fjo@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Fred Oberbuchner)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:51:48 +0200 (EET)
Cc: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com (Toyota-Mods mailing list)
> 5) are the injectors different from the 4AGE (anyone got the part#'s on 4AGZE)
Yes, 4A-GZE injectors are considerably larger, 365cc/min.
See the injector list on my WWW pages and try to determine
which 4A-GE you have, most have aroudn 200cc/min.
You'll need to upgrade them.
Does anyone have a source of reasonably priced injectors?
--
Matti Kalalahti | Toyota Carina Coupe GT-T TwinCam Turbo '82
k124476@ee.tut.fi | RWD * IRS * 3T-GTEU * 195+-15hp@4200-6700rpm
A Huge Evergrowing WWW Home Page * http://proffa.cc.tut.fi/~k124476/
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 96 11:42:51 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: 2TG
James and all those others in the US,
If you have a 2TG why not do the cheapest thing and go and bolt in a 3T. Last
time I looked the 1920CC TRD pistons were available for it (ex Wisco). The
T series head was great even in the pushrod with some head work.
As for the transmition I have to correct one thing the T50 IS good for more
than 150BHP (much more). In fact we still have the standard one at 205BHP, in
fact one of the reasons we chose the 2TG was the light T50 against the R
series heavy ones.Now it IS true they dont last as long but if you buy a good
used one or replace all the bearings, they usually last a season or two.
With the A series there is less torque hence the T50 lasts longer (its not
quite the same as the earlier unit).
So, james surely 3T's are cheap, the crank and rods are good.As for the grind
its got to be cheap to weld the cam and grind.
Bruce Connelly
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From: "Benjamin T.P. Tan"
To: "'toyota-mods@cyberauto.com'"
Subject: done; a non-engine mod, for a change
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 11:47:13 +-800
Yo,=20
Just thought I'd keep the group updated on what's happening with my =
purple monster. Well, I got kissed on the ass (ahem) by a taxi 2 weeks =
ago that broke my right tail lights. And as one might expect, it ain't =
easy/cheap to get replacement TA40 tail lights these days (at least not =
around here).
So here I am rummaging around the scrap yards looking for a TA40 w/o =
broken lights till I finally giveup. Next alternative, grab some other =
model / make's tail lights and somehow get it in... now what model has =
interesting tail lights.. Yo! what's that over there, that looks good.. =
'85 BMW 320i.
Ok so they're a little long. Anyway, out with the sheet metal cutter and =
stuff... had to snip away about 3" of the back. Finally got them in. =
Then there was the electrical mess (well not as bad as the physical =
mess).=20
There I was trying to decide which lights come on for what (bad ASCII =
art coming up)
Left
+----+---+----+---+---+
| | | | | |
| 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 |
| | | | | |
+----+---+----+---+---+
Org Rd Rd Rd Wt
Ok #1 goes to the indicator and #5 is the reverse light, now for 2 3 4. =
Which is/are the brake light(s) and which is the rear light..
Finally decided on 3 for the light and 2+4 for the brakes. I've yet to =
figure out if this is the norm. Anyone?
Anyway, pictures are on the way to Chris.=20
ben
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From: bconnelly@vnet.ibm.com
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 96 15:12:14 EDT
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
Subject: T50
Guys,
Last time I looked the 3tG turbo box was a T50 with a larger input shaft,
we tried these with the same results as other T50's. The gears were the
same and second and third went but maybe things are different elsewhere. You
see we didnt legally get any of this stuff (not even the 2tg) but because we
are so close to Japan and right hand drive there were plenty of motors and
front halves of Celicas. I must also say Australia has a history of making
its own,Holinger in Melbourne has for years made any type of straight cut
gear ratio you ever wanted for the T50 current price is around $350 Aus
per ratio.
Bruce
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To: toyota-mods ,
From: Steven Jackson/CAM/Lotus
Date: 12 Jan 96 18:02:51 EST
Subject: My "88 MR2 SC for Sale
I'm selling my '88 supercharged MR2. I've simply come into the need for a
larger car for everyday transportation. I've owned the car for two years and
have driven it approximately 25K miles during that time. It's spend half it's
life with me with garaging both at home and work.
Details:
1988 SC MR2
83K miles
very good to excellent condition
T-roof
5-speed
Pearl blue mica metallic with blue interior
All original spec
All original ancillaries
Very straight body, never been hit
Yokohama AVS Intermediates
Redline 75-80W NS in the E51 transaxle
Mobile One used through my ownership, I'm second owner
Sale of car includes a set of very fresh Bridgestone Blizzak snow tires on
steel wheels, factory service manual, factory electrical service book, factory
body manual, all other spare parts (mostly small things, like service items).
In the Boston, Massachusetts area
Asking $8000 US dollars, or best offer. Email me if you're interested.
- Steven Jackson
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Date: Fri, 12 Jan 96 18:50:25 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Brett Fraser
Subject: Celica All-Trac Turbo's - Info?
Called my local dealer to day with the hopes of finding a ball park price on
an 87 All-Trac Turbo .. Now I know ive seen one in that body style .. and Im
really not fond of the 91 etc. body style .. He tells me (and perhaps he's
wrong)
that his book doesnt list that year .. and suggested perhaps it was an american
car ..
So heres where my info request comes in .. anyone know what years the all-tracs
were sold in canada and if the 87-? style is very rare in the states? Im really
interested in at least trying one of these on for size..
Also .. could someone tell me the subscript address for Todd Haverstocks
Toyota-L
.. was on before but it would seem I was disconnected some time ago..
Brett - The desperately seeking 87 Celica Canadian.
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From: Michael Kronvold
To: "'Brett Fraser'" ,
Subject: RE: Celica All-Trac Turbo's - Info?
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 1996 09:11:29 -0600
>Called my local dealer to day with the hopes of finding a ball park price on
>an 87 All-Trac Turbo .. Now I know ive seen one in that body style .. and Im
>really not fond of the 91 etc. body style .. He tells me (and perhaps he's
>wrong)
>that his book doesnt list that year .. and suggested perhaps it was an american
>car ..
>So heres where my info request comes in .. anyone know what years the all-tracs
>were sold in canada and if the 87-? style is very rare in the states? Im really
>interested in at least trying one of these on for size..
>Brett - The desperately seeking 87 Celica Canadian.
all Celica All-Trac Turbos are hard to come by, and even harder
to find one that hasn't been heavily abused. I did find one, a
black '90 turbo, dyno'd at 260bhp, not sure of the mods done.
But it has 80k miles on it, almost all of which are hard street
miles. I didn't ask for the asking price. This guy weighed 400
pounds easily, had several turbo charged imports in his garage as
well as a couple motorcycles (I dunno how he fit on a superbike
tho, I think he used them as props for his business as a
photographer.)
Anyhow, this is one of two All-Trac Turbos that I have EVER seen
sitting still. And the only one that was even close to for sale.
( he wasn't actively seeking a buyer, I was just curious and he
said he'd consider it if the price was right.)
-Mike
--
Michael Kronvold, Network Administrator, Addison Machine Engineering
(708) 543-9191 424 Interstate Road Addison, Illinois 60101 USA
Toyota Supra Turbo, anything else is merely transportation.
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Date: Sat, 13 Jan 96 12:19:42 PST
From: wg%rm763a@riem.com (Wayne R. Graves)
Subject: RE: Celica All-Trac Turbo's - Info?
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
I've never seen an 87' Altrac, I have an 88 and I have seen alot of them here
around the San Francisco Bay area and in northern California.
Wayne
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From: "Scott, Dan"
To: ToyMods
Subject: Re: Celica All-Trac Turbo's - Info?
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 96 13:59:00 PST
Brett:
The turbo Celica's came out in Canada in '88 and they are called "Celica 4WD
Turbo". If the car you are looking at says All-trac then it is an American
car. The cars are the same except for the name. By far the majority of the
Celica turbos that I have seen have been the '88 year. The '90s version is
very rare here in Vancouver but I have seen several of the '80's version
,including mine ; ) around. The '90s version has better suspension, 10 more
Hp and a major stereo with CD. The '96 model (GT4) is only available in
Japan, Europe and Australia and has 255 hp and is 500 lbs lighter. There are
other differences but since we can't get them I won't get you worked up
about them. If the car you are looking at is in good shape it will be a nice
car for you. If it isn't then it will be an expensive car to repair. You can
e-mail me any other questions you may have if you want to, or send them to
the list cuz there are a few of us Celica 4WD/All-trac owners lurking here.
Dan Scott
'88 Celica 4WD turbo 149k Kms
DScott@ea.com
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Date: Sat, 13 Jan 96 19:29:33 PST
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: Brett Fraser
Subject: RE: Celica All-Trac Turbo's - Info?
At 12:19 PM 1/13/96 PST, you wrote:
>I've never seen an 87' Altrac, I have an 88 and I have seen alot of them here
>around the San Francisco Bay area and in northern California.
> Wayne
>
Ok .. so maybe Im wrong bout being an 87 .. the 88 *IS* the body style
before that of the 90-94?'s though right? Not as rounded etc..
Brett
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Date: Sat, 13 Jan 1996 22:42:29 -0500
To: toyota-mods@cyberspace.cyberauto.com
From: cmyer@cyberauto.com (Christopher Myer)
Subject: Rebuild Shopping List (22R Rebuild Thread)
--=====================_821600804==_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Well, it's been a little while since I've done anything with the
rebuild, so I thought I'd write a few more things. It's way too cold
to work on motors (anything under 60F is way too cold for this Florida
Boy), so I thought I'd work on a shopping list of things I have recently
bought or need to buy for the rebuild effort. I figured those of you
thinking about doing the same sort of effort might be interested in
what it might cost.
I'm going to both paste in and attach a listing of parts. Those of you
who get the attachment (most of you) will find that the file is already
well formatted, although a little wide. Those of you who have to look at
the one I'm pasting in below because your mailer doesn't support attach-
ments may find that you need to cut, paste and format in an editor. In
any case, I hope you'll find the information useful.
A few notes about the list. I wanted to show a retail cost vs CAP price
comparison, but in some cases I didn't know the retail pricing. I just
guesstimated those. Also, I reserve the right to give people who are
nice to me even better prices (who says you can't buy friends!)
Let's review the list:
40mm Mikuni Side Draft Carburetor Kit. I (*shame*) still have the old
price sheet, so these are guesstimates of the cost of the entire sidedraft
kit--carbs, manifolds, linkage, and additional parts. I was fortunate
enough not to have to pay so much. I got a set of 40mm Weber's in a
phenomenal deal arranged for me by list member John Lee (Thanks, John!)
that came with my 18RG head. I just had to buy 2 rebuild kits, the intake,
and the linkage, greatly reducing my output. Keep your eyes open and
look for deals like this. You can find old carburetors around if you
look for them. Try pawn shops and always browse through those little
"Thrifty Nickle" classified newspapers. Good carburetors don't go bad,
and you can buy any individual part you may need. AVOID carburetors that
have been rebuilt/dismantled since they were last successfully operated.
This might be a nightmare!
Vacuum Accumulator Manifold: These are sold by both Downey and NWOR
for sidedraft carb setups. I am not sure if they are necessary or
not, but the basic principle makes sense. I like the Downey one
because it routes the nasty black goop that comes out of the PCV valve
into all 4 intakes, as opposed to just dumping it into one of them.
NWOR's unit has an outlet for the vacuum advance line. Downey's unit
specifically states that you should _not_ run a line from this to the
distributor, because it is manifold vacuum and not ported vacuum.
I'm going to call Keith at AEM next week and get his opinion. I'm
open to anyone elses input here on TM as well.
A/C Bracket Kit: A/C Compressor mounts to the stock intake manifold,
which I won't have anymore. Gotta have that A/C in FLA!
Inner/Outer Valve Springs: You can really dump a ton of money on these,
but I'm going to just buy a fresh set of Beck-Arnley (OEM) outers, and
the Iskendarian inners, and not worry about different retainers or having
the spring seats machined. Some folks will remember that I just used a
set of Nissan 24Z stock double valve springs on the race engine. I
never had a bit of problem with these, so I expect these will work ok.
When I get them in I'll test the seat pressure and post that to the list.
I want to stay at or under 130 psi. This is more true now that Jeff at
Toyz Unlimited told me about the tendency he's seen for 2xR valves to
break at the lock recess with high seat pressures and high lift cams.
Don't want to suck a broken valve into the cylinder!
Header: Yes, a large tube Doug Thorley Tri-Y. Yes, I know I may suffer
some at low rpm ranges, but I am not a rock crawler. I think it will be
an excellent combination for the intake manifold that I'm running. BTW,
I was able to pick up a BUNCH of DT headers from TRD in that year-end
sale. I need to sell them ASAP! They're all 2xR truck headers, 75-92,
2wd, 4wd, carb, efi. Let me know if you or your loved ones need one of
these--I can't afford to hang onto them.
Exhaust: DynoMax SuperTurbo system. BTW, no vehicle inspections in my
city/county/state. Do you suppose Chris will spend the bucks for a low
resistance cat or just install a cheater pipe? Who, me?
Wiseco Forged Pistons: TRD lists these as 10.5:1 in one place and
10.3:1 in another. NWOR and Downey list them as 10:1. Take your pick.
I figure that after cutting the head down a little bit, I'll have about
10.5:1. 92.5mm size (There is also a 94mm flat-top if you have the
late-model 22R head--2.5 liters!)
Regrind Camshaft: I don't have the specs o